# About Euthanasiast's suspension. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 9, 2008, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333 "2008-12-09T00:50:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/41 "2008-12-09T14:31:19Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > Crap. missed the edit. > > My coding is screwed up, hope I don’t get suspended! Fixed. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/42 "2008-12-09T14:39:25Z")
Not to ride one of my favorite hobby-horses again, but I find it a mark of integrity when anyone in a position of power bends over triple-backwards to avoid abusing that power. If **Lynn** is a big fan of PP (which I don’t know, one way or the other) it would be very much to her credit if she would allow a poster to rag on PP far beyond what she would permit if said poster were attacking the KKK or the neo-Nazi Party, which I would imagine to be considerably far. IRL, she might even be obliged to recuse herself from judging a PP-related post, if she actually had connections or a history of supporting PP, (asking an anti-PP mod, or better yet a neutral one, to make that call, while continuing to post from her own personal perspective) and I wish we saw anything like that RL standard among the mods and admins here. It’s sadly rare. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/43 "2008-12-09T14:41:28Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It’s not just the tighty righties. This suspension looks very, very political to me, too - and I think Planned Parenthood is the best thing since sliced bread. Not because they deserved to get panned for the actions of one employee, but because lots of organizations get panned for the actions of one or two employees and we don’t call _that_ trolling. He got suspended for his reaction to Lynn’s moderation, not because he’s a reactionary douchebag. That’s where the issue is, but political hay is made when the oppertunity presents itself, as evidenced by some of the folk in this thread. regardless of the topic in the thread, I do think he was trolling. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/44 "2008-12-09T14:43:18Z")
> [@Gfactor](#): > > Fixed. No, I don’t think so. It still says “member” not “suspended”. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/45 "2008-12-09T14:44:21Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It’s not just the tighty righties. This suspension looks very, very political to me, too - and I think Planned Parenthood is the best thing since sliced bread. Not because they deserved to get panned for the actions of one employee, but because lots of organizations get panned for the actions of one or two employees and we don’t call _that_ trolling. Correct. I have no particular heartburn with suspending or banning someone for the lash-back to the moderator. I have a great deal of heartburn for declaration that this type of thread is “trolling,” when the precise tactic has been tolerated against other subjects since at least 1999. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/46 "2008-12-09T14:46:39Z")
I was critical of Planned Parenthood in that thread. I’d better watch my back. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/47 "2008-12-09T14:56:40Z")
> [@TwistofFate](#): > > He got suspended for his reaction to Lynn’s moderation, not because he’s a reactionary douchebag. That’s where the issue is, but political hay is made when the oppertunity presents itself, as evidenced by some of the folk in this thread. > > regardless of the topic in the thread, I do think he was trolling. Well, in a currently active thread about police brutality in New York, **Boyo Jim** makes the following post - > [@](#): > > think NYPD is going for a “signature” form of police brutality. Some cops tase. Some cops beat with rubber hoses. NYPD - sodomy. > > “NYPD. Watch your ass!” [Cite.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10547153&postcount=11) He does not give the number of cops involved, and makes no mention that they were suspended. Was he trolling? Should he be warned? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/48 "2008-12-09T14:59:16Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > Not to ride one of my favorite hobby-horses again, but I find it a mark of integrity when anyone in a position of power bends over triple-backwards to avoid abusing that power. If **Lynn** is a big fan of PP (which I don’t know, one way or the other) it would be very much to her credit if she would allow a poster to rag on PP… Reminds me of what a friend of mine, a professional comedy writer, said years ago, “Lots of people will tell you that they have a good sense of humor, but the only ones that do are those that can laugh at the beliefs closest to their heart.” ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/49 "2008-12-09T15:02:12Z")
The problem w/the thread title, IMHO, wasn’t that it went after PP the organization, but that it contained a material falsehood. Neither PP nor the nurse hid a rape of a 13 year old girl. What was clear when you read the OP was that a 20 year old falsely claimed she was 13 year old female sexually active w/a 30 year old male. Crap. Forgot the main thing - edited to add: So, yea, as far as I can tell, the thread title was a trollish activity (since the OP knew that it was false). However, on the third hand, the posts he was suspended for - over reaction from the staff. again, MHO. ---
**Author:** ![fisha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@fisha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fisha)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/50 "2008-12-09T15:03:14Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > I can’t believe I’m posting this, but.. > > I agree with **Bricker**. That thread reads to me like **Lynn** got her panties in a twist about a near and dear, and threw down the troll card. **Euthanasiast** stood his ground and threw some shit as might be expected in the Pit. He even admitted his error in the thread title. That should have been the end of it, but **Lynn** had to defend her action of dropping the t-bomb so she gerrymandered off into some bullshit technicality and suspended him. Exactly. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/51 "2008-12-09T15:31:06Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Well, in a currently active thread about police brutality in New York, **Boyo Jim** makes the following post - [Cite.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10547153&postcount=11) He does not give the number of cops involved, and makes no mention that they were suspended. Was he trolling? Should he be warned? > > Regards, > Shodan Because exaggeration for for comedic effect is exactly the same as intention to mislead. gotcha. that’s bullshit reasoning and you know it. ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/52 "2008-12-09T15:35:14Z")
I really don’t get this. Being in the UK, I’ve never heard of PP. They seem to be almost unanimously highly thought of. Over here, if a highly regarded organisation has a bad apple, it would be drawn to our attention. In a nutshell, as I understand it, a YouTube video puports to show an employee of PP ignoring the fact that her underage client has said that an adult male has had sex with her. **Euthanasiast** saw that video and was outraged, as I see it, that that employee was content to ignore what is certainly an immoral, and probably is an illegal act. So, he started a Pit thread titled ‘Planned parenthood hides rape of 13 year-old girl’. I’d say that that is a succinct summation of the video. The very nature of a title is that it is an abbreviation of the post. I don’t know that anyone creating a title would study it \*that \*carefully: it’s got to be only half a dozen words. As the title stands, by inference, all of PP is being accused. Just a using a little bit of common sense would suggest that every single member of the organisation being culpable would be unlikely; so it’s likely to mean that one - or a few - members were guilty. Which is the case. In Ed Zotti’s announcement of the suspension, he gives the reason as being > [@](#): > > “By subscribing to the Straight Dope Message Board you agree to abide by the rules above and **to submit to their interpretation and enforcement** by our moderators and editors.” (bolding mine) As I understand that, it means that you must not answer back or defy the enforcement. That is what submit means, isn’t it? If so, **Euthanasiast** clearly broke that rule - because, boy, did he react against it. Whether that is a fair or just rule is another issue. In explanation of the suspension, Ed goes on to qualify the above rule by saying that the accused can respond in a number of ways. I must admit that _I_ wasn’t aware of that refinement. May be **Euthanasiast** wasn’t either. In the heat of the moment, I would have thought an instant reply was understandable. In the SD registration agreement, Ed Zotti defines trolling as > [@](#): > > purposely inflammatory remarks Now, this is where it may get down to interpretation, but I really can’t see where **Euthanasiast** was purposely inflammatory. I believe he thought he had a genuine gripe, and expressed it. I think he was upset at what went on in that video. I can’t see where those feelings did not seem to be genuinely held. So, for not submitting, he must be found guilty. I don’t like it, but that is the published rule, and he broke it. Trolling: I don’t think so, but YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/53 "2008-12-09T15:54:50Z")
> [@NineToTheSky](#): > > I really don’t get this. > > Being in the UK, I’ve never heard of PP. They seem to be almost unanimously highly thought of. I’m sure such unanimity is to be found here on the SDMB, but Planned Parenthood is for better or worse a controversial organization, both for the work they do and for the tactics they engage in. ---
**Author:** ![TwistofFate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@TwistofFate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwistofFate)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/54 "2008-12-09T15:58:41Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > I’m sure such unanimity is to be found here on the SDMB, but Planned Parenthood is for better or worse a controversial organization, both for the work they do and for the tactics they engage in. Actual tactics or the made up shit like the youtube video that started all this? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/55 "2008-12-09T15:59:02Z")
> [@NineToTheSky](#): > > I really don’t get this. > > Being in the UK, I’ve never heard of PP. They seem to be almost unanimously highly thought of. Over here, if a highly regarded organisation has a bad apple, it would be drawn to our attention. But that was the problem. **Lynn** did not want this to be drawn to public attention. This is not the first time Planned Parenthood has violated the parental notification laws - they were fined $50,000 back in 2005 for doing this. But abortion is a sacred cow on the SDMB, and those who are fanatically opposed to any restriction on abortion, at any time, for any reason, will lunge at any excuse to shut off discussion the instant it starts to tend against them. Planned Parenthood was looking bad. It was on video. The nurse in question, as part of her duties and acting as a paid agent of Planned Parenthood, obviously conspired to violate the laws against statutory rape and parental notification. In any thread of that sort, there will be a clamor of voices all saying “there’s no debate here - everyone stop posting!” and seeking any excuse, however flimsy, to invalidate the topic. It happened that one of the voices in the locked thread was someone who has the power to make damn sure there _was_ no debate. > [@](#): > > In Ed Zotti’s announcement of the suspension, he gives the reason as being > > > [@](#): > > > > “By subscribing to the Straight Dope Message Board you agree to abide by the rules above and to submit to their interpretation and enforcement by our moderators and editors.” > > (bolding mine) > As I understand that, it means that you must not answer back or defy the enforcement. That is what submit means, isn’t it? If so, **Euthanasiast** clearly broke that rule - because, boy, did he react against it. Whether that is a fair or just rule is another issue. No, this is more bullshit they pulled out of their ass - there are any number of examples of moderators explicitly telling posters to post their complaints about mod action in the Pit. **Lynn** tried some bullshit; **Euthanasiast** wouldn’t roll over for it, so she suspended him just to show who holds the whip hand. > [@](#): > > In the SD registration agreement, Ed Zotti defines trolling as Now, this is where it may get down to interpretation, but I really can’t see where **Euthanasiast** was purposely inflammatory. I believe he thought he had a genuine gripe, and expressed it. I think he was upset at what went on in that video. I can’t see where those feelings did not seem to be genuinely held. And this is the trump card they pull out when they have no other excuse - the mods have magic mind-reading powers and can tell what you meant by everything. If they don’t like what you say, they shut it off. SOP. They like their own ignorance better than other people’s. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/56 "2008-12-09T16:00:15Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > I’m sure such unanimity is to be found here on the SDMB, but Planned Parenthood is for better or worse a controversial organization, both for the work they do and for the tactics they engage in. Yes, they seem to have a lot of support here. And All I know about them is what I’ve read in that thread. Part of my puzzlement at the accusations of trolling was that if they are so universally loved, why would anyone troll about them. But if they are controversial… ---
**Author:** ![Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/57 "2008-12-09T16:05:03Z")
Taking the video at face value, I don’t believe that the thread title was even all that inaccurate, to be honest. Perhaps the banning was for missing a couple of words out of the title: “PP willing to hide rape of 13 year old girl”. ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/58 "2008-12-09T16:09:27Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > But that was the problem. **Lynn** did not want this to be drawn to public attention. > > This is not the first time Planned Parenthood has violated the parental notification laws - they were fined $50,000 back in 2005 for doing this. But abortion is a sacred cow on the SDMB, and those who are fanatically opposed to any restriction on abortion, at any time, for any reason, will lunge at any excuse to shut off discussion the instant it starts to tend against them. > > Planned Parenthood was looking bad. It was on video. The nurse in question, as part of her duties and acting as a paid agent of Planned Parenthood, obviously conspired to violate the laws against statutory rape and parental notification. In any thread of that sort, there will be a clamor of voices all saying “there’s no debate here - everyone stop posting!” and seeking any excuse, however flimsy, to invalidate the topic. It happened that one of the voices in the locked thread was someone who has the power to make damn sure there _was_ no debate. If you are right, I really would like to hear **Lynn** ’s version of this. If I understand you correctly, you’re saying that those in control here will close down threads and punish posters if they disagree with what they’re posting? Wow. Not good. > [@](#): > > No, this is more bullshit they pulled out of their ass - there are any number of examples of moderators explicitly telling posters to post their complaints about mod action in the Pit. This was in the pit. Just not the right place in the Pit. Subtle, but, it would seem, important distinction. ---
**Author:** ![CircleofWillis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/54ee81/32.png) [@CircleofWillis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CircleofWillis)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/59 "2008-12-09T16:11:10Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > I was critical of Planned Parenthood in that thread. I’d better watch my back. 😉 I was critical of the nurse, not PP. Should I be worried? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2008, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333/60 "2008-12-09T16:31:01Z")
> [@wring](#): > > The problem w/the thread title, IMHO, wasn’t that it went after PP the organization, but that it contained a material falsehood. Neither PP nor the nurse hid a rape of a 13 year old girl. What was clear when you read the OP was that a 20 year old falsely claimed she was 13 year old female sexually active w/a 30 year old male. _sigh_ If a thread discussed Dateline’s activites to snare online predators, would we cavil over, “No, the guy DIDN’T try to show up at a 13-year-old boy’s house for sex – it was an 18-year-old actor he was talking to!” Actually, I’m sure that some people would. But it’s a facile response: the comment clearly is intended to convey what the man THOUGHT he was doing. That’s true here, as well. The nurse pretty clearly believed she was dealing with a 13-year-old, she blatantly refused her legally mandated reporting responsibilities and gave advice on how to continue to evade reporting requirements, and she clearly worked for Planned Parenthood. It’s not unfair to advance the theory that this was consistent with Planned Parenthood’s goal, and it’s certainly not unfair to argue that she was acting contrary to Planned Parenthood’s guidance either. What is unfair, in my view, is to piously claim that this is trolling, and an offense worthy of suspension, when countless similar tactics have been permitted with no moderating response over the past nine years. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-euthanasiasts-suspension/476333.md?page=4)