# About voter ID laws......... **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 30, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029 "2014-06-30T19:18:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/61 "2014-07-02T18:04:13Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If it were conservative voters that would be negatively impacted by voter ID laws, I have no doubt that liberals would suddenly be clamoring in favor of such laws. But it isn’t, is it? “Both sides are just as bad” is one of the laziest, as well as inaccurate, arguments we often see here. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/62 "2014-07-02T18:08:05Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If a voter doesn’t participate, that doesn’t affect the correctness of an election. That’s voluntarily abstaining. Is it also correct if the state closes most of the polling places in poor districts so that the people there would have to stand in an eight-hour line to cast a vote, so some of the people who would have voted instead go home? > [@Velocity](#): > > If it were conservative voters that would be negatively impacted by voter ID laws, I have no doubt that liberals would suddenly be clamoring in favor of such laws. For sure, there are some liberals who would support that based on some bizarre rationalization. Just like the Repubs rationalize Voter ID laws as giving us confidence in the correctness of an election. However, it wouldn’t be reasonable to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/63 "2014-07-02T18:10:35Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Countries are countries. You are suggesting an outcome (80% turnout) is a possibility for OUR country, despite the fact that states with Voter ID do not have 80% turnout. How does that work? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/64 "2014-07-02T18:16:43Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > You are suggesting an outcome (80% turnout) is a possibility for OUR country, despite the fact that states with Voter ID do not have 80% turnout. > > How does that work? If more voters went to the polls on Election Day, brought IDs with them, and fewer stayed home, then there would be a mathematically higher turnout. That’s your potential 80% turnout right there. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/65 "2014-07-02T18:24:37Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If more voters went to the polls on Election Day, brought IDs with them, and fewer stayed home, then there would be a mathematically higher turnout. > That’s your potential 80% turnout right there. Or, if more voters went to the polls, stopped at McDonalds first, and fewer stayed home, there would be a mathematically higher turnout. Clearly, the key to increasing turnout is to require voters to eat at McDonalds before votings, no? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/66 "2014-07-02T18:25:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > A greater degree of confidence in the correct outcome of an ultra-close election. Not important at all. If candidate A gets 103,286 votes and candidate B gets 103,281 votes and the votes are all correctly counted and recounted, we swear in A and get on with life. In either event, roughly half the voters had no problem with A and roughly half had no problem with B, so whoever wins is pretty immaterial. The people have spoken and have pretty much said “We don’t really favor one over the other”. If we take the position that every single voter must have ironclad ID, then we will disenfrancise hundreds if not thousands of people for the sake of preventing a handful of fraudulent votes. In this case, the cure is worse than the disease. The fact that voter ID laws overwhelmingly handicap minority and poor voters tells you all you need to know about the motivation for these laws. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/67 "2014-07-02T18:26:41Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If more voters went to the polls on Election Day, brought IDs with them, and fewer stayed home, then there would be a mathematically higher turnout. Yet that isn’t happening, is it? Wonder why? > [@](#): > > That’s your potential 80% turnout right there. \*Potential \*is a Latin word meaning “imaginary”. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/68 "2014-07-02T18:31:46Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Yet that isn’t happening, is it? Wonder why? It’s known as voter apathy. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/69 "2014-07-02T18:33:46Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > The fact that voter ID laws overwhelmingly handicap minority I’m a minority American. I had no problems getting an ID, any more than a white person would have. Race is irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/70 "2014-07-02T18:34:41Z")
Go on. How does adding a burden to the voters fix the turnout problem? You’ve already told us that having voter ID laws in place should mean an 80% turnout. Well, it doesn’t. So, why not? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/71 "2014-07-02T18:35:09Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > It’s known as voter apathy. No thoughts on the influence of the specific character of the American electoral system, as noted back in post #3? It must be a moral failing? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/72 "2014-07-02T18:35:19Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > It’s known as voter apathy. And why is that a problem? If only people who care enough about the issues make their way to the polls, isn’t that a good thing? Frankly, I don’t care if people don’t want to vote. It’s the people who want to vote and are prevented by lack of ID or by intentionaly under-providing of voter machines in certain districts that have my sympathy. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/73 "2014-07-02T18:36:02Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > You’ve already told us that having voter ID laws in place should mean an 80% turnout. That’s not what I said. Read carefully. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/74 "2014-07-02T18:52:08Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Most people in the rest of the world, if asked if voters should be required to produce ID to vote, would probably look bewildered and slack-jawed…“Uh yes, duh, of course. Common sense.” Except that other countries aren’t set up so that demanding voter ID will disenfranchise people, so that’s irrelevant. > [@Velocity](#): > > I’m a minority American. I had no problems getting an ID, any more than a white person would have. Race is irrelevant. No it isn’t. Suppressing the minority vote is a major goal of voter ID laws. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/75 "2014-07-02T18:54:14Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Suppressing the minority vote is a major goal of voter ID laws. I’m a minority American and had no difficulty getting an ID and voting. Apparently this needs repeating. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/76 "2014-07-02T19:08:09Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > I’m a minority American and had no difficulty getting an ID and voting. > Apparently this needs repeating. No it doesn’t because it’s irrelevant. Voter ID is designed to suppress the poor and minority vote on a statistical level, in order to pretend that isn’t what it is doing; inevitably some slip though since it isn’t a blanket ban. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/77 "2014-07-02T19:09:40Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > That’s not what I said. Read carefully. > [@Velocity](#): > > There are countries with voter ID requirements and 80% voter turnout. So, what am I supposed to be taking away from this? That it is possible to get an 80% turnout with Voter ID? Ok, I’ll accept that as a given. If you’re not claiming that high voter turnout is a benefit of Voter ID, then I must ask again: 1. What voter fraud? Since you earlier claimed this law thwarts it. 2. What do I, as a citizen, get out of Voter ID? 3. If I get more “correctly cast and counted” votes from Voter ID, how many more? ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029/78 "2014-07-02T19:15:37Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > I’m a minority American and had no difficulty getting an ID and voting. > Apparently this needs repeating. Anecdote is data? Anecdote of _one_ is data? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/about-voter-id-laws/692029.md?page=3)