# Abramoff may flip on his congressional cronies **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 21, 2005, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594 "2005-12-21T06:05:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2006, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/61 "2006-01-05T20:19:40Z")
I’m not aware that it’s a crime to receive money from Indian tribes but we’ll see. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2006, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/62 "2006-01-05T20:20:52Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > OK. Of course, Bush isn’t going to be part of this investigation, is he? God willing 🙂 However, this sudden spate of charitable giving by high ranking republicans probably serves little beyond its amusement value. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2006, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/63 "2006-01-05T20:25:21Z")
**rjung** : That’s money he raised from other people. IOW, he calls up Joe Pubbie and says Hey, Joe, hows about you send some money to Bush. If you had taken the time to read the next few sentences in your cite, you would have noticed (emphasis added): > [@](#): > > “At this point, there is nothing to indicate that contributions from those individual donors represents anything other than enthusiastic support for the [Bush-Cheney] re-election campaign.” BTW, the “s” on the end of that big word (donor) indicates the plural-- ie, more than one person. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2006, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/64 "2006-01-05T20:28:42Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I’m not aware that it’s a crime to receive money from Indian tribes but we’ll see. No, it’s not a crime for Democrats and it’s not a crime for Republicans either. I don’t see any criminal convictions for any legislators coming out of this. Maybe a censure here and there from the House/Senate ethics committee, but that’s it. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2006, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/65 "2006-01-05T20:35:19Z")
I say Abramoff wouldn’t have gotten a deal if he couldn’t hang some Congressmen. We’ll see. I think Delay is going down at the very least. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2006, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/66 "2006-01-05T21:09:46Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > God willing 🙂 However, this sudden spate of charitable giving by high ranking republicans probably serves little beyond its amusement value. It’s like watching cockroaches scurry when the lights come on. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2006, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/67 "2006-01-06T15:32:15Z")
Perhaps [Media Matters](http://mediamatters.org/items/200601040007) might be impartial enough that i can quote from it: > [@](#): > > The baseless suggestion that any lawmaker who received contributions from Abramoff or his clients – conduct that is, in and of itself, legal and ethical – might be implicated in an investigation that is, in fact, focused on possible illegal conduct – including the receipt of contributions in exchange for something – allows the media to then characterize the scandal as bipartisan, since both Democrats and Republicans did in fact receive money from Abramoff’s clients. If you got money from Abramoff, that doesn’t make you a criminal. If you got money from Abramoff’s clients, that doesn’t make you a criminal. If you engage in quid pro quo with anybody, that’s a criminal activity. The only people currently named in this investigation are Republicans. This is not a bipartisan scandal, this is a Republican scandal. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2006, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/68 "2006-01-07T14:34:53Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I say Abramoff wouldn’t have gotten a deal if he couldn’t hang some Congressmen. We’ll see. I think Delay is going down at the very least. The timing of the just-announced GOP caucus effort to remove him permanently can’t be coincidental - where was it when DeLay got indicted? > [@BobLibDem](#): > > If you got money from Abramoff, that doesn’t make you a criminal. In the court of public opinion, yes, it will. The talking heads who most strongly shape public opinion certainly are already getting their talking points straight. “The Democrats do it too” is so traditional a one that we didn’t have to wait to hear it. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/69 "2006-01-09T08:20:33Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > The timing of the just-announced GOP caucus effort to remove him permanently can’t be coincidental - where was it when DeLay got indicted? > > In the court of public opinion, yes, it will. The talking heads who most strongly shape public opinion certainly are already getting their talking points straight. “The Democrats do it too” is so traditional a one that we didn’t have to wait to hear it. if tim russert bends over any further backwards to promote the demsdidittoo bullshit his head will touch his heels. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/70 "2006-01-09T11:11:38Z")
I guess we see why Abramoff is singing. [He faced 100 years in prison.](http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/060116/16abramoff.htm) So far, Rep. Ney of Ohio and Tom Delay seem to be the primary targets. I for one would be quite surprised if _any_ Democrats wind up being charged in this affair. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/71 "2006-01-09T14:23:01Z")
Why, Bob? I won’t. Heck, the first pol to go down to corruption charges was a dem, wasn’t he? The Vietnam Naval Ace? (Only one, IIRC) ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/72 "2006-01-09T14:41:30Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Why, Bob? I won’t. Heck, the first pol to go down to corruption charges was a dem, wasn’t he? The Vietnam Naval Ace? (Only one, IIRC) If you are speaking of [Top Gun Randy Cunningham](http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-duke29nov29,0,5594670.story?track=mostemailedlink), he was a Republican, though the GOP _wishes_ he was a democrat. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/73 "2006-01-09T15:42:53Z")
Oh, darn, why did I think he was a Dem? ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/74 "2006-01-10T01:47:11Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Oh, darn, why did I think he was a Dem? Probably because he was, you know, a veteran. \ -Joe ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/75 "2006-01-10T17:50:26Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Oh, darn, why did I think he was a Dem? Here’s an easy metric for your convenience. Crime:Influence Peddling Criminals:Peddlars of influence Inventory:Influence available for peddling: Democrats: 0 inventory Repugs:all the inventory. Ergo, you will find no influence peddled by democrats in the current scandal. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/76 "2006-01-10T17:55:09Z")
to paraphrase Sinead, “I cannot sell what I do not have” ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2006, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/77 "2006-01-13T14:57:45Z")
[From the Chicago Tribune](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/chi-0601110156jan11,1,5293591,print.column?coll=chi-news-col&ctrack=1&cset=true) , we see that Howard Dean is correct and that NO Democrats took money from Abramoff. > [@](#): > > But I checked it out and, guess what? Dean was right. Although Democrats and Republicans did, in fact, receive money from Abramoff’s clients, only Republicans received personal donations from Abramoff. > > “There are no Democrats who took money from Jack Abramoff,” Dean answered. “Not one. Not one single Democrat. …There is no evidence that Jack Abramoff ever gave any Democrat any money, and we’ve looked through all those [Federal Election Commission] reports to make sure that’s true.” > > He’s right, according to the non-partisan Center for Responsive Politics, which keeps track of such things. Why does the “liberal media” continues to try to tar Democrats with the same brush as Republicans when clearly this is a 100% Republican scandal? ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2006, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594/78 "2006-01-13T20:41:19Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > [From the Chicago Tribune](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/columnists/chi-0601110156jan11,1,5293591,print.column?coll=chi-news-col&ctrack=1&cset=true) , we see that Howard Dean is correct and that NO Democrats took money from Abramoff. Duh. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > Why does the “liberal media” continues to try to tar Democrats with the same brush as Republicans when clearly this is a 100% Republican scandal? Check all that apply: The media companies want to stay on the Administration’s good side so they can continue to grow into ever-bigger monoliths. The media outlets are lazy/time-pressured hacks who can’t be bothered to do anything more than parrot talking points from the GOP. The media outlets are afraid of getting bombarded of accusations of “liberal bias” from right-wing “watchdog” groups and FreeRepublic-style nutjobs. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abramoff-may-flip-on-his-congressional-cronies/336594.md?page=3)