# Absolute WTF, 'what were they thinking' plots and subplots in old movies and TV shows **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** theater-stage-dance\ **Created:** [December 27, 2023, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229 "2023-12-27T13:58:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/261 "2024-01-13T06:21:04Z")
> [@XOldiesJock](#): > > I’ve always been of the opinion that the two people in the Pina Colada song deserved each other, as the two most shallow people on the face of the Earth. Runners-up for that title, the totally awful “Jack and Diane.” Are we sure that the couple in the Pina Colada song _aren’t_ Jack and Diane? As for awful people in songs, the women in _50 Ways to Leave Your Lover_ and _Cecilia_ have to be on the short list. Paul Simon may have some issues. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/262 "2024-01-13T06:34:48Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > As for awful people in songs, the women in _50 Ways to Leave Your Lover_ and _Cecilia_ have to be on the short list. Paul Simon may have some issues. Paul Simon may well have some issues. At the beginning of “America,” he’s happy to be travelling with Kathy (“Let us be lovers, we’ll marry our fortunes together”), but by the end of the song, after Kathy is asleep, he’s “empty and aching and I don’t know why.” Maybe you should have bought an extra pack of cigarettes, Paul. ---
**Author:** ![iamatractorboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iamatractorboy/32/21261_2.png) [@iamatractorboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamatractorboy)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/263 "2024-01-13T07:59:09Z")
Hmm, all I’m gonna say is that to me, some of _The Smiths_’ songs sound rather upbeat to me musically. So I am not sure you can read too much into how jaunty a tune is necessarily! ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/264 "2024-01-13T14:15:03Z")
> [@solost](#): > > “Oh, it’s you…” When I sing the Pina Colada song, I like to snarl that line to express maximum disappointment. 😒 ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/265 "2024-01-13T14:16:25Z")
Oh boy, my thread has morphed into an “overanalyze song lyrics” thread, and I couldn’t be happier. > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Paul Simon may have some issues. Ya think? Every single Simon song is 30% reference to failed relationships, 30% existential angst, and 40% poetic word salad. And don’t get me wrong, I’m a fan. > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Are we sure that the couple in the Pina Colada song _aren’t_ Jack and Diane? Ha, that could work. Mellencamp was singing about J&D as they were in the 60s as teens, and the PC song is them as grown up, jaded, 70s swingers. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/266 "2024-01-13T17:32:40Z")
> [@Dung\_Beetle](#): > > When I sing the Pina Colada song, Saddest Sentence Fragment of 2024. Come ON, people. This Café is full of erudite people who know great writing and music. And vapid pop songs like this “ain’t neither.” This goes for _Afternoon Delight_ or _Sugar, Sugar_ as well… Sorry, but there are so many songs that deserve an in-depth analysis. And here we are rehashing an annoying\* one. \*Especially annoying if you had to live through the days when they were repeated ad nauseam on Top 40 radio. And your little sister who got to sit in the front seat would squeal “I LOVE this song! You know it’s not just about pina coladas…” and turn it up. And Mom, who was driving wouldn’t turn it down, but would join in singing. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/267 "2024-01-13T17:45:52Z")
Perhaps you’d prefer another song? “There’s a port, on a western bay, and it serves a hundred ships a day…” ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/268 "2024-01-13T18:04:36Z")
Well played, my friend… ---
**Author:** ![ZamboniAce1000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/f19dbf/32.png) [@ZamboniAce1000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZamboniAce1000)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/269 "2024-01-13T18:28:04Z")
Up next, the existential dread of Olivia Newton-John ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/270 "2024-01-13T18:33:57Z")
> [@Dung\_Beetle](#): > > “There’s a port, on a western bay, and it serves a hundred ships a day…” _Dung\_B, you’re a fine bug_ _What a great poster you can be_ _I welcome your contributions_ _To the SDMB…_ ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/271 "2024-01-13T18:52:13Z")
I vaguely remember Paul Simon being asked about the lyrics of one of his songs, possibly Me And Julio Down By the Schoolyard, and saying that sometimes it’s just a lyric meant to fit the song. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/272 "2024-01-13T18:55:15Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I vaguely remember Paul Simon being asked about the lyrics of one of his songs, possibly Me And Julio Down By the Schoolyard, and saying that sometimes it’s just a lyric meant to fit the song I can completely believe that. Not every song is written about a personal experience of the songwriter. OTOH, having been a fan of Paul Simon’s music since I was a teenager, and having read many interviews with (and commentary about) him, my observation is: - He’s one of the very best lyricists of the rock music era - He is a difficult, irritable, unhappy human being ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/273 "2024-01-13T19:13:42Z")
> [@Zyada](#): > > My WTF is the setup for _Sleepless in Seattle_ I like my mashup _While You Were Sleepless in Seattle_, where Bill Pullman loses Meg Ryan but gets Sandra Bullock. I think that’s a win. > [@digs](#): > > eat chili dogs > [@Loach](#): > > They are sucking on chili dogs. It’s a euphemism. Diane is sucking on Jack’s “dog”. Those horny teens! > [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Another depressed teenager. And not smart. The Tallahatchie Bridge is like 20 feet above the water. George Bailey has a better change of dying jumping off the Bedford Falls bridge. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/274 "2024-01-13T19:17:40Z")
😊 Aw shucks! ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/275 "2024-01-13T19:56:12Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > OTOH, having been a fan of Paul Simon’s music since I was a teenager, and having read many interviews with (and commentary about) him, my observation is: > > - He’s one of the very best lyricists of the rock music era > - He is a difficult, irritable, unhappy human being Not there was ever any doubt, read some of the biographies. His treatment of Garfunkel, not to mention Kathy (Kathleen Chitty, a real person) paint an unflattering portrait. Also not to mention the musical plagiarism. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Q](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/898d66/32.png) [@Johnny\_Q](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Q)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/276 "2024-01-13T21:45:58Z")
“It’s better to have loved and lost than to listen to a song by Olivia Newton John.” “Why’s that?” “Because anything’s better than listening to a song by Olivia Newton John.”-- Red Dwarf ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/277 "2024-01-13T21:59:13Z")
> [@ZamboniAce1000](#): > > Up next, the existential dread of Olivia Newton-John Please, mister, please. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/278 "2024-01-13T22:49:55Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > Please, mister, please. All I ask you is let me be there. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/279 "2024-01-13T23:04:10Z")
Alright, I’ll be that guy: I love Olivia Newton-John, thought she had a beautiful voice. And _Afternoon Delight_ has cheesy lyrics, but I really enjoy the harmony. I also like Air Supply. There, I said it. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229/280 "2024-01-13T23:04:55Z")
> [@Tibby](#): > > I mean, don’t get me wrong, I enjoy depressing music Try some Richard Thompson. We have a bootleg named “Doom and Gloom” which is quite appropriate. Some stuff is not so gloomy, but he’s a master of it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/absolute-wtf-what-were-they-thinking-plots-and-subplots-in-old-movies-and-tv-shows/995229.md?page=15)