# Academy Award nominations (2009 for 2008 films) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 22, 2009, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452 "2009-01-22T14:19:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/41 "2009-01-22T19:32:53Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > Kate Winslet doesn’t have to worry about a vote split, since her _Reader_ performance (which won a Supporting Globe) is now in the lead category. This will be her 6th nomination with no wins yet at the Academy. Her biggest competition is probably Meryl (this is her 15th nod, a record for actors), but she’ll probably have to wait a little longer for Oscar #3. Disagree that Winslet’s competition is Streep. I think it’s between Winslet and Hathaway. The Academy (insofar as a collection of individuals can be considered to have a singular motive) loves the chance to coronate an up-and-coming performer before they break through into superstardom, particularly if he or (especially) she is beautiful (Reese Witherspoon, Jennifer Hudson, Hilary Swank, Renee Zellweger, Marisa Tomei, Angelina Jolie, Gwyneth Paltrow, etc); this year, that’s Hathaway. They also love to honor the career of somebody whose work is much respected but who hasn’t gotten an award yet, especially if he or she is beautiful; this year, that’s Winslet. Streep is sort of an institution at this point (and besides, she should have been nominated for her stunningly luminous work in _Mamma Mia_), which means she’s being taken for granted to some extent; plus she’s won twice before; _plus_ this movie, _Doubt_, isn’t the best role she’s ever had. I think she’s the second-runner-up here. > [@](#): > > _Little Celebrations: Acting nominations for the excellent Richard Jenkins, Melissa Leo, and Michael Shannon, who all appeared in small movies that got noticed. Leo’s Frozen River also got a Screenplay nod alongside In Bruges–both, again, deserving._ Here, though, I agree completely. As I said in the other thread, _Frozen River_, and Leo’s work in it, blew me out of my seat. This, to me, is the year’s little-movie-that-could, at least as the awards go, because it would have been so easy to overlook it completely. I sincerely hope this exposure means more people check it out. The other two movies were great, but _Frozen River_ is really something special. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/42 "2009-01-22T20:12:34Z")
> [@DoctorJ](#): > > Was it eligible? I thought I heard that the song has to play in the body of the movie to be nominated, not just over the closing credits. The way the song nominees are determined is as follows: The music branch holds a screening (and also creates a DVD) that shows every eligible song (40+ this year) **as heard in the context of the movie**. Then they evaluate each song on a point system, and after tallying the points, they select any song that passes a certain point threshold. Closing credit songs are allowable (if it’s the first song in the credit roll), but do not usually make for much of a viewing experience. There are 3 different types of contexts: (a) within the body of the story (b) closing credits, with something visual still going on (c) closing credits, with only a black screen and credits. Note that _WALL-E_’s nominated song is (b), just like the _Inconvenient Truth_ winner two years ago. _Slumdog_ has an (a) and a (b) nominee. Bruce’s _Wrestler_ song was a (c). Since this procedure has been institutued, only 1 song from (c) has ever made the final cut (Dolly Parton’s _Transamerica_ number from 2005). Since then, both _Dreamgirls_ and _Enchanted_ racked up 3 nominations each in this category. Each of those songs were (a), as were the recent winners from _Once_ and _Hustle & Flow_. So, clearly, the music branch has shifted its priorities so you can’t just tag on a song at the end of the film and expect a nomination, and it feels no obligation to recognize 5 songs if only 3 meet their threshold. Personally, I still think Bruce got shafted, but there is a process that explains how it all transpired. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/43 "2009-01-22T20:59:18Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Disagree that Winslet’s competition is Streep. I think it’s between Winslet and Hathaway. The Academy (insofar as a collection of individuals can be considered to have a singular motive) loves the chance to coronate an up-and-coming performer before they break through into superstardom, particularly if he or (especially) she is beautiful (Reese Witherspoon, Jennifer Hudson, Hilary Swank, Renee Zellweger, Marisa Tomei, Angelina Jolie, Gwyneth Paltrow, etc); this year, that’s Hathaway. You make some good points but are conflating too many variables into this coronation meme (which is actually much more true of the Golden Globes than the Oscars). [ul][li]Witherspoon, like Julia Roberts before her, won primarily because she was, at the time, the biggest star in Hollywood.[/li][li]Swank (#1) & Theron won because they were truly transformative performances that came out of left field and genuinely blew everyone away. Note that these two also won a ton of precursors: The Globe and/or SAG, and a bushel of critics’ awards.[/li][li]Swank (#2), Paltrow, Catherine Zeta-Jones and Jennifer Connelly were piggyback winners of Best Picture winners, though Paltrow also is a Legacy Princess (mom/dad in the biz)[/li][li]Hudson, Zellweger, Jolie & Mira Sorvino were supporting scene-stealers, the most memorable things in so-so films, though Jolie & Sorvino are also Legacy Princesses (and Renee was on her 3rd nod by then). Plus in most of these cases, the competition was rather weak (an assortment of obscurities and previous winners).[/li][li]Tomei, at the time, was such an enormous fluke, conspiracy theories still abound.[/ul]Some of these performances were award-worthy and some weren’t, but there are more complicated reasons behind the wins than simply voting for Prom Queen (otherwise, Kate Hudson & Natalie Portman would’ve won their contests, too).[/li] Now, the problem with Hathaway is…[ul][li]She’s not a B.O. powerhouse yet (she just got her ass kicked by Clint Eastwood this past weekend)[_]The performance is good but not Undeniably Amazing, and she’s barely won any precursors, so she’s not the Critics’ Darling Who Cannot Be Denied[_]She’s in a smaller pseudo-indie with no other nominations (so no piggyback effect possible)[_]She’s a lead so in with the Big Fish (as opposed to a supporting scene-stealer)[_]Like other recent young beautiful losers (Amy Adams, Penelope Cruz, Keira Knightley, Salma Hayek, Naomi Watts), people probably suspect she’s got more performances like this in the future, so what’s the rush? Winslet has been a perpetual victim of this groupthink.[/ul]So I don’t think Hathaway has any of the things going for her that all these other winners did. If her film had scored another acting nod, or even a Screenplay nod (for another Legacy Princess), it might be different. But on her own? Not enough.[/li][quote] Streep is sort of an institution at this point…which means she’s being taken for granted to some extent; plus she’s won twice before; [/quote] The thing is, though, that everytime she’s nominated, everybody brings up how the last time she won was in 1982! That was the year Hathaway was born! So the talk isn’t about the two she’s won, but the 10 straight that she’s lost since then. Nicholson is a comparable male insitution, but even with fewer nods than Streep, he still has more Oscars. > [@](#): > > _plus_ this movie, _Doubt_, isn’t the best role she’s ever had. This is Streep’s 12th lead nomination, tying her with Katherine Hepburn, who had won 4 by this benchmark. Does anyone think _On Golden Pond_ was her best? :shudder: Plus _Doubt_ is loved by the acting branch; 4 acting nods for a single film has happened only 1 other time in the last 25 years. And actors represent the largest voting block in the Academy (and they revere Streep). Hathaway may be a remote spoiler, but she’s strictly the darkest of horses, and now that Winslet doesn’t have to worry about siphoning votes off to a supporting nomination, I’m not sure how she can lose–though if she were to, it would have to be to a heavyweight like Streep (who was also the biggest female b.o. champ this past year) ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/44 "2009-01-22T21:19:06Z")
You make a compelling case. I shall have to ponder. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/45 "2009-01-22T21:24:47Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Well, there’s your problem. Incredibly stupid. Incredibly ludicrous. Incredibly heavy handed. Incredibly inflated. Incredibly lots of things. But definitely not incredibly awesome. Or slightly awesome. Or in the same universe as awesome. Gotta agree, though I realize I’m in the minority. I thought (aside from Ledger’s acting) it was a weak-ass film. I actually thought the first one was more enjoyable (though also not Oscar-worthy). ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/46 "2009-01-22T21:32:41Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > Gotta agree, though I realize I’m in the minority. I thought (aside from Ledger’s acting) it was a weak-ass film. I actually thought the first one was more enjoyable (though also not Oscar-worthy). I largely agree with this as well. I thought _The Dark Knight_ was an excellent film buried somewhere within a sprawling morass of plot implausibilities, contrivances, and a sagging narrative structure. (It would be easier, for example, to ignore the ridiculously meticulous and complicated plans that the Joker was able to set into motion all across the city at any given time if he weren’t so wonderfully emphatic and convincing in his characterization of himself as an agent of chaos down to the core.) But I thought that Ledger hit it out of the damn park. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/47 "2009-01-22T23:09:48Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > Gotta agree, though I realize I’m in the minority. I thought (aside from Ledger’s acting) it was a weak-ass film. I actually thought the first one was more enjoyable (though also not Oscar-worthy). Yeah, I enjoyed the first one more than I thought I would and the second one a lot less. I had to post something, though, because I find the adulation of this film utterly confounding. It’s the Matrix redux. The Academy did not make a mistake here. It saved its ass. ---
**Author:** ![Pollux\_Oil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/858c86/32.png) [@Pollux\_Oil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pollux_Oil)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2009, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/48 "2009-01-22T23:57:00Z")
This is the first Academy Awards in a long time that I’m really meh towards. In previous years I’d seen at least one of the Best Picture nominees and was invested in some of the performances. This year, I haven’t seen any of the main movies and I’m not that interested in seeing them either (except for Doubt, but that’s just because I think Phillip Seymour Hoffman is awesome). Kind of wish there had been an In Bruges nomination but I’ll just have to take Colin Farrell’s Golden Globe win. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/49 "2009-01-23T00:04:22Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Yeah, I enjoyed the first one more than I thought I would and the second one a lot less. > > I had to post something, though, because I find the adulation of this film utterly confounding. It’s the Matrix redux. The Academy did not make a mistake here. It saved its ass. I’m with you. I was fairly excited to see it, even though I’m not a superhero/action fan by any stretch, just because I was surprised by how not-shitty the first one was and everybody was raving about this one. I, too, find the accolades baffling - I assume a lot of it’s from the fanboy contingent. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/50 "2009-01-23T00:21:41Z")
> [@Pollux\_Oil](#): > > This is the first Academy Awards in a long time that I’m really meh towards. In previous years I’d seen at least one of the Best Picture nominees and was invested in some of the performances. This year, I haven’t seen any of the main movies and I’m not that interested in seeing them either (except for Doubt, but that’s just because I think Phillip Seymour Hoffman is awesome). > > Kind of wish there had been an In Bruges nomination but I’ll just have to take Colin Farrell’s Golden Globe win. Quite the opposite for me. This is the first Academy Awards in a long time in which I DO feel an investment: I really want “Slumdog Millionaire” to win. Ed ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/51 "2009-01-23T01:02:41Z")
About\* The Reader\*'s surprise nomination: I was listening to NPR today and they commented on the fact that it’s a Weinstein Brothers movie, and they are notorious for campaigning their way into Oscar nominations. I don’t know enough about this to know which movies they were alluding to that were unlikely noms that happened via campaigning; maybe someone else can comment? ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/52 "2009-01-23T01:41:11Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > I assume a lot of it’s from the fanboy contingent. [Nope](http://www.moviecitynews.com/awards/2009/top_ten/00scoreboard.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/53 "2009-01-23T01:54:01Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > About\* The Reader\*'s surprise nomination: I was listening to NPR today and they commented on the fact that it’s a Weinstein Brothers movie, and they are notorious for campaigning their way into Oscar nominations. I don’t know enough about this to know which movies they were alluding to that were unlikely noms that happened via campaigning; maybe someone else can comment? _Shakespeare in Love_ is the most notorious. _The English Patient_ and \* Good Will Hunting\* are a couple of other Miramax films that probably got more Oscar love than they really deserved. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/54 "2009-01-23T03:02:27Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > _Shakespeare in Love_ is the most notorious. _The English Patient_ and \* Good Will Hunting\* are a couple of other Miramax films that probably got more Oscar love than they really deserved. Yeah, Weinstein was notorious for over-the-top gladhanding to get as much love for Miramax films as possible. _My Left Foot_ was an early calling card, followed in successive years by the Oscar successes of _The Crying Game, The Piano, Pulp Fiction_ and _Il Postino_. _The English Patient_ was the first to score a Picture win (though honestly, that type of film was already right up the Academy’s alley). Still, 9 Oscars for that film was nothing to sneeze at, and _Good Will Hunting_ the next year continued the trend. But the biggee was _Shakespeare in Love_ upsetting Spielberg’s war epic, which got Harvey his own personal Golden Guy as well (and forced the Academy to change the rules so a laundry list of producers couldn’t take credit for a Best Picture win). From there, it was downhill, though _Cider House Rules_ still took home a couple and he was even able to score an inexplicable Best Picture nod for _Chocolat_. (!?!) After that, _The Shipping News_ (first-class Oscar bait) tanked and _Cold Mountain_ couldn’t manage a Picture nod despite his best efforts. A few other modest Academy successes (_Finding Neverland_) followed, but nothing that came close to the Big Enchilada. Not long after, Miramax and Harvey parted ways. But now, it appears, the galeforce personality of Harvey is back in business. He practically busted a gut trying–and failing–to get Martin Scorsese an Oscar for _Gangs of New York_ (that film went 0-for-10), so now he’s on a new mission: Get Kate Winslet her Oscar at last. The fact that the Weinstein Company is also distributing _Vicky Christina Barcelona_ is what you’d call “synergy”; by bumping Winslet’s “supporting” performance in _The Reader_ up to lead (leaving the tatters of _Revolutionary Road_ in its wake), that also eliminates Penelope Cruz’s chief competition. 2 for 1! It will be interesting to see how much of a backlash the Academy has to this strategy, since he really alienated a lot of people with his excessive tactics the last time he was front-and-center in the Oscar race. ---
**Author:** ![TheBoltEater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@TheBoltEater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheBoltEater)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/55 "2009-01-23T03:53:07Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > Biggest Shock: Across the board snub for Batman in the major categories (Picture, Director, Screenplay). It still has 8, including Ledger (a lock to win, I think) And yet you seemed so certain he would _not_ win when we made that bet… 😃 ---
**Author:** ![AdmiralCrunch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6f9a4e/32.png) [@AdmiralCrunch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AdmiralCrunch)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/56 "2009-01-23T04:26:55Z")
I haven’t been this underwhelmed by the Oscars since Crash won Best Picture. Before that, it was when Crash was nominated for Best Picture. 1. No Director/Picture for Dark Knight/Wall-E. No shocker there, and neither was strong enough to merit breaking tradition. It was a weak year, but it’s still the Oscars. 2. Torino Snub and Jolie Best Actress. Got this one bad wrong. Gran Torino was unspectacular, but Changeling was just bad. Jolie hurt an already bad movie. 3. Mr. Buttons cleaning up. 13 is a lot of nominations for a mediocre movie, but I think it’s mostly an achievement award for Fincher. And the technical nominations were done better in Synecdoche, NY. Wasn’t nominated for a thing. 4. Robert Downey Jr. Good surprise. Overall, this year was a good reminder that the Academy doesn’t care what film actually deserves to win, because it uses a cryptic process that frequently coincides with critical opinion. Won’t be watching. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/57 "2009-01-23T15:06:27Z")
> [@TheBoltEater](#): > > And yet you seemed so certain he would _not_ win when we made that bet… 😃 I was never certain that he would _not_ win. I just though that it was premature in mid-July (when we made our bet) to already crown him a mortal lock. At this point, however, I’m fairly certain I’ll be losing that one. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![TheBoltEater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@TheBoltEater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheBoltEater)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/58 "2009-01-23T22:15:28Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > I was never certain that he would _not_ win. I just though that it was premature in mid-July (when we made our bet) to already crown him a mortal lock. > > At this point, however, I’m fairly certain I’ll be losing that one. 😛 Well, not to be morbid, but I wouldn’t have made that bet either if Heath Ledger were still alive. His performance _is_ fantastic, and absolutely deserving of winning this Oscar, but it was his untimely death that had me absolutely certain from the moment I saw the film that he would win. I believe I said at the time that as long as he got the nomination he was a shoo-in. I still believe that, but I’d be really interested in the crowd’s reaction if he doesn’t win. Either way, it should be the most interesting part of this year’s ceremony. ---
**Author:** ![woodstockbirdybird](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/woodstockbirdybird/32/7905_2.png) [@woodstockbirdybird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/woodstockbirdybird)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2009, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/59 "2009-01-23T22:20:25Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > [Nope](http://www.moviecitynews.com/awards/2009/top_ten/00scoreboard.htm) Ah, but who’s to say many of those critics weren’t fanboys at some point in their lives? ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2009, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452/60 "2009-01-26T18:03:21Z")
Newsweek has released it’s [annual Oscar roundtable](http://www.newsweek.com/id/180867/page/1). This year w/ Frank Langella, Brad Pitt, Robert Downey, Jr, Mickey Rourke, Anne Hathaway, and Sally Hawkins. It’s a great read. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/academy-award-nominations-2009-for-2008-films/482452.md?page=4)