Accents, anyone?

Ak&c:

…or in other words, as far as you know, it cd be any one of a thousand other things. If you have to resort at this point to “likely” and “might be”, then I don’t think you know enough about the subject to have an opinion worth offering. It is many years since I lived in Hanover/Hannover, but what they spoke then, in the city itself, was either Hochdeutsch or Plattdeutsch

As for Scotland, I think the point is that you - or your encyclopaedia - are/is blurring the distinction between a language and a dialect.

If you look at the evidence, the linguistic division (as opposed to the political division) between England and Scotland lay along the boundary between the Highlands and the Lowlands - Lowland Scots was the northernmost dialect of English linked, most closely, as you say, to Northumbrian.

The “Scots” you are talking about has been in practice extinct for precisely as long as all the other dialects of English, and for the same reason - standardisation, which has been extremely effective in Gt Britain, I suppose firstly, because it is physically a fairly small and separated area; and secondly because of the cultural dominance of London.

If it will make you happy, I will concede however that Glaswegian is a separate language, comprehensible to no-one outside Glasgow. It’s fun to learn, because it can’t be spoken unless you’re completely rat-arsed first.

Coldfire: yes, I wd probably be able to tell if you were Dutch. It’s because the Dutch tend to swallow their vowels in a peculiar way - it’s more in the throat than English English. Having said that, the Dutch generally speak with a less noticeably “foreign” accent than others, and quite often all it’s possible to tell is that the speaker isn’t native, and then by a process of deduction, because the difference is so slight, to arrive at the conclusion “Dutch”

It’s a blurry distinction anyway. You know that.

Well, yes, Scots and English have a common origin (as do Dutch and German). It was the annexation of Northumbrian Lothian into the kingdom of Alba that brought “Inglis” to Scotland and it took on a different form as it spread to the north and west. It was recognized as a distinct language (“Scotis”) at least by the 1400s.

There are valid reasons to consider Scots a language:

[ul][li]It has several different dialects of its own[/li][li]Its vocabulary includes Gaelic, Norwegian, Danish, French, and German words that do not exist in English[/li][li]Scots & English grammatical structures differ to some extent[/li][li]There is a clear political boundary[/li][li]Scots and English are not completely mutually intelligible; both spoken and written Scots would be difficult if not impossible for some English speakers to understand[/li][li]Probably other things I can’t think of at the moment since I’m too tired after a night of getting rat-arsed with a few Glaswegians myself :)[/ul][/li]
Whether these factors make it a language in its own right is really just a matter of opinion (and politics, of course). The point is it’s a reasonable opinion to hold.

Taking this train back south…

I really dont have problems understanding Mexican Spanish. Probably because where I live, almost all of the native speakers are of Mexican descent, so I hear it often.

Cuban speakers are hard to understand, mostly because they talk so fast (a friend of mine who is Mexican says she can hardly understand her mother’s friend because her mother’s friend speaks Cuban Spanish).

I remember watching these videos in class that had speakers who spoke with different accents (Castillian speaker, and a Latin American speaker), and we had no trouble understanding the Latin American Speaker, but had a harder time understanding the Castillian speaker (it’s all the “th” sounds they use).

Also castillians pronounce ll as “ly” from what I can hear. My current Spanish teacher who is from Germany, does her ll’s that way, and I would bet she either learned Spanish in Spain, or her teachers were from Spain.

One other dialect I have trouble with is the Sevilleno accent. It seems they tend to aspirate their s sounds.

I love these discussions. Sometimes I think I should I have stuck with that Linguistics major. :slight_smile:

Anyway, I back up the statement on Argentinian accents. My HS Spanish teacher was an American who learned the language in Argentina, and I always say “zh” for “ll.” My sister is in Spanish 3 right now, and I was helping her out with some dialogue last weekend, and she had to ask me to repeat half of the stuff I said (obviously, she has a different teacher than I did).

Speaking of weird accents, you haven’t lived til you’ve heard Russians speaking Hebrew. I personally think it’s hideous, but a friend of mine told me loves it.

~Kyla

Aaanyway, other than English accents, which I adore, the cutest accent I’d ever heard is a Quebecois I knew just starting to learn Esperanto. It was so adorably gawky :slight_smile:

Yoo heffunt lift til yoo heer ower fourmur prime minnustur Ruud Lubbers talluk Ingkleash doh :slight_smile:

Coldfire


“You know how complex women are”

  • Neil Peart, Rush (1993)