# ACORN submits fraudulent voter registrations en masse **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 8, 2008, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984 "2008-10-08T13:55:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/81 "2008-10-08T17:23:05Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > We expect, in other words, that in order to vote, people make some effort. “The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.” _–Anatole France_ ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/82 "2008-10-08T17:24:48Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > [Here is just one article pointing out the flaws in their “logic” of blaming ACORN and low income minorities for the crises.](http://www.slate.com/id/2201641/) I find it insulting to imply people are blaming poor people for the loans they took out. It would be like blaming children because someone encouraged them to play with firecrackers. The blame is goes to ACORN and HUD for promoting the loans in the first place. It’s the organizations who knowingly promoted bad loans and threatened banks that are to blame. I feel bad that someone was fooled into believing they could afford a house when they couldn’t. HUD was picking up the tab for minimum down payments/closing costs as if this was the solution to home ownership. It wasn’t. Those costs pale in comparison to upkeep and taxes on a house. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/83 "2008-10-08T17:25:00Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > “The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread.” _–Anatole France_ Relevance? ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/84 "2008-10-08T17:26:17Z")
Fraudulent voter registration would work better with same day voting. (Such allegations have been made in regards to the voting going on in Ohio.) Still, even if the stories are true, I would think it is more likely due to overzealous ACORN members, and not a national level (coordinated) conspiracy. ---
**Author:** ![Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bc8723/32.png) [@Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fish)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/85 "2008-10-08T17:26:21Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > These objections would all seem to apply to the actual act of voting, as well. One can already vote by mail, from overseas, from a military base in a foreign land, even in some precincts by email. Requiring someone to drive into a voting center to provide ID _is_ a barrier that is not now present, is it not? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/86 "2008-10-08T17:30:01Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > Relevance? That the effort Bricker requires of all voters falls heaviest on the poor. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/87 "2008-10-08T17:30:14Z")
> [@Fish](#): > > One can already vote by mail, from overseas, from a military base in a foreign land, even in some precincts by email. > > Requiring someone to drive into a voting center to provide ID _is_ a barrier that is not now present, is it not? It is some places, and isn’t others. My point, though, is that we do not regard a jurisdiction that requires people to show up at the polls on Election Day to pull a lever as disenfranchising their ctitzens. And requiring an ID to vote is not a dramatic step from requiring that they show up at the polls – in fact, it’s less onerous; they have a whole year to get to the facility to get their ID and only one eleven to thirteen hour period to get to the polls. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/88 "2008-10-08T17:30:16Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The blame is goes to ACORN and HUD for promoting the loans in the first place. It’s the organizations who knowingly promoted bad loans and threatened banks that are to blame. So the organizations that handed out the bad loans like candy have no culpability? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/89 "2008-10-08T17:32:17Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > That the effort Bricker requires of all voters falls heaviest on the poor. Again – true, but already true for the act of voting. And we don’t regard that as a disenfranchisement. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/90 "2008-10-08T17:33:36Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > Fraudulent voter registration would work better with same day voting. (Such allegations have been made in regards to the voting going on in Ohio.) > > Still, even if the stories are true, I would think it is more likely due to overzealous ACORN members, and not a national level (coordinated) conspiracy. Same day voting has another equally useful version done on a national level and that is the absentee ballot. ---
**Author:** ![askeptic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb9ed0/32.png) [@askeptic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/askeptic)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/91 "2008-10-08T17:35:05Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > [Montana’s Republican Party tries to disenfranchise 6000 voters](http://www.kpax.com/global/story.asp?s=9142552) and eventually have to slink off and withdraw their lawsuit because it was so unsupported yet the SDMB’s conservatives look intently elsewhere! > > But the thing is, I don’t have any way of knowing if the SDMB’s conservatives are ignoring this story or if they haven’t heard it or even if they’ve heard it and don’t consider it big news. This presumption of guilt game “You KNEW about it! You just were ashamed to ADMIT it!” is ridiculous. Not to mention Wisconsin’s effort to disenfranchise voters by it’s republican Attorney General. [http://www.dailycardinal.com/article/20492](http://www.dailycardinal.com/article/20492) [http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/local/305249](http://www.madison.com/wsj/home/local/305249) ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/92 "2008-10-08T17:35:32Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > Fraudulent voter registration would work better with same day voting. (Such allegations have been made in regards to the voting going on in Ohio.) > > Still, even if the stories are true, I would think it is more likely due to overzealous ACORN members, and not a national level (coordinated) conspiracy. There’s no doubt the accusations are substantially correct, and it doesn’t have to be a “conspiracy.” (And why do you lefties start blithering about “conspiracy” when nobody else has said anything about conspiracy? Is this going to become a habit, like accusing others of racism, sexism and homophobia?) It’s still corrupt politics, and it appears that members of a nationwide organization have been dealing in this kind of fraud around the country for years. That would certainly indicate the organization is corrupt, even if the higher-ups at the national level weren’t directly involved in any unethical or criminal activity. In the example I gave, ACORN members were threatening government workers with violence against person and property. Doesn’t that tell you something is rotten in the state of Denmark? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/93 "2008-10-08T17:36:32Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > Well, [this guy](http://www.ajc.com/opinion/content/opinion/stories/2008/10/08/garlocked_1008.html)had some firsthand, personal experience with the slimeballs at ACORN, and he seems to think voter ID to prevent such voter fraud is a good idea. From your source (by the way, an _opinion_ piece is, in my estimation amongst many, just about the weakest possible form of substantiation…) > [@](#): > > …The Republicans screamed “foul!” referring to ACORN as leftist, radical, a Democrat ally, corrupt and discredited. Personally, I agree, but you decide for yourself… It is good that the author brings a non-partisan and impartial view to this issue. I regret that no dirty fucking hippies were implicated, but am satisfied that is an oversight. Moving along… [QUOTE=Arizona Teach] Looks like it’s happening in Ohio, too. [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > …The board discussed several other cases of multiple registrations at their meeting… Several? Merciful Og, _several!_ That could be as many as…what? five? seven? It might even be ten! I clutch my pearls and faint dead away! ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/94 "2008-10-08T17:40:21Z")
ACORN has been involved in voter fraud and intimidation tactics for a long time. Some ACORN members were charged with this in the last election, as well. The real scandal here is that ACORN is treated as a legitimate, mainstream NPO, when in fact it’s an activist organization wholly in bed with the Democrats. ACORN should not get a nickel of government money. Of course, the amusing aspect of this is that it’s the left that’s always accusing Republicans of fixing or ‘stealing’ elections, but when it comes down to catching people with their hands actually in the cookie jar, far more often than not it seems to be people trying to rig the election for Democrats. Obama has some pretty strong ties to ACORN. He’s worked with them lots on the past. Shouldn’t be be distancing himself from this organization by now? ACORN’s antics also helped exacerbate the sub-prime mortgage fiasco, because they have staged protests, filed lawsuits and in general harassed financial institutions who refused to give out mortgages to what they saw as unqualified borrowers. Would this also be a good place to point out that Barack Obama’s donor database is full of false donors and questionable money from unknown sources in huge amounts? ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/95 "2008-10-08T17:41:10Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > That the effort Bricker requires of all voters falls heaviest on the poor. And in other news, the Pope is Catholic, and bears sleep in the woods. _Everything_ falls heaviest on the poor. Why would this be any different? And why should it make me any happier about having my vote neutralized by a faudulent one? ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/96 "2008-10-08T17:41:45Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I clutch my pearls and faint dead away! I always pictured you as a hemp/peace sign necklace kinda guy, **luci** ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/97 "2008-10-08T17:42:48Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > but when it comes down to catching people with their hands actually in the cookie jar, far more often than not it seems to be people trying to rig the election for Democrats. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/98 "2008-10-08T17:47:39Z")
It seems trickle-down economics has morphed into trickle-down blame. It’s ACORN that we should be demanding $700 Billion dollars from to fix this mess? And of course, Barack Obama has an “intimate link” with them, so that means he worships an evil moon-god now or something. Fuck me. I need a program to keep up with all this. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/99 "2008-10-08T17:47:48Z")
> [@LonesomePolecat](#): > > …In the example I gave, ACORN members were threatening government workers with violence against person and property… It does no such thing. > [@](#): > > …To make their point, instead of jawboning with Congress where the RTC mandates were made, they demonstrated and intimidated at RTC offices. > > In our office in King of Prussia, Pa., for a time we had police officers on site to escort staff to and from their cars to reduce the chance of violence to their person or automobile by ACORN thugs… is about as close as he gets. He offers no proof whatever of this slander, which you offer as solid fact based on nothing but his say-so. Perhaps if you stop disgracing yourself now, you may yet manage to retain a scrap of dignity. ---
**Author:** ![LonesomePolecat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e57/32.png) [@LonesomePolecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonesomePolecat)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2008, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984/100 "2008-10-08T17:48:57Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > From your source (by the way, an _opinion_ piece is, in my estimation amongst many, just about the weakest possible form of substantiation…) So which of his facts do you deny and on what grounds do you deny them? > [@elucidator](#): > > It is good that the author brings a non-partisan and impartial view to this issue. I regret that no dirty fucking hippies were implicated, but am satisfied that is an oversight. > > Moving along… > > Several? Merciful Og, _several!_ That could be as many as…what? five? seven? It might even be ten! I clutch my pearls and faint dead away! A sneer? That’s all you’ve got? That’s the best you can do? From the column: > [@Terry Garlock](#): > > After the smoke cleared in the 2004 Ohio presidential election, election officials reported that ACORN made a repeated practice of submitting large stacks of voter registration documents at the last minute, filled out months prior but held so late that any verification was impossible. You think you can make facts like that go away with sarcasm and ridicule? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/acorn-submits-fraudulent-voter-registrations-en-masse/466984.md?page=6)