# Actor goes from second banana (or other side role) to lead **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 21, 2021, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057 "2021-09-21T12:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/21 "2021-09-21T17:39:57Z")
Just so I’m clear, is it that actors change characters, but within the same universe, and with a more prominent role? I’m a little confused by the replies. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/22 "2021-09-21T17:44:14Z")
The “pure” examples would be shows/films with a specific main character played by X, and with either a “sidekick” or “other minor character” played by Y, and then in a later show/film involving the same character, Y plays the main character instead. In OP’s example you had someone literally who played Watson (Holmes’ famous sidekick) in a later version play Holmes himself. It would seem there’s variations on this theme though, depending on how much you care to explore those. For example Martin Sheen played the Chief of Staff to Michael Douglas’ POTUS in _The American President_, a few years later Martin was playing the President in _The West Wing_, that wouldn’t be a perfect example because while Chief of Staff is arguably Number Two to POTUS, the actual characters in The American President didn’t carryover to _The West Wing_–even though I do think the West Wing has been said to have been partially inspired by _The American President_–and Martin’s casting as President Bartlett specifically desired because of his performance in the previous film–you’ll note Aaron Sorkin wrote both works. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/23 "2021-09-21T17:53:01Z")
Maybe a convoluted example–Larry David, who had a moderate career as a stand-up comedian, sketch show performer and writer prior to _Seinfeld_–but no real experience as an actor, was the executive producer, writer of that show. He appeared in that show numerous times, sometimes with voice-only characters, sometimes on screen but only briefly (as the enigmatic “lawyer” in one episode, as a convenience store clerk in another etc.) However, the character of George Costanza (portrayed by Jason Alexander) was essentially based on Larry David. Years after _Seinfeld_ went off the air Larry starred in _Curb Your Enthusiasm_…as a fictionalized version of himself–this time played by _himself_ and not Jason Alexander. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/24 "2021-09-21T17:59:04Z")
_Doctor Who_ did this quite a bit. Colin Baker played a small role as Commander Maxil in _Arc of Infinity_ before being cast at the Doctor. Ian Marter was a ship’s officer in “Carnival of Monsters” and later played the companion Harry Sullivan. Karen Gillan played a soothsayer in “The Fires of Pompeii” and became Amy Pond later. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/25 "2021-09-21T18:02:08Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Just so I’m clear, is it that actors change characters, but within the same universe, and with a more prominent role? I’m a little confused by the replies. As always happens, people either don’t understand the OP concept or try to broaden things. Several answers here have veered considerably from what I’m looking for, which is cases within a film series or TV series (or at least cases based on the same book or whatever) where someone who originally played one character later got elevated into the lead character. It might be a different series (as with David Suchet playing Poirot in a series unconnected with the one in which Peter Ustinov played Poirot, but Suchet had appeared in as Japp. That didn’t happen with Ma and Pa Kettle, for instance – that’s a different type of thing, where a side character ends up with their own spinoff or their own series. Ditto The Fonz. Henry Winkler didn’t play any other character besides Arthur Fonzarelli – his character simply gained in importance. Not the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/26 "2021-09-21T18:08:46Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Peter Capaldi, by contrast, went all the way over from ‘Guy Who Might Get Rescued By Doctor Who Or Might Just Be A Sacrificial Lamb’ to the significant title character of — uh, ‘ **Doctor Who** ’. I’ve got a better example. Before Peter Capaldi became Doctor Who, he played a [WHO Doctor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_Z_(film)). ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/28 "2021-09-21T18:25:52Z")
Another example from James Bond movies, Robert Brown first appeared in TSWLM as Admiral Hargreaves, a minor character. He later played the much more significant role of the second M. There has been lots of debate among Bond fans if Hargreaves took over the job, but they are _probably_ intended to be separate characters. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/29 "2021-09-21T18:26:08Z")
Tim Russ played minor characters in multiple _Star Trek_ series – “Devor” in _TNG_ and “T’Kar” in _DS9_, before being cast as Tuvok in _Voyager_. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/30 "2021-09-21T18:50:08Z")
IIRC, Billy de Wolfe was the station manager. I can’t remember who the other DJ was without looking it up. Turns out it was Joby Baker. Who apparently found steady work as an actor, though I don’t remember him from anything else. Several better known people were in the cast. I laughed when I saw Goldie’s character was named “Kramer.” > **[Good Morning World (TV Series 1967–1968) - IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0061257/)** > > Good Morning World: Created by Sam Denoff, Bill Persky. With Joby Baker, Ronnie Schell, Julie Parrish, Billy De Wolfe. David Lewis and Larry Clarke are early morning disc jockeys in Los Angeles. Dave is happily married, while Larry thinks of himself... ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/31 "2021-09-21T20:54:49Z")
Despite having the same creator, _Petticoat Junction_ was not, strictly speaking, a spin-off of _The Beverly Hillbillies_. However during season 6 of Junction, it was established that Cousin Pearl Beaudine of Hillbillies (played by Bea Benaderet) was in some way related to Kate Bradley of Junction (also Benaderet.) In several crossover episodes, the cast of Hillbillies interacted with Benaderet as Kate Bradley, and not as Cousin Pearl. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/32 "2021-09-21T20:56:02Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > IIRC, Landau and his wife (Barbara Bain) did the first three seasons of _ **M:I** _ before leaving over a salary dispute. The show was never the same after that. I agree. It was better without his self-conscious actorliness and her oh-so-smouldering looks sans any acting ability whatever. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/33 "2021-09-21T23:00:04Z")
You must have read the satire of it in _ **MAD Magazine** _. Once I had, I couldn’t watch the show without laughing each time they showed close-ups of those two. :My favorite episode is the one where they do the cabaret act in “Ramsdorf, East Europe.” _If you drink … my glass … of wine …_🤣 Mort Drucker’s caricatures of Greg Morris were especially hilarious too! Bain, however, was really hot as Rob Petrie’s old girlfriend on _ **The Dick van Dyke Show** _. Hubba-hubba! 🥰 ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/34 "2021-09-21T23:17:00Z")
Patrick McNee not only played Dr Watson [in Sherlock Holmes in New York (TVM 1976), Sherlock Holmes and the Leading Lady (TVM 1991), Incident at Victoria Falls (TVM 1992)] and Sherlock Holmes himself [in The Hound of London (TVM 1993)] but also someone who thought he was Sherlock Holmes [in Magnum PI: Holmes Is Where the Heart Is (1984)]. ---
**Author:** ![ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chockfullofheadygoodness/32/511_2.png) [@ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2021, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/35 "2021-09-21T23:17:48Z")
Here’s one that goes in both directions: Jeff Conaway played the lead Danny Zuko for over 2 years in the Broadway production of _Grease_. For the film version, he played Zuko’s sidekick Kenickie. Meanwhile, John Travolta played the even more minor sidekick Doody on Broadway, but ended up in the lead for the film version. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2021, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/36 "2021-09-22T01:21:38Z")
Here’s one that should fit the OP’s criteria exactly. Martin Sheen played Robert. F Kennedy in the 1974 TV movie [The Missiles of October](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071847/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_187) In 1983 he played John F. Kennedy in the miniseries [Kennedy.](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085044/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_167) ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2021, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/37 "2021-09-22T07:34:09Z")
Sara Gilbert got quite a promotion from **Roseanne** to **The Conners**. Sean Murray and Brian Dietzen have, on **NCIS** , risen from comic relief butt-monkeys to, in the current season, arguably the two most important characters on the show. Robert Duncan MacNeil went from a minor character in **ST:TNG** to a very important character (with an almost identical backstory) on **ST:Voyager**. On Mad Men, Kiernan Shipka’s character, Sally Draper, started off being no more important than brother Bobby. Bobby became increasingly unimportant (No one noticed that a string of different actors played him until he made a joke about it) and Sally had major episodes built around her by the final season. Rob Lowe, Allyson Janney and Richard Schiff’s characters were all on about the same footing in season one of **The West Wing** , but were on wildly different trajectories by the final episode. ---
**Author:** ![TCMF-2L](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tcmf-2l/32/16553_2.png) [@TCMF-2L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TCMF-2L)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2021, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/38 "2021-09-22T11:03:27Z")
I think this counts. **Lucy Lawless** had a few minor roles as different characters in the TV show **Hercules: The Legendary Journeys** before getting the role of Xena, first on Hercules and then on the spin off show **Xena: Warrior Princess.** Adding to the trivia. Her biggest non-Xena role on Hercules was as Lyla, a woman who married a centaur. She portrayed Lyla both before and then after she had become established as Xena leading to some fourth wall breaking, eye winking as other characters discuss Lyla saying ‘_Does she remind you of someone…?_’ TCMF-2L ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2021, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/39 "2021-09-22T11:12:51Z")
Michael Caine got an Oscar nomination for expertly second-banana-ing Laurence Olivier in SLEUTH, playing Milo Tindle to the other guy’s Andrew Wyke; and, after Caine won some Oscars of his own, he first-banana-ed Jude Law, as the Wyke to _his_ Tindle. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2021, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/40 "2021-09-22T11:26:23Z")
I considered this, but I’m not sure there really is a “second banana” in what is essentially a two-character film. ---
**Author:** ![TCMF-2L](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tcmf-2l/32/16553_2.png) [@TCMF-2L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TCMF-2L)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2021, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057/41 "2021-09-22T11:27:43Z")
To be honest both roles are pretty much equal status but **Johnny Lee Miller** and **Benedict Cumberbatch** (both did notable modern versions of **Sherlock Holmes** ) did a stage production of Frankenstein where they alternated between portraying Dr Frankenstein and his creation. The plays were filmed and both versions were released. TCMF-2L [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/actor-goes-from-second-banana-or-other-side-role-to-lead/951057.md?page=3)