# AD&Ders: Killed the tarrasque? How? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 2, 2002, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515 "2002-10-02T09:47:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/1 "2002-10-02T09:47:36Z")
For those who don’t know AD&D, the tarrasque is an uber-beast, capable of devouring whole cities and nigh impossible to kill. So, has anyone faced one and lived to tell? Have any GMs screwed up badly enough to let you kill one? ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/2 "2002-10-02T14:37:36Z")
yup yup, I killed one. Dumb luck, really. It wasn’t even my character. See, I was standing in for someone who couldn’t play their character that day. Since I was available, I stood in for him. As luck would have it, they were in the middle of an epic battle with the tarrasque. At least, it WOULD have been an epic battle. I made use of the only weapon I had with a reasonable chance of hitting it, a Dart of the Hornets Nest. A DotHN is a magical dart that splits into multiple darts when thrown. My rolls for multiples, the number that hit, and damage were simply phenomenal; as I recall, the dart split into 94 darts, almost all of which hit for near-maximum damage. So, with that one shot, the tarrasque was reduced below -30 hit points. Another character Wished it dead, and we were rich rich rich! ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/3 "2002-10-02T14:38:26Z")
I was in a party once that got too powerful for its own good, and in the interests of having a fight that could even remotely challenge us, the GM had us fight a Tarrasque by changing the “have to use a Wish to hurt it” feature to “have to kill it in one melee round”, i.e., a full, automatic Heal at the beginning of every round. Took us three rounds. The campaign didn’t last much longer. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/4 "2002-10-02T14:57:50Z")
Oh, well… Personally, my opinion of it was that, like Godzilla, you never kill the Tarrasque. Just let it go back into the ocean. Speaking of which, anyone grab the OA issue of Dragon last year? Giant Monster goodness. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/5 "2002-10-02T15:59:20Z")
Oh, the Tarrasque isn’t anything much. Its when you start fighting servants of Gods (and they may be powerful, but just servants) that have several thousand HP and do that much a round in damage that you know you hit the big time. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/6 "2002-10-02T16:17:33Z")
Two Tarrasque-killing methods: 1. Get a mid-level (11th-level should do) rogue with a ring of flying and a ring of blinking and a scroll of wish and a Heward’s Handy Haversack and a buttload of acid flasks. The rogue should have all sorts of ranged-attack feats and Use Magic Device out the wazoo. The ring of blinking lets each attack be sneak-attack damage; the ring of flying keeps the rogue out of the Tarrasque’s reach; the HHH allows flasks to be drawn as a free action, allowing for multiple attacks each round; and the flasks themselves are touch attacks, almost impossible to miss with. 2. This one I credit to Caliban, from the ENBoards, and it’s beautiful: Get a midlevel enchanter (13th-level should do fine), who puts all her spells into casting Dominate on stirges. Once you’ve got fifty or so, lead them to the Tarrasque. They need touch attacks to attach to the tarrasque, and there’s no way it can kill them all before they drain it dry. Cast wish from a scroll. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/7 "2002-10-02T18:04:40Z")
[/quote] …and a buttload of acid flasks. [/quote] Isn’t the big T immune to acid? At least, so I seem to recall. The thing about the Tarrasque is that it’s difficult to kill, but it’s not all that great on offense. So if you can find some way to neutralize it, you can deal with it at your leasure. The Tarrasque’s strengths are, as I recall (books at home): Immune to fire, acid, and poison Immune to all ray, line, or cone spells, as well as magic missiles Regenerates 40 hp per round, all damage subdual Saves sufficiently high that it’s got a slim chance of failing a maximum-level Will save, and guaranteed to make Reflex or Fortitude Natural armor sufficent to give a max-level warrior about a 50-50 chance of hitting Damage reduction 20/+5 Over 800 hp On the other hand, it has two key weaknesses: It has no ranged abilities of any sort, and it’s stupid. So, we need things that don’t allow saves, and ignore natural armor. First, you use Reverse Gravity to levitate it, so it can’t come chasing you, and doesn’t have the leverage to easily attack. Only save allowed is a Reflex to attempt to grab a secure handhold, but no handhold is going to be secure enough to hold the T. Then, you use Flight or the equivalent on your party, and have your cleric cast Harm on him. Touch attack, so it bypasses the armor for an almost guaranteed hit, and no save. Finally, your warrior or sneak-attacking rogue finishes him off with a brilliant weapon (ignores armor and nat. armor). Wish from the source of your choice. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/8 "2002-10-02T18:40:30Z")
Subdual? Will, Reflex, Fortitude? What ever happened to Poison/Paralyzation/Death Ray, Petrification/Polymorph, Rod/Staff/Wand, Dragon Breath, and Spell? Damage reduction? You kids with your crazy new editions. We had our tarrasque in the Monster Manual 2 with the first edition of AD&D and we LIKED it. None of this Monstrous Compendium stuff from second edition or these whatchamajiggers you have in your nineteeth edition. No sir. Kids. Bah. We rolled 3d6 for our stats and LIKED it! And in sequential order, too! And it didn’t go Str Dex Con Int Wis Cha, hell no! It went Str Int Wis Dex Con Cha, like in the original D&D game! And after you rolled your stats, you found out what classes you were eligible for! Maybe your highest stat was an 11, and that was your Strength! Too bad! The prime req for a fighter is 9 str, and you can damn well be a fighter! Now get in front of the mage who has 13 intelligence and is struggling to cast a spell! None of this “Well, I want to be a paladin, so I get to roll 9d6 for my charisma and pick the top three…” None of this “Well, I get 85 points to distribute among my six stats…” None of this min/maxing powerplaying hoohah. In my day, when we wanted to kill a tarrasque, we had to get the DM (and it ain’t a GM, you namby-pamby new-age freak! Yer playing DUNGEONS and Dragons, not GAMES and Dragons! Sheesh! Kids!) nice and drunk, and then tell him “No, remember, we killed the tarrasque five minutes ago. You were just about to roll for its treasure hoard.” And half the time he wouldn’t believe us, so we’d have to pour more rubbing alcohol in his drink! Bah. Buncha kids. And don’t get me started on kits. ---
**Author:** ![Balance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ccd318/32.png) [@Balance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balance)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/9 "2002-10-02T19:09:06Z")
\ I was part of a party that took on the tarrasque back in the 2nd Ed days. Against all advice, our leader used one of our two available wishes to wish that my mage’s next spell would penetrate all of the creature’s defenses…then had me polymorph it into a rabbit. For quite some time, he was “Little Bunny Trapspringer” on an adamantine leash–we sent him down corridors ahead of us to eat traps, glyphs, and the like. This fun lasted until he hit a dead magic zone (i.e. the DM got tired of the joke), and my spell went pfffftt. Trust me on this: The only thing worse than a tarrasque is a _humiliated_ tarrasque. We did eventually kill it–multiple massive Ice Storms combined with the Ranger from Hell finally chipped it down to the point where we could use that carefully hoarded second wish on it. One of the lesser mages did have to teleport back to base for more scrolls and arrows, though. ---
**Author:** ![Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/10 "2002-10-02T19:50:02Z")
Bah. Amateurs. I once had a halfling thief lop off Orcus’ head with a Vorpal sword. Now _that’s_ an accomplishment! ---
**Author:** ![SisterCoyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@SisterCoyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SisterCoyote)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/11 "2002-10-02T20:19:07Z")
Well… I wasn’t part of the party, but friends of mine once took on a minimal tarrasque. You had to get it to -15 and _want_ it dead. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Mad\_Hermit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5ac83/32.png) [@The\_Mad\_Hermit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Mad_Hermit)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/12 "2002-10-02T20:24:48Z")
**lno** is right. 2nd edition is classic D&D, the monstrosity Wizards of the Coast has out as the “Third Edition” is just a way to make money from everyone who bought all the books previously, and to make their stamp on the game. It was just fine previously. I used a Tarrasque in a Planescape setting. The party had been thrown to the Mazes for starting a riot in the streets. In the maze, there was a dark village of other victims, who could leave anytime- but they had to defeat a Tarrasque first. (This “tarrasque” was a construct of the Lady of Pain. placed there for the purpose of keeping the victims in the maze, but showing them an unattainable way out.) My players had a tough job- they had to ally with evil monsters to have a chance of defeating the monster. There was a tough battle, but they managed to defeat the monster with coordinated attacks- it was in a round cave, on a platform above unknown depths- they did a good job with the planning and execution. They discovered that the portal out of the Mazes was the tarrasque’s mouth! I have an illustration I did in Photoshop [here- this is the first view of the monster,](http://www.geocities.com/dmdoug66/mazes1.html) and here it is after wakeup- [notice the portal.](http://www.geocities.com/dmdoug66/tarrasque3.JPG) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2002, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/13 "2002-10-02T20:34:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Chronos \* > \*\*Isn’t the big T immune to acid? At least, so I seem to recall. > \*\* Not in 3E (sorry, **Ino** – I didn’t realize that they allow roleplaying games out at the Senior Center!) From the [System Reference Document](http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html): > [@](#): > > Immunities (Ex): The tarrasque has fire, poison, and disease immunity. Now, for further disappointment, your harm trick is far from a foolproof technique. Why? > [@](#): > > Special Qualities: Damage reduction 25/+5, carapace, immunities, regeneration 40, scent, **SR 32** (emphasis added). In other words, your 20th-level cleric will have to roll 12 or better on a d20 in order to overcome the tarrasque’s spell resistance. And if the cleric fails, he’s going to be standing right next to a very unhappy lizard-beetle-monster. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![serious](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a698b9/32.png) [@serious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/serious)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2002, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/14 "2002-10-03T03:13:07Z")
Heh. You haven’t truly lived until you go 1st edition Pantheon Poaching through the Dieties and Demigods book. Why, it once took my 29th/25th level thief/magic-user a mere afternoon to finish off the whole Norse pantheon. Terrasque, feh, not even worth the effort of drawing the sword to off that one. The only one that really gave me trouble was the Sumerian pantheon, had to finish off Marduk by setting up a trap with a hole of annihilation and a bag of holding while magic jarring myself to safety into a nearby diamond ring to hide from the resultant explosion. Had to wait in that damn ring for 300 years before getting rescued by a passing interplanar rift. 3rd edition is for twinks. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2002, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/15 "2002-10-03T03:55:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Steelerphan \* > \*\ ***lno** is right. 2nd edition is classic D&D, the monstrosity Wizards of the Coast has out as the “Third Edition” is just a way to make money from everyone who bought all the books previously, and to make their stamp on the game. It was just fine previously. \*\* I hate to turn this into a 2E vs. 3E arguement but I think you’re mistaken. 3E has sold like hotcakes and has helped bring many new people into the hobby. I know a lot of people who weren’t introduced to D&D until 3E. Granted most of them are in their late teens or early 20’s. I know very few people who enjoy 2E over 3E. Most of the complaints I’ve heard revolve around 3E not being enough like older editions by people who are so entrenched in 2E that they don’t want to change. I don’t mind that WOTC released 3E as an effort to make money. They released a better product IMO. Marc ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2002, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/16 "2002-10-03T04:54:27Z")
2E? Bah! 2E sucked! 1E was barely tolerable! D&D was where it was at, not this _A_D&D stuff! Bah! We liked it in the old days, when there were only seven kinds of characters! Fighter, magic-user, cleric, thief, or halfling, dwarf, elf! And the demihumans were level-capped, too! None of this mixing race AND a class! Feh! Kids these days! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2002, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/17 "2002-10-03T23:59:43Z")
Yeah, I forgot about the spell resistance. But the reverse gravity trick still works to immobilize it. And even without acid immunity (which I personally would include, were I DMing), how many acid flasks can a Handy Haversack hold, anyway? I seriously doubt that it would be enough to finish off 800 HP worth of 40 regen monster. And I’m using Third Edition rules: While they may be a bit oversimplified in places, they’re far more self-consistent and comprehensible than Second. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2002, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/18 "2002-10-04T00:28:59Z")
Tarrasque? Feh. Tarrasques are only impressive if you’re still under 20th level. You want challenging, take a gander at the monsters in the Epic Level Handbook. My favorite is the Atropal, Undead Abortion of the Gods. Basically a garagantuan, rotting, black fetus that’s so intensely evil, anything with ten or fewer HD that sees it instantly falls over dead and rises a minute later as a spectre under the Atropal’s control. And when you’re done with those monsters, you can always pick up the d20 version of Call of Cthulhu. What do you do with a party of four forty-fifth level super-characters? Put 'em up against Azathoth (CR: 50) and watch 'em get slaughtered. ---
**Author:** ![Grelby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a5b964/32.png) [@Grelby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grelby)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2002, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ad-ders-killed-the-tarrasque-how/130515/19 "2002-10-04T02:15:53Z")
I prefer 2nd edition for the books, most rules, and huge availability of other resources, but… The 3rd edition combat system absolutely blows the earlier edition away. It’s finally possible to calculate hits, misses and damage at a reasonable pace. The old combat system sucked. The obvious solution is to play 2nd ed with 3rd ed combat ;).