# Adding a "Pronouns" custom user field? Good idea, or the worst idea? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [October 10, 2022, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025 "2022-10-10T18:00:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2022, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/41 "2022-10-10T21:53:26Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > But you seen to be saying you’d intentionally use the incorrect pronoun even after knowing. That’s a problem, regardless of where the person makes their pronouns known. Exactly. I will use they, regardless of what they prefer. But no, it’s not a problem. > [@](#): > > There’s nothing about neopronouns that changes the argument for why this is unacceptable. I can give you half a dozen reasons why not using neopronouns is perfectly acceptable. > [@](#): > > It still indicates a hostility towards the person in question for their chosen gender expression and identity. It still indicates you won’t afford them the basic politeness of referring to someone they way they want to be referred to. Not even close. And that’s where I stopped reading your post. Here are the reasons: 1. There are hundreds of the damned things, and more are being cranked out all the time. Can you keep track of them? I can’t. I won’t even try. 2. Do you know how the new pronouns decline? Or is that something else you’d have to look up every time you want to use one? 3. Can you remember which person gets which new pronoun? I can’t even remember who gets he and she, so pretty much everybody gets they. That is how things will continue. 4. The singular they is perfectly generic. It goes with anybody. 5. Otherkin. Otterself. 'Nuff said. 6. Neopronouns go against the entire point of having pronouns. Pronouns are generic words meant to take the place of proper nouns so that the speaker can make their point quickly and cleanly. If the pronouns are specific toward a particular person, then you might as well just use the proper noun. 7. Neopronouns are never going to catch on. C’mon. They’re just not. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2022, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/42 "2022-10-10T21:54:12Z")
Upthread, there was a suggestion of adding a custom field to the profile. Could it be added to “Preferences” so it appears at the foot of each post much like the Custom Title is at the top? ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2022, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/43 "2022-10-10T21:57:33Z")
Unlikely. The default setup is that you click on someone’s name, and their card pops up. On your card, the pronouns would appear under California. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/44 "2022-10-11T00:23:30Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > And, yes, treat fake pronouns as trolling and/or misgendering. So, you want the posters and mods to determine what is acceptable on how to refer to oneself? How about it’s none of your business how someone identifies? ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/45 "2022-10-11T00:58:03Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > It’s too soon to experiment with this. If nobody experiments with it, won’t that guarantee that it’s always “too soon” to do it? > [@puzzlegal](#): > > I run/help administer several discord sites that let users select a pronoun. There’s a list, and one of the options is to contact an administrator to add additional options. Users may select as many of the pronouns on the list as they like, or select none, or select “any pronoun”. People who don’t want to state a pronoun would effectively putting themselves into the category of “any”, in any case, wouldn’t they? Isn’t that just where we are now – most people don’t give pronouns, so people who are going to use a pronoun guess; and, if they get it wrong, the misgendered person either corrects them – which can only be done by giving a pronoun – or lets it slide on by, in effect accepting any pronoun. > [@Ludovic](#): > > It’s plausible that trolls would often change and/or create custom genders to be able to act indignant when people don’t follow them. We have had trolls that chose deliberately ambiguous usernames, then when someone used he or she in regards to them, troll-responded with “how dare you assume what gender I am?” , but never clarifying what gender they _did_ want to be called. On purpose. In order to troll. So if it can be done as things are now, how does allowing people to state pronouns change that? > [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > > [@dolphinboy](#): > > > > How can we guarantee there won’t be some kind of stigma attached to someone who doesn’t want to share? > > Can I just say that I’ve never see anyone stigmatized or treated as transphobic for not entering their pronouns in an optional field. I’m on another site that allows stating pronouns in a highly visible fashion. Some people do, some people don’t. I’ve never seen anybody complain about it either way. There’s no list; you just write in what you want to use. That also allows a bit of explanation: “female, but gender-neutral’s OK” fits in the space. – you can currently put your pronouns in your profile here; but that requires anybody wondering which to use to go look at your profile, and since most people don’t seem to do that they might not even think to look there. > [@DrDeth](#): > > In other words, before replying or quoting any poster, or even mentioning, we will have to carefully check a posters profile? I think the idea is that, if the field’s filled in, it would be visible at the top of each post. (Somewhat hijacky: I’d really like to see a location there. A really vague location if you want, but at least which continent people are on – in a number of threads it’s relevant, and most people don’t bother to explain. You can fill in a location field in discourse, but it doesn’t show unless you click on the poster, and most people haven’t done it.) > [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > The default setup is that you click on someone’s name, and their card pops up. On your card, the pronouns would appear under California. OK. I don’t think that’s going to work, any more than the location field works. We just couldn’t get enough people to do it, and almost nobody appears to know to look there: despite multiple threads in various forums trying to publicize it. > [@I Locationed - Have you? A thread with a Community Benefit](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-locationed-have-you-a-thread-with-a-community-benefit/925454): > > Hi folks - Just like vBulletin, Discourse has a place for you to enter your location. Which will be displayed if somebody clicks on your avatar. Try mine and look just below the big pink/purple L. Back in vBulletin most of us put something in the location in our profile. Some as a joke, most as legit info. During the conversion to Discourse that info was not transferred. So nearly everybody now has a blank location. And nearly everybody doesn’t know that, and also doesn’t know that they can… > [@Is there any way to show "location" anymore?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-there-any-way-to-show-location-anymore/925378/7): > > I like that idea. I would encourage you to do that and would be willing to help with it if you need any. > [@Poster location not transferred with our move](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/poster-location-not-transferred-with-our-move/917202): > > It seems that the location posters had in their profile on the old dope were not brought along with us to this new place. You can add your location in your profile and I have done that and now it comes up when someone clicks my avatar. So, I would like to encourage everyone to add their location (or their witty remark that they had in the location field). So many times, knowing someone’s state at least or part of the country would help in understanding a post, so I’d love it if informative lo… – for what it’s worth, I’ve got my location in the popup and my pronouns in my profile. ETA: and you know what? My pronouns are now showing up in the popup. I didn’t do anything further about that; I just had them in the “about” field in my profile. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/46 "2022-10-11T01:04:32Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > – for what it’s worth, I’ve got my location in the popup and my pronouns in my profile. > popup. I didn’t do anything further about that; I just had them in the “about” field in my profile. You can also stick 'em in the Name field if you want. You can check my card so see how that looks. ETA: just added a length test. Looks like 18 displayable characters after Pronouns:, though you’ll see the whole string on the full profile. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/47 "2022-10-11T01:06:46Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > You can also stick 'em in the Name field if you want. You can check my card so see how that works. Aha! Shows up about the same degree of visibility, either way. (but you’re not located . . . ) ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/48 "2022-10-11T01:08:58Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > (but you’re not located . . . ) That’s by design. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/49 "2022-10-11T01:09:59Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > So if it can be done as things are now, how does allowing people to state pronouns change that? It doesn’t change things. All in all I would be more for a pronoun field than against it, even though I don’t take advantage of it on the one forum I am in where it is used. I was just saying that it isn’t a ludicrous idea that the field would be abused by trolls. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/50 "2022-10-11T02:04:27Z")
Dunno about using on the Dope. As for codifying a rule with someone that deliberately mis-genders a poster, I think that’s probably covered under the “don’t be a jerk” rule In real life, however, it is inclusive to use preferred pronouns because people prefer it. Or as my trans son educated me a couple of years ago. He thought the preferred pronouns on an email signature line was a little unnatural, but on the other hand being the only person in his high school asking for he/him usage was a giant blinking neon light making him effectively announcing to the “world” that he was trans on every email. As opposed to simply blending in with everyone with what is becoming standard in the corporate world and with anyone under 30 years old. IMHO it isn’t a lot different from asking folks to use “Bob” instead of “Robert” or I go by my middle name of “John” instead of my first name. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/51 "2022-10-11T02:16:51Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > I was just saying that it isn’t a ludicrous idea that the field would be abused by trolls. There aren’t that many trolls on the board, and the ones that last are of the “not touching, can’t get mad” type. If someone wants to try and use the pronoun field to troll, it would probably just lead to them getting banned faster. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/52 "2022-10-11T02:32:18Z")
So, it looks like we already HAVE gender pronouns on this board. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/53 "2022-10-11T08:10:13Z")
> [@China\_Guy](#): > > As for codifying a rule with someone that deliberately mis-genders a poster, I think that’s probably covered under the “don’t be a jerk” rule That already is a rule. It also covers doing the same for offboard people. It’s not an instaban, but it is against the rules. While I see no need to set up something special for people to list their preferred gender, I’m not against it for those that want to use it. I don’t really see where gender would come into play in most of the threads I read. Then again, I recently discovered a 20 year poster was a he, not a she as I thought. That was a bit embarrassing. 😊 ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/54 "2022-10-11T11:18:55Z")
Omg, just add them and don’t worry about society’s assholes. It’s an anonymous board, it makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/55 "2022-10-11T11:46:00Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > You can say that, but someone may feel pressured to display their gender if everyone else is. I don’t think it’s necessary or particularly helpful. My work intranet has the option to add pronouns to one’s personal profile and email signature block (it also has a “My name is pronounced like” field). I can’t even remember if I’ve filled mine in, but there’s certainly been no pressure to do so. But here? It’s a nice idea that would likely be abused by not-nice people. But I will defer to 1) those who genuinely want to flag their personal pronouns, and 2) the mods who will likely end up with more work as a result, neither of which group I belong to. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/56 "2022-10-11T11:53:36Z")
When did pronouns become so fraught? I don’t much care one way or the other. But it would occasionally be kind of nice to know whether to say “I agree with **That\_Other\_Dope** when he said…” or “I agree with **That\_Other\_Doper** when she said…” ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/57 "2022-10-11T12:17:17Z")
Even before trans rights and pronoun declaration became a (contentious) thing, accidental misgendering has been a long-standing issue on pseudonymous message boards. If you want to refer to unknown Poster XYZ in the third person, you either have to do the dance of “I was talking to um… him/her, not sure what’s right”, or just blindly guess with a 60/50 chance of getting it wrong. This would be trivially avoided by having a blank where someone could just state their pronouns. It would become just another part of their handle. If we have no problem with people specifying their own user handle, then we should have no problems letting them specify their own pronouns. The only thing I could see genuinely being a problem is how to deal with obvious trolls using parody pronouns as attention-seeking performance art. “I have listed my pronouns as ‘beep/boop/bleep’. You can’t prove they’re not my pronouns, and I demand everyone use them, and I am definitely not making a performative point.” The correct, obvious adjudication of that would be “this is bullshit, knock it off, and quit asking unless you want to catch a ban.” But based on past observation, I think the mod team would really struggle to cut through the bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/58 "2022-10-11T12:22:32Z")
Some of the trolling problems could be avoided if the board establishes a rule that “they” could always be used as someone’s pronouns. That way someone can have beep/boop/bleep, but people could just use “they” if they didn’t want to use those pronouns or didn’t want to take the time to look them up. So basically, use either the person’s preferred pronouns or use “they”. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/59 "2022-10-11T12:32:27Z")
> [@filmore](#): > > Some of the trolling problems could be avoided if the board establishes a rule that “they” could always be used as someone’s pronouns. This makes good sense to me. An open question would be whether, realistically, there’s anyone who would sincerely object to being a “they” if they care very much about being “he” or “she”. I’m not well-steeped enough in gender issues to say, but it seems safe to assume that this wouldn’t really be an issue. Most sincere people would forgive you saying “they” in an ambiguous situation. Even more so on a pseudonymous message board, where we can take as a given that subtle trolls will purposefully inject ambiguity for their own entertainment. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2022, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025/60 "2022-10-11T12:50:17Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Nor did I say it was. But several warnings in a short period can lead to that. Even if a rule is confusing or new to you, the first warning ought to clear it up just fine. If you rapidly catch more warnings after that, then you’re purposely offending, or purposely riding the line to make a point, or you’re just not bright enough to follow community rules. Whatever the case, you earned it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/adding-a-pronouns-custom-user-field-good-idea-or-the-worst-idea/973025.md?page=4)