Advancing through the ranks by killing your superior

Official, not gonna happen.

Extraofficial, the most dangerous job in the Visigothic Kingdom was King, followed closely by “Royal advisor”, “Royal relative” and “person who just happened to be in the street when the King walked by”. It’s like GoT with worse fashion sense.

Not enough smoking hot women in chainmail underwear? :slight_smile:

I originally parsed this as “overthrowing the odd, weak, or tyrannical leader” which is not far from the truth either.

WWE?

Until the pretender declares themselves all of the power remains with the title-holder. The more they fear an attmpt on them the less likely that closely related pretenders, charismatic chancers, over-successful generals and others will be able to put themselves forward before they get neutralised. As a result the figures for attempts would be greatly suppressed by a careful and paranoid leader.

And a big cheerio to Joseph Stalin, Kim Jong Un and Caligula. We’re thinking of you.

Yeah, I think that the greatest negative effect would be more indirect. The culture of paranoia would make it harder to get things done in general, and specifically lead to a number of of competent and popular underlings getting assassinated. Which was specifically explored in the Asimov Foundation books… where the Empire didn’t actually sanction taking the throne by killing the old Emperor, but coups had become so common that Trantor culture seemed to tolerate them…

Until one of the last guys decided that he wanted loot Trantor and essentially left it in ruins.

And even in that imaginary instance, it was established that it should happen “honorably” in both pretext and manner.
As mentioned, simple ascent by removal doesn’t work IRL until you actually are yourself in a position to take over and make it stick. You kill your lieutenant to take over from him, your commander will order loyal troops to kill YOU as you are an obviously bigger threat.

Exactly. Killing the top guy and taking over can work, but openly killing anyone else to take their place would probably end up with the top guy eliminating you as a threat.

Boskone.
(No, not the SF convention in Boston, although for all I know, it may apply there too.)

For all time and all history, killing the leader is one of the easiest ways to open that position up for someone else to take it. No matter the type of government and rules involved, one thing is for certain, that person is no longer the leader.

Who exactly succeeds, that’s a different story.

I am sure there have been many situations where the person who is in line to succeed the current ruler sped things up to get in power faster.

Even in Star Trek, at least the Next Generation shows I grew up on, the Klingons talked about this a thousand times more than it ever occurred. Since every species “knew” how ruthless the Klingons were, it was probably more about intimidation than running an effective and efficient military.

Not even then, really. Underlings were quick to pounce when the higher-up got DeLametered by Kinnison, but they didn’t routinely off their leaders. Gharlane would not be pleased.

Not necessarily murder but in the workplace I have seen this countless times where subordinates will attempt to sabotage the boss and get him fired. In most cases it backfires. It has happened to me several times, unsuccessfully. I did get fired one time by a boss who thought I was after his job, I could have easily knocked him out and he knew he was vulnerable.

Yes, I know. But that seemed to be the common view of it from their enemies. But we see from when Kinnison infiltrates Thrale that it’s just like everyone says above. An underling can’t just knock off his boss at random, or the overboss will eliminate the underling. The underling has to prove to the overboss that he’s more competent than his boss.

Another poster mentioned the Ottomans. Well, in Lord Kinross’ book on The Ottoman Centuries he described what happened AFTER someone ascended the throne. First move: strangling all his brother, potential competition.

I think in terms of the question, it may be more likely for people to eliminate rivals rather than superiors. These could be within your own organization or, if you’re heading a crime family, you try to nail the other crime lords and take over their turf, maybe get their people to work for you instead.

The Yanomami.

The Amazonian Yanomami tribe are the badasses of primitive culture. They have no concept of fate, so if somebody falls ill they figure it must be someone else’s fault. This makes their society extremely violent: their tribal neighbors are terrified of them, they think they’re crazy.

At least that’s what Redmond O’Hanlon’s companion told him when he was trying to bumrush him out of the area after O’Hanlon stared at the Chief’s wife a little too long while under the influence of native hallucinogens. Book.

Anyway, how does one become a Yanomani tuxawa or headman?

Adjoining villages will often badmouth each other, which leads to good natured fights involving hard slaps to the chest, hair pulling, and wrestling in the dirt. If the insult is more serious, hard punches to the pectoral punches are traded. If one person delivers 3 blows, the other can deliver 3 blows. You’re suppose to be stoic. It’s very manly.

If slander is still more serious or if theft or wife abduction is involved, the duel uses clubs. Same rules.

So how does one become leader of these psychos? Leaders are village based: nobody rules the entire Yanomami. Gains in political power are decided by showing skill in… “settling disputes both within the village and with neighbouring communities.”

Sort of disappointing really. Apologies to the OP.

Small warrior: Let’s fight it out.

Medium warrior: Let’s trade punches in a formal duel.

Large warrior: Let’s trade club hits in a formal duel.

Galactic warrior: Let’s you and him fight.

I read this is why arab countries have such terrible military leaders because often the countries leader (ex. Gaddafi) became dictator after overthrowing the previous leader. So they therefore dont want any smart general getting the support of the troops and taking them out.

So hence, the dictator puts in relatives and patsies into military leadership roles.

Let me know what you decide because my boss’ job pays considerably more than mine.

Interesting that the real-life examples are poisoners, backstabbers and fraggers, while the fictional examples (ie: Klingons) involve formalized dueling.

Has there ever existed a culture where it was reasonably common for an underling (but perhaps not *any *underling) to challenge their immediate superior to a duel and the superior was compelled to accept?

One alleged example - the “Rex Nemorensis”: