# Advice sought on getting a first camera **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 11, 2012, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500 "2012-04-11T21:50:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2012, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/21 "2012-04-13T13:57:15Z")
> [@jabiru](#): > > Mine too! And I still have it. Cool. Can you get film and flash cubes? I remember there were some flash guns that would plug into that flash cube socket. ---
**Author:** ![jabiru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bbce88/32.png) [@jabiru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jabiru)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2012, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/22 "2012-04-15T01:30:23Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Cool. Can you get film and flash cubes? I remember there were some flash guns that would plug into that flash cube socket. Mine was the pre-flash cube type. You had to buy a box of (??) five blue bulbs, each of which was good for one shot only. I didn’t take many flash photos back in those days. 🙂 I doubt the film cartridges are available anymore, either. I just like to hang onto old stuff. ---
**Author:** ![ducati](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/cc9497/32.png) [@ducati](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ducati)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2012, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/23 "2012-04-15T20:40:52Z")
I don’t have my first camera anymore - it used 127 film and flash bulbs, but I do still have my [new one…](http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6114/6235408600_c9721771c4.jpg) Yep, Minolta 110 Bicentennial model. Still works! ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2012, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/24 "2012-04-15T21:13:33Z")
So, I decided to go with the ELPH 300. Unfortunately, B&H didn’t offer it in silver and I must confess to a superficial fondness for silver so I got it off Amazon. It’s supposed to be in my hands by Wednesday. What should someone who’s gotten his first camera and wants to take good pictures know, going forward? Presume that the only thing I know about photography is that I’m not supposed to put my finger on the flash or lens. That’s actually rather close to what I know. ---
**Author:** ![Mdcastle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@Mdcastle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mdcastle)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2012, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/25 "2012-04-15T22:07:30Z")
I know you’ve already bought a camera but in case other people have the same question it should be noted that DSLRs are not light enough to be easy to carry and not under $200 on eBay, but are the type of camera that do really well in low light, due to the large lens and image sensor. My superzoom (Canon SX20) which has a DSLR sized body but has a P&S sized image sensor gets visably noisy even at ISO 400. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/26 "2012-04-16T02:57:58Z")
Here, I am quite aware that the answer to the question I’m asking will vary according to circumstances. I am only asking for an idea in your experience: About how much ISO can one get away with on pictures that won’t be blown up to a great size? How much ISO until graininess starts to be visible? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/27 "2012-04-16T02:58:41Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > What should someone who’s gotten his first camera and wants to take good pictures know, going forward? > **[Understanding Exposure: How to Shoot Great Photographs with a Film or Digital...](https://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Exposure-Photographs-Digital-Updated/dp/0817463003)** > > Understanding Exposure: How to Shoot Great Photographs with a Film or Digital Camera (Updated Edition) \[Peterson, Bryan\] on Amazon.com. \*FREE\* shipping on qualifying offers. Understanding Exposure: How to Shoot Great Photographs with a Film or... Pick up this book, read it, and take lots and lots of photos. ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/28 "2012-04-16T03:46:36Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Here, I am quite aware that the answer to the question I’m asking will vary according to circumstances. I am only asking for an idea in your experience: > > About how much ISO can one get away with on pictures that won’t be blown up to a great size? How much ISO until graininess starts to be visible? Unfortunately this is somewhat subjective, some people dont worry or hardly notice if a bit of noise is present, others have conniptions at even the hint of it. The review I read said its pretty usable up to 800, particularly for computer monitor sized images. But with smaller sensors if you’re looking for it, it can be visible even at 100 ISO. > **[Canon ELPH 300 HS / IXUS 220 HS](https://www.cameralabs.com/canon_powershot_elph_300_hs_ixus_220_hs/)** > > The Canon ELPH 300 HS is a 12.1 Megapixel super-slim conpact with a 2.7 inch screen and a 5x stabilised optical zoom. Outside North America it's known as the IXUS 220 HS and from h Has a link to some sample pictures as well, so you can decide your own limit as a starting point. Otara ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/29 "2012-04-16T06:15:38Z")
Telemark, Otara, thanks. Having read up a bit more about exposure and the ELPH 300, I’m starting to wonder if I shouldn’t have gone with a camera that allows for manual exposure modes. The ELPH 300 only has automatic and programs. Is it possible to find (new) cameras of at least comparable quality with manual exposure modes for less than 250$? I presume that the ELPH 300 allows me to mess with the ISO at least but I haven’t been able to confirm that. If I want to take a picture of something far away that’s moving fast, do I pretty much have to accept that it’s gonna be blurred or grainy, unless there’s quite abundant light? If it’s far away the aperture has to be small and if it’s moving fast, shutter speed has to be fast, so that leaves either cranking up the ISO or somehow getting enough light with a small aperture, fast shutter speed and a low ISO. Does the latter situation commonly happen? ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/30 "2012-04-16T09:02:27Z")
Im not convinced manual is all that necessary for compacts now, but it depends what you’re trying to use it for I guess. Exposure compensation lets you change things to some extent. I have a Canon SX220 HS, which uses the same sensor, and has manual. But the lens is a longer zoom, and the flash is abysmal. Its also less wide, but obviously you do get a lot more zoom on the other end. And might be hard to find, the SX230 seems to be more common, which has GPS and is a bit more. If something is moving fast you can ‘pan’ ie follow it with the camera to reduce blur, it takes practise but can really help. In good light you can get good shots, what are you talking about? If you’re talking things like ‘bird in flight’ shots, it can be pretty tricky with a compact as the focus tends to be too slow, but there are lots of objects where its doable or where workarounds are possible, eg ‘prefocussing’. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/31 "2012-04-16T11:00:31Z")
The Canon SX150 has manual exposure for under $200, but the big lens and tiny sensor means that you won’t have great low light performance no matter what the settings. You might be able to pick up an ELPH 500 for under $200 these days and it would offer a bit better low light image quality. Manual controls are nice, but I find them difficult to use in a camera with a small form factor like these tiny models. Exposure compensation and ISO control give you a lot of flexibility. I have a camera with full manual controls (and a DSLR) but I still carry the tiny P&S more often. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/32 "2012-04-16T13:56:53Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > The Canon SX150 has manual exposure for under $200, but the big lens and tiny sensor means that you won’t have great low light performance no matter what the settings. You might be able to pick up an ELPH 500 for under $200 these days and it would offer a bit better low light image quality. > > Manual controls are nice, but I find them difficult to use in a camera with a small form factor like these tiny models. Exposure compensation and ISO control give you a lot of flexibility. I have a camera with full manual controls (and a DSLR) but I still carry the tiny P&S more often. What do “form factor” and “exposure compensation” mean? Exposure compensation must relate to shutter speed and aperture but I don’t know in what way. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/33 "2012-04-16T14:15:24Z")
Form factor is the size and shape of the camera. Small cameras (often called ultracompacts) are easy to carry around in a pocket. Compacts are a little big for a pocket, but fit well in a coat pocket for example. My point is that great image quality is no good if you don’t have the camera with you to take the picture. Small cameras generally don’t allow for a lot of buttons and menus, making it harder IMO to play with manual controls. Exposure compensation is a control that many/most Point and Shoot cameras have even if they don’t have manual control over shutter speed and aperture. You can push the exposure evaluation up or down (usually in 1/3 f/stop increments) to help you fine turn the highlights and dynamic range of the image. It’s especially important in very bright or very low light situations where the camera can get fooled as to what is the important subject. > **[Exposure compensation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exposure_compensation)** > > Exposure compensation is a technique for adjusting the exposure indicated by a photographic exposure meter, in consideration of factors that may cause the indicated exposure to result in a less-than-optimal image. Factors considered may include unusual lighting distribution, variations within a camera system, filters, non-standard processing, or intended underexposure or overexposure. Cinematographers may also apply exposure compensation for changes in shutter angle or film speed (as exposure in... ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/34 "2012-04-16T14:27:19Z")
So, exposure compensation adjusts aperture and/or shutter speed without giving me full manual control over them, right?. The ELPH 300 is capable of ±2EVs, if I increase it by 1 EV, how do I know how much aperture has been widened or shutter speed slowed down? It could be either or both which could make a significant difference depending on whether want a clear background or minimal blur on moving objects. ---
**Author:** ![Baal\_Houtham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baal_houtham/32/13604_2.png) [@Baal\_Houtham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baal_Houtham)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/35 "2012-04-16T14:28:25Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Exposure compensation and ISO control give you a lot of flexibility. I have a camera with full manual controls (and a DSLR) but I still carry the tiny P&S more often. A problem with exposure compensation is that you might have no control over the aperture, so controlling depth of field is difficult or impossible. Of course, with the huge focus depth of the tiny P&S sensors it’s not easy to isolate the foreground even with manual control. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2012, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/36 "2012-04-16T17:39:12Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > The ELPH 300 is capable of ±2EVs, if I increase it by 1 EV, how do I know how much aperture has been widened or shutter speed slowed down? It could be either or both which could make a significant difference depending on whether want a clear background or minimal blur on moving objects. Yup, that’s why it’s not called manual controls. 🙂 If you want full manual controls, you’ll need to get something that has them. These small cameras offer a lot of bang for your buck in a nice package. If you want full controls you’ll spend a bit more money and you’ll be looking at a larger camera. But something like the Canon S95 is a real nice camera, with a much larger sensor and correspondingly higher image quality and low light performance. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2012, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/37 "2012-04-19T13:53:34Z")
I am now looking for a small tripod I can easily slide in my pocket. Any advice? How about these two? [http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/754229-REG/Manfrotto\_MP1\_C01\_MP1\_C01\_Small\_Pocket\_Support.html/c/product/#inpage:IN%20STOCK](http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/754229-REG/Manfrotto_MP1_C01_MP1_C01_Small_Pocket_Support.html/c/product/#inpage:IN%20STOCK) > **[Manfrotto Modopocket Tripod : Amazon.ca: Electronics](https://www.amazon.ca/Manfrotto-797-Modopocket-Tripod/dp/B0011DIMYQ)** > > Modo Pocket is the world's smallest tripod, a result of Bogen Manfrotto's sensitivity and years of experience in the world of photography. Modo Pocket gives a wide variety of solutions for the amateur photographer, providing an answer to the need to... ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2012, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/38 "2012-04-19T16:42:27Z")
[http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821603-REG/Joby\_GP15\_0RAM\_GorillaPod\_Micro\_250\_Tripod.html](http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821603-REG/Joby_GP15_0RAM_GorillaPod_Micro_250_Tripod.html) [http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/239957-REG/Ultrapod\_PD01020\_1\_Black.html](http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/239957-REG/Ultrapod_PD01020_1_Black.html) I have the two listed above. The first one hasn’t gotten much use yet, but it is tiny and actually fits in my camera case. I’d also look at the Gorilla Pod standard size if you need more flexibility. These are mainly useful for self-portraits and taking shots with long exposures that require a steady camera. Anything more than that is out of their reach. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2012, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/39 "2012-04-19T16:53:45Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > [http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821603-REG/Joby\_GP15\_0RAM\_GorillaPod\_Micro\_250\_Tripod.html](http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/821603-REG/Joby_GP15_0RAM_GorillaPod_Micro_250_Tripod.html) > [http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/239957-REG/Ultrapod\_PD01020\_1\_Black.html](http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/239957-REG/Ultrapod_PD01020_1_Black.html) > > I have the two listed above. The first one hasn’t gotten much use yet, but it is tiny and actually fits in my camera case. I’d also look at the Gorilla Pod standard size if you need more flexibility. > > These are mainly useful for self-portraits and taking shots with long exposures that require a steady camera. Anything more than that is out of their reach. They wouldn’t be good enough for non-long exposure landscape shots? What else can other tripods do? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2012, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500/40 "2012-04-19T17:52:31Z")
They’ll be fine for shots when the conditions are nice, but I doubt they’d work perfectly in a stiff wind for example or taking a dozen timed shots over the span of several minutes. These small tripods are great tools, but they don’t replace a real tripod. Having said that, I haven’t used my real tripod in months. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/advice-sought-on-getting-a-first-camera/618500.md?page=3)