# Affirmed:Lenin really is the tits **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 2, 2010, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021 "2010-05-02T12:42:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/241 "2010-05-18T22:04:02Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > …Please…strive for more self restraint in the future. > > -XT You might try that yourself. But, I expect that you will limit your restraint to not presenting any specific parallels between Nostro’s and Nicky’s predictions as presented in my cite. > [@](#): > > Lenin enumerated the following five features characteristic of the epoch of imperialism: > > The epoch of imperialism opens when the expansion of colonialism has covered the globe and no new colonies can be acquired by the great powers except by taking them from each other, and the concentration of capital has grown to a point where finance capital becomes dominant over industrial capital. Lenin enumerated the following five features characteristic of the epoch of imperialism: > > (1) the concentration of production and capital has developed to such a high stage that it has created monopolies which play a decisive role in economic life; > (2) the merging of bank capital with industrial capital, and the creation on the basis of this “finance capital”, of a financial oligarchy; > (3) the export of capital as distinguished from the export of commodities acquires exceptional importance; > (4) the formation of international monopoly capitalist associations which share the world among themselves, and > (5) the territorial division of the whole world among the biggest capitalist powers is completed. Imperialism is capitalism at that stage of development at which the dominance of monopolies and finance capital is established; in which the export of capital has acquired pronounced importance; in which the division of the world among the international trusts has begun, in which the division of all territories of the globe among the biggest capitalist powers has been completed. [Lenin, Imperialism the Highest Stage of Capitalism, LCW Volume 22, p. 266-7.] ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/242 "2010-05-18T22:11:59Z")
Well, why should I? Let’s see: > [@](#): > > (1) the concentration of production and capital has developed to such a high stage that it has created monopolies which play a decisive role in economic life; Um, no…it hasn’t. So, BBBBUUUUZZZZZZZ! Wrong. > [@](#): > > (2) the merging of bank capital with industrial capital, and the creation on the basis of this “finance capital”, of a financial oligarchy; Right up Nicky’s ally, since it’s so vague it could mean anything. DING! Perfect Nicky like prediction! > [@](#): > > (3) the export of capital as distinguished from the export of commodities acquires exceptional importance; BUZZZ! Wrong answer. But thanks for playing Vlad! Here are some fabulous parting gifts. A brand new edition of Straight Dope, the Board Game! This wonderful potted plant (both decorative and useful if dried out,ground up and put into a water pipe!). A wonderful ceramic dog! Let’s give Vlad a big hand, folks! He’s dead, stuffed AND a mass murdering bastard with the predictive powers of a nat, but he’s been a real swell contestant! _golf clap_ Thanks again Vlad… > [@](#): > > (4) the formation of international monopoly capitalist associations which share the world among themselves, and This one was for comic effect, right? In any case, vague AND wrong is the bread and butter of such predictions. > [@](#): > > 1. the territorial division of the whole world among the biggest capitalist powers is completed. Imperialism is capitalism at that stage of development at which the dominance of monopolies and finance capital is established; in which the export of capital has acquired pronounced importance; in which the division of the world among the international trusts has begun, in which the division of all territories of the globe among the biggest capitalist powers has been completed. Right on the nose here and…ok, I’m kidding. Another complete horseshit prediction that is wrong. I’d say that Nicky is definitely in the running, especially if one is willing to stand on ones head, squint through one eye and play with the language to the full extent possible and MAKE the predictions true, even when they are complete horseshit. But thanks for the laugh here…I needed it today. -XT ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/243 "2010-05-18T22:23:36Z")
**xtisme** , you’re shamefully wrong. The word is spelled _gnat_. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/244 "2010-05-18T22:26:02Z")
:smack: My only excuse is I’m currently working on a NAT table, and somehow I just went with it… I shamefully concede total defeat in the face of overwhelming evidence and will slink away to lick my router and await another debate… -XT ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/245 "2010-05-18T23:03:49Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > … But thanks for the laugh here…I needed it today. > > -XT Bro, (if I do not presume. Who could imagine that we have the same parents?) You be welcome. And laugh away. Another poster on this thread can teach you a few things about self-parody but he generally limits himself to a line or two at a time albeit time after time after time. Not quite a model of restraint, but I digress. Try responding to my direct question. Please present … > [@](#): > > … any specific parallels between Nostro’s and Nicky’s predictions as presented in my cite. For those who can hand wave this nonsense to the back burner, I (as presented in my cite) continue. > [@](#): > > "[Imperialism] is something quite different from the old free competition between manufacturers, scattered and out of touch with one another, and producing for an unknown market. Concentration [of production] has reached the point at which it is possible to make an approximate estimate of all sources of raw materials (for example, the iron ore deposits)… [throughout] the whole world. Not only are such estimates made, but these sources are captured by gigantic monopolist associations [now called multi-national conglomerates]. An approximate estimate of the capacity of markets is also made, and the associations “divide” them up amongst themselves by agreement. Skilled labor is monopolized, the best engineers are engaged; the means of transport are captured – railways in America, shipping companies in Europe and America. Capitalism in its imperialist stage leads directly to the most comprehensive socialization of production; it, so to speak, drags the capitalists, against their will and consciousness, into some sort of a new social order, a transitional one from complete free competition to complete socialization. I will not debate this. Anyone who disagrees should practice total restraint or I may report you. Any rational discussion of the amazing similarity between what Nicky was talking about in 1916 and what is shitting on our heads today is welcome. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/246 "2010-05-18T23:14:24Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > **xtisme** , you’re shamefully wrong. > > The word is spelled _gnat_. > [@xtisme](#): > > :smack: My only excuse is I’m currently working on a NAT table, and somehow I just went with it… > > I shamefully concede total defeat in the face of overwhelming evidence and will slink away to lick my router and await another debate… > > -XT You are both excused. But XT, please keep in mind that all Lenin was saying is, you can run but you can’t hide from the Global Kleptocracy. His mistake was in thinking he could fight it on its own terms. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/247 "2010-05-18T23:36:42Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > And laugh away. Another poster on this thread can teach you a few things about self-parody but he generally limits himself to a line or two at a time albeit time after time after time. Not quite a model of restraint, but I digress. I do _hope_ you’re talking about me, although frankly you accusing _anyone_ of self-parody in this thread is equally ironic and humorous. > [@adhay](#): > > I will not debate this. Anyone who disagrees should practice total restraint or I may report you. Any rational discussion of the amazing similarity between what Nicky was talking about in 1916 and what is shitting on our heads today is welcome. I disagree. _Please_, report me. Although this _is_ the forum for witnessing, you do not have the authority to require everyone else in the thread to _join_ you in your witnessing. Disagreeing with you is not against forum rules. If you _must_ have an echo chamber for whatever reason, perhaps you should be posting this stuff on a personal blog? (Be sure to disallow comments.) And communism _is_ Kleptocracy, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2010, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/248 "2010-05-18T23:54:35Z")
[QUOTE=adhay] Try responding to my direct question. Please present … [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > … any specific parallels between Nostro’s and Nicky’s predictions as presented in my cite. So, what you want is a bullshit list of predictions that I’ll just assert to be true because, well, I asserted it, correct? I mean, that’s exactly what you did, no? Unfortunately, I’d be lying if I so asserted, since I think Nicky was as full of shit as Vlad was. However, [here](http://science.discovery.com/top-ten/2009/nostradamus-predictions/nostradamus-predictions.html) is a list of the top 10 Nostradamus predictions (thoughtfully debunked for your viewing pleasure…to bad you don’t seem to get the joke). > [@](#): > > Anyone who disagrees should practice total restraint or I may report you I’ll probably get in trouble (again) for a Star Wars reference, but, to paraphrase Yoda: Do or do not…there is no threat of reportage, my young Padawan. If you feel you must report someone, don’t threaten to do so…just go ahead and report them and we’ll let the chips fall as they may. You can go ahead and report me, because I think this prediction, like your others, is completely full of fecal matter. It’s standard, grade A1 communist claptrap and horseshit, and it’s sad that you THINK it actually says anything substantial, let alone predictive. -XT ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/249 "2010-05-19T00:05:29Z")
If anyone needs help deciphering this 94 yo document served here to you courtesy of Google and Microsoft, I’ll make a suggestion. Lenin (cited above): > [@](#): > > Concentration [of production] has reached the point at which it is possible to make an approximate estimate of all sources of raw materials (for example, the **iron ore** deposits) bolding mine. Try substituting **crude**. Somehow, it all falls into place. IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/250 "2010-05-19T00:20:29Z")
[QUOTE=adhay] Try substituting crude. [/QUOTE] 😛 Why crude? Well, because as with the Nicky predictions, a bit of judicious change-age of the prediction really makes tends to enhance the image of the supposed sage, right? The irony, of course, is that Lenin DID think that iron would become scarce (or a monopolized resource, horded by Capitalists who would increasingly fight over it until only one emerged victorious and in complete control), but that his main point really revolved around production (and the ‘means’ there of). But ok…let’s substitute ‘crude’ for ‘iron ore deposits’. “Concentration [of production] has reached the point at which it is possible to make an approximate estimate of all sources of raw materials (for example, the crude oil)”. Crude oil production is ‘concentrated’ only in so far as it’s a relatively scarce resource (unlike iron ore, which is pretty much all over the place, globally speaking ;)), so naturally it’s ‘concentrated’. Production is also ‘concentrated’, in so far as it takes a large capital investment to build a large scale refinery. However, new sources of crude oil are still being discovered, and previously untapped resources (due to greater cost in extraction) are coming on stream as the price of crude oil slowly rises. What about this statement by Lenin strikes you as interesting? What ‘falls into place’ for you here? Please, no crypto-babble or disjointed rambling…try to be concise. What about this strikes a cord with you, and what about the current crude oil industry seems to resonate with you and your view of what Lenin was actually getting at there? I ask because I don’t think you actually are tracking on what he was really saying there, to be honest, and so I’d like to hear your take on what YOU think he was saying and why you think it’s important…or even vaguely interesting. -XT ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/251 "2010-05-19T00:25:08Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > If anyone needs help deciphering this 94 yo document served here to you courtesy of Google and Microsoft, I’ll make a suggestion. Lenin (cited above):bolding mine. > > Try substituting **crude**. > > Somehow, it all falls into place. IMHO. I have no idea what picture you think you’re assembling, but I’m fairly certain our ability to estimate untapped oil reserves comes from improvements in science and surveying techniques, not because we can count the heads of OPEC. Not that OPEC is composed of _companies_ persay… ETA - just saw **xtisme** ’s last post, and I agree with him: I think that the main reason you’r seeing so many startling coincidences in Lenin is because you’re misreading Lenin, and injecting all sorts of stuff in there that Lenin didn’t actually say. Kind of how if I look at a green car and perceive it as blue, it has an amazing resemblance to the sky. Especially if I don’t notice that the sky is clouded over. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/252 "2010-05-19T00:33:35Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > I do _hope_ you’re talking about me, although frankly you accusing _anyone_ of self-parody in this thread is equally ironic and humorous. > > I disagree. _Please_, report me. OK. And to whom? > [@](#): > > Although this _is_ the forum for witnessing, you do not have the authority to require everyone else in the thread to _join_ you in your witnessing. I invite others to leave. The point is that Lenin, _in this one instance_, is an honest witness to the pervasive Corporate Kleptocracy takeover of every govt on the planet that was going on in 1916 and has come to perfect fruition in the good old USA, Today, Ta, da. > [@](#): > > Disagreeing with you is not against forum rules. Oh, do I wish it were. How easily could we overcome ignorance. > [@](#): > > If you _must_ have an echo chamber for whatever reason, perhaps you should be posting this stuff on a personal blog? (Be sure to disallow comments.) You may consider yours disallowed. > [@](#): > > And communism _is_ Kleptocracy, isn’t it? Close. Corporate Communism Is Kleptocracy, ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/253 "2010-05-19T00:40:23Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > You may consider yours disallowed. I don’t give two shits what you want. > [@adhay](#): > > Close. > > Corporate Communism Is Kleptocracy, What do you imagine the term ‘Corporate Communism’ means or refers to? I note that Lenin also spoke of the capitalists waking up one morning and suddenly discovering themselves in a socialist economy (‘Oh my god where did my private ownership of property go!’), but that was complete nonsense coming from him, so I’d like to hear your take on it. Not so much because I think you can make sense out of it, but because I would like to give you an opportunity to review your own position and discover for yourself why it’s incoherent. (They do say that teaching is the best way to learn, after all.) ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/254 "2010-05-19T00:41:09Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > 😛 > -XT I can’t believe how fast you put that out. How many monkeys on keyboards you got working for you? Do you pay taxes? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/255 "2010-05-19T01:09:09Z")
_swims closer_ Ooohhhh…shiny. And it’s got bright colored string on it too. Maybe just a small bite… Nope. Can’t do it. Not going to go for it. Nope. Not me. _puts fins firmly behind back_ Not going too…it IS rather shiny though. Just a small bite? Maybe just a nibble? Naw… -XT ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/256 "2010-05-19T02:39:12Z")
Moving on. > [@](#): > > “Production becomes social, but appropriation remains private. The social means of production remain the private property of a few. The general framework of formally recognized free competition remains, and the yoke of a few monopolists on the rest of the population becomes a hundred times heavier, more burdensome and intolerable.” (p. 205) > > “The development of capitalism has arrived at a stage when, although commodity production still “reigns” and continues to be regarded as the basis of economic life, it has in reality been undermined and the bulk of the profits go to the “geniuses” of financial manipulation. At the basis of these manipulations and swindles lies socialized production; but the immense progress of mankind, which achieved this socialization, goes to benefit… the speculators.” (p. 206-207) Hardly hyperbolic when applied to 21st century Wall Street. ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/257 "2010-05-19T06:12:08Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > … What do you imagine the term ‘Corporate Communism’ means or refers to? I note that Lenin also spoke of the capitalists waking up one morning and suddenly discovering themselves in a socialist economy (‘Oh my god where did my private ownership of property go!’), but that was complete nonsense coming from him, so I’d like to hear your take on it. Not so much because I think you can make sense out of it, but because I would like to give you an opportunity to review your own position and discover for yourself why it’s incoherent. (They do say that teaching is the best way to learn, after all.) Today, it’s generally called Corporate Socialism, “free” enterprise for the poor and govt (taxpayer) paid for socialism for corporations. That’s when corporate profits are privatised and their losses are socialized. See if you can think of a recent example. No peeking until you’ve thought about it.Goldman Sachs ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/258 "2010-05-19T18:18:04Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > Today, it’s generally called Corporate Socialism, “free” enterprise for the poor and govt (taxpayer) paid for socialism for corporations. That’s when corporate profits are privatised and their losses are socialized. See if you can think of a recent example. No peeking until you’ve thought about it.Goldman Sachs So just to clarify, this has nothing whatsoever to do with what Lenin was talking about in this quote, then?: > [@](#): > > "[Imperialism] is something quite different from the old free competition between manufacturers, scattered and out of touch with one another, and producing for an unknown market. Concentration [of production] has reached the point at which it is possible to make an approximate estimate of all sources of raw materials (for example, the iron ore deposits)… [throughout] the whole world. Not only are such estimates made, but these sources are captured by gigantic monopolist associations [now called multi-national conglomerates]. An approximate estimate of the capacity of markets is also made, and the associations “divide” them up amongst themselves by agreement. Skilled labor is monopolized, the best engineers are engaged; the means of transport are captured – railways in America, shipping companies in Europe and America. Capitalism in its imperialist stage leads directly to the most comprehensive socialization of production; it, so to speak, drags the capitalists, against their will and consciousness, into some sort of a new social order, a transitional one from complete free competition to complete socialization. Because while I am still unclear as to what sort of socialism he was actually talking about (since it has no analogue in reality), he clearly isn’t referring to government bailouts of companies which remain private corporations afterwards. In fact, it doesn’t appear that he’s mentioned the government _at all_ here, leading one to suppose that he believes that after all the resources of all kinds in the country have been captured by a (single?) monopolist corporation, that that coportation would suddenly discover that _it itself_ had _become_ the government (and thus, its resources would have automatically become socialized). How the prior existing government was expected to react to this, aside from perhaps simply evaporating, also remains unclear to me. But at least it _is_ clear that whatever he was talking about, ain’t what _you’re_ talking about. Correct? ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/259 "2010-05-19T18:34:20Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > So just to clarify, this has nothing whatsoever to do with what Lenin was talking about in this quote, then?: > Because while I am still unclear as to what sort of socialism he was actually talking about (since it has no analogue in reality), he clearly isn’t referring to government bailouts of companies which remain private corporations afterwards. Well, here’s something I actually quoted from Imperialism in an early post. > [@](#): > > … the monopolies have never pursued the aim, nor have they had the result, of benefiting the consumer, or even of handing over to the state part of the promoter’s profits; they have served only to facilitate, at the expense of the state, the recovery of private industries which were on the verge of bankruptcy. More to the point? I’m pretty sure you’ve not read my original cite, who could reasonably expect that? But this was quoted in a post. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2010, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021/260 "2010-05-19T20:16:21Z")
> [@adhay](#): > > Well, here’s something I actually quoted from Imperialism in an early post. > > > [@](#): > > > > … the monopolies have never pursued the aim, nor have they had the result, of benefiting the consumer, or even of handing over to the state part of the promoter’s profits; they have served only to facilitate, at the expense of the state, the recovery of private industries which were on the verge of bankruptcy. > > More to the point? > > I’m pretty sure you’ve not read my original cite, who could reasonably expect that? But this was quoted in a post. You’re right, I’m _not_ interested in reading dated communist screed that you have personally gone to the trouble of proving is irrelevent by quoting various portions of it that clearly have little or no relation to modern reality - and presumably you’ve picked out what you think are the _relevent_ parts. Speaking of which, let’s look at the quote you just posted. First, monopolies pay taxes, which definitely is “handing over to the state part of the promoter’s profits”, so Vladdie-baby is 0 for 1 right out of the gate. But ignoring that let’s look at the other half of his excluded middle falacy - do monopolies “serve only” to facilitate their own bailouts from bankruptcy by the state? Is that a goal that they constantly and continuously pursue? Actually… no. Monopolies are known for a lot of shady business tactics, but ‘begging for direct cash influxes from the government’ isn’t even on the list. 0 for 2. ‘But there have been bailouts! Like, recently!’ you might exclaim. Yes, there were. A couple of them, in fact. In the last several decades. A couple. And I don’t think they were even the businesses’ idea, though don’t quote me on that. So yeah, the accuracy! It’s stunning! Or wait, the other thing. A monkey throwing darts, only less accurate. Yeah, that. Hey, tell me what you think of this statement: “Women are never born female; they instead are only born male. and become female through sex changes.” Scarily accurate, ain’t I? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affirmed-lenin-really-is-the-tits/538021.md?page=14)