# Affluence is morally corrupt (example inside) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 14, 2015, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957 "2015-03-14T03:44:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/81 "2015-03-14T23:30:17Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > You realize by this scheme you are giving away not your money, but your father’s money, and keeping yourself dependent on HIS charity? > > I have $100,000. And I have in my garage an expensive (not $100,000) car. I do give money to charity, but it isn’t my priority. My priority has been making sure that in retirement, I will be able to survive comfortably without having to rely on charity from friends, relatives, charitable organizations or the government. That my kids will go to college without needing to rely on the charity of grants, scholarships or loans. My priority is helping those closest to me, so they don’t need the charity of strangers, and charities that serve strangers are less burdened by those close to me. To this end, we owned a house that my brother in law lived in while he was dying of cancer, I’ve subsidized my daughter’s Girl Scout troop, made up of girls less advantaged than mine, with trips and events and camp, we’ve purchased uniforms for my son’s baseball team - also made up of primarily less advantaged kids, donated smartboards to our kids schools, helped finance school events, and pick up the dinner tab almost always when going out with friends. > > My husband and I have both spent the vast majority of our time working in professional jobs. I could have stayed home, but I chose to work, not to fund charity, but to make sure my kids wouldn’t need it when college came around. My husband could have put his head down and chosen a career path that wouldn’t have involved the long hours and difficult work he’s done, but he didn’t, and he’s been well compensated. And in exchange, we have some luxuries in our life. For my husband, its that car. For me, it tends to be travel. > > But hey, judge from where you are. When you are here - two kids heading towards college, retirement coming down the pike fast, it will very likely look different. > > Sorry about the depression, I suffer as well. I’ve done thousands of hours of therapy, most of it useless. One of the hours that wasn’t useless was a psychiatrist who told me “stop worrying about things you can’t change, especially human nature and the wider world - there will always be kids starving somewhere.” This sort of philosophizing - it isn’t good for people like us in our down moments - wishing the world was a different place isn’t healthy when your chemistry is on its down cycle. You may find that some version of the serenity prayer is helpful - accept the things you can’t change, change the ones you can, and hope to be able to know the difference. Please show me where I said it was wrong to provide for the needs of your family. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/82 "2015-03-14T23:32:40Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > You…really are like, 15 years old, aren’t you? Do you also believe that for ever drop of rain that falls…a flower grows? > > Why are you sitting on your ass on your daddy’s computer typing when you could be out delivering papers or working in a 7-11 or being a popcorn seller in a theater and sending 100% of your take-home pay to [sponsor a few children to help get them food and clean drinking water\* for $35/month](https://fh.org/give/sponsor). If you work 2 hours a day after school, and 8 hours on Saturday and Sunday, you’d be making about enough to sponsor about 5 children a _month_. And you’re just lazing around on your ass, you selfish little maggot. > > You’re the problem. Not the tiny fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a percent of people who have $100,000 cars: they’re such a small minority that they’re basically irrelevant. The problem is you. The guy who won’t get off his ass to actually do something he believes in. 26 hours a week of work, 5 starving kids fed/clothed/housed and given fresh water and some kind of schooling (see disclaimer in footnote). But giving up a chunk of your leisure time is just too much bother for you. So you want OTHER people to do it. > > Punk. > > \*Assuming this isn’t a scam. I know _nothing_ about this charity and don’t support or endorse it (or condemn it either): it was just the first that came up with a Google search. If they’re evil, or something, pick a better one. Do you have some type of personality disorder? You seem excessively hostile. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/83 "2015-03-14T23:35:43Z")
Do you have any idea how fast a highway repair project would eat through $100,000, much less a full building project? These things are budgeted for multi-millions or billions. A hundred grand would last a few days, and how many $100,000 cars are sold each year? (Clue: not many) Come back when you get an understanding of economics. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/84 "2015-03-14T23:38:16Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > He doesn’t have to choose as those are not mutually exclusive positions, provided you define affluence in terms of consumption rather than wealth. Which isn’t unreasonable. I know they aren’t mutually exclusive positions, they just have very little to do with one another. It was late and I was just trying to figure out what the fuck the OP was on about. It is not to me to sift through the chicken entrails of his thoughts to find coherence, and it did not become clearer as the thread continued. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/85 "2015-03-14T23:38:40Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Please show me where I said it was wrong to provide for the needs of your family. Except you think its morally bankrupt for me to do more than provide for the needs of my family. And I own a very expensive car. And I travel. And I can put two children through four years of expensive private liberal arts college. My daughter is fifteen and has been to Europe twice. In other words, I have more than it takes to simply provide for the needs of my family. At what point am I morally corrupt? Just for reference, I think you hit the point of questionable ethics the moment you spent $100 to give to charity while being dependant on your parent while complaining about the charity of others. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/86 "2015-03-14T23:41:13Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > If I had to give away all of my money over a certain sum, I’d just work less and make sure not to waste my time on earning more that amount. Sure, I’d be a less productive member of society, but why bother? Most people would. But I never said that all of persons money should be cut off once they reach a certain point. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/87 "2015-03-14T23:50:49Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Except you think its morally bankrupt for me to do more than provide for the needs of my family. And I own a very expensive car. And I travel. And I can put two children through four years of expensive private liberal arts college. My daughter is fifteen and has been to Europe twice. > > In other words, I have more than it takes to simply provide for the needs of my family. At what point am I morally corrupt? Just for reference, I think you hit the point of questionable ethics the moment you spent $100 to give to charity while being dependant on your parent while complaining about the charity of others. Hey, why attack me? Did I attack you? I knew people would attack me and ridicule me if I told the truth about my circumstances, but, I also consider it important to tell the truth so when people asked I answered. I have some very serious problems with private colleges and expensive cars. That doesn’t mean I don’t think you should be allowed to own one or to send your children to those schools. I do think that mansions and really really expensive cars are a unnecessary luxury and the moral validity of that type of consumption can be discussed by reasonable people in reasonable terms. It seems like you think I am really really attacking you and your choices in life. I’m not. Not really. I fault a system of excess and materialism more than I do (most) individuals. And the last thing I will say is I am proud of you and your children. I know it must of taken a lot of hard work for them to get accepted to those schools. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/88 "2015-03-14T23:51:15Z")
I think the OP jumps from issue to issue, or cause to cause, in the threads the OP participates in. Check out the profile. OP will make dozens of posts in a single thread, then drop it when no one else is playing. Is daddy’s house under a bridge? Plus, although the date of his joining is 2005, the first listed post is in October of 2014 ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2015, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/89 "2015-03-14T23:54:26Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > I think the OP jumps from issue to issue, or cause to cause, in the threads the OP participates in. Check out the profile. OP will make dozens of posts in a single thread, then drop it when no one else is playing. > > Is daddy’s house under a bridge? So the fact that I post erratically and have some opinions you disagree with means that you think it’s a good idea to insult me? Doesn’t your reaction really say more about you than it does about me? ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/90 "2015-03-15T00:10:33Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > So the fact that I post erratically and have some opinions you disagree with means that you think it’s a good idea to insult me? Doesn’t your reaction really say more about you than it does about me? Nope, it doesn’t!!!😃 ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/91 "2015-03-15T00:10:38Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Do you have some type of personality disorder? Coming from the 15 year old living in his daddy & mommy’s house, talking to the functioning adult who has a job and a life, this is kinda funny. Also–I noticed that you didn’t answer any question I asked: [ul] [li]Why are you on the internet, rather than getting a part time job to help feed the hungry? Doesn’t that make you morally bankrupt by your own standards?[/li][li]Do you live on the minimum healthy diet and donate all money that would go for fancier foods, or better tasting foods to the homeless? Doesn’t that make you morally bankrupt given that? [/li][li]Seen a movie recently? That’s roughly half of what it takes to feed a kid for a month. You selfish, amoral jerk. [/li][/ul] So who are you to tell anyone else what morality is when you’re immoral by your own standards? ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/92 "2015-03-15T00:26:48Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > Coming from the 15 year old living in his daddy & mommy’s house, talking to the functioning adult who has a job and a life, this is kinda funny. > > Also–I noticed that you didn’t answer any question I asked: > > [ul] > [li]Why are you on the internet, rather than getting a part time job to help feed the hungry? Doesn’t that make you morally bankrupt by your own standards?[/li][li]Do you live on the minimum healthy diet and donate all money that would go for fancier foods, or better tasting foods to the homeless? Doesn’t that make you morally bankrupt given that? [/li][li]Seen a movie recently? That’s roughly half of what it takes to feed a kid for a month. You selfish, amoral jerk. [/li][/ul] > > So who are you to tell anyone else what morality is when you’re immoral by your own standards? Wow? Why are you so defensive? Why are you so hostile? And BTW I never said people shouldn’t be able to have and enjoy basic everyday pleasures. My point is there is something morally wrong with excessive luxury when so many people have real problems and real suffering. If all you have to add to the discussion is personal insults and other similar attacks then I’m not going to bother responding. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/93 "2015-03-15T01:13:03Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Did I attack you? Yes, you have attacked a number of people here, even if you appear to be oblivious to what you’ve done. You can sit there and say you mean nothing personal by what you’re saying. But when you declare that you think something is morally corrupt, you’re also declaring that the people who do it are also morally corrupt. Don’t be surprised when people take offense to that. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Why\_Bother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e19adc/32.png) [@Doctor\_Why\_Bother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Why_Bother)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/94 "2015-03-15T01:22:20Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > Do you have some type of personality disorder? You seem excessively hostile. Nah, he’s just an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/95 "2015-03-15T02:04:29Z")
Cute attempt at a rhetorical trick, kid, but you STILL haven’t answered a single question. Look…it comes down to this: by your idiot “philosophy”, if you’ve EVER spent money on anything beyond basic survival, you’re an amoral child-murderer. So do you EVER spend time or money on non-essential stuff? Yes or no? ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/96 "2015-03-15T02:09:25Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > Cute attempt at a rhetorical trick, kid, but you STILL haven’t answered a single question. > > Look…it comes down to this: by your idiot “philosophy”, if you’ve EVER spent money on anything beyond basic survival, you’re an amoral child-murderer. So do you EVER spend time or money on non-essential stuff? Yes or no? so how do you get from: excessive luxury is immoral when so many people suffer to: if you’ve EVER spent money on anything beyond basic survival, you’re an amoral child-murderer ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/97 "2015-03-15T02:12:29Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Yes, you have attacked a number of people here, even if you appear to be oblivious to what you’ve done. > > You can sit there and say you mean nothing personal by what you’re saying. But when you declare that you think something is morally corrupt, you’re also declaring that the people who do it are also morally corrupt. Don’t be surprised when people take offense to that. Good point. But if I actually do think owning a 100K car is immoral, then how else am I supposed to express that except by stating it directly? ---
**Author:** ![excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e8c25b/32.png) [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/excavating_for_a_mind)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/98 "2015-03-15T02:26:47Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > so how do you get from: > excessive luxury is immoral when so many people suffer > to: > if you’ve EVER spent money on anything beyond basic survival, you’re an amoral child-murderer This is easy. There is no measure of excessive. Any luxury at all can be viewed as excessive, so any amount of money you spend for your own personal enjoyment is taking the food out of the mouths of starving children. In fact, your living with your father instead of working to provide for your own room and board is preventing your father from allowing these starving children to have a chance to live. How selfish your are! That is the flaw in your whole schtick. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/99 "2015-03-15T02:33:37Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > This is easy. There is no measure of excessive. Any luxury at all can be viewed as excessive, so any amount of money you spend for your own personal enjoyment is taking the food out of the mouths of starving children. In fact, your living with your father instead of working to provide for your own room and board is preventing your father from allowing these starving children to have a chance to live. How selfish your are! > > That is the flaw in your whole schtick. Spartan\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_Excessive Spartan\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_X\_Excessive Spartan\_\_\_\_X\_\_\_\_\_Excessive Spartan\_X\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_Excessive Yes, there will be debate about where to draw the line between the two polar opposites but that does not mean there are not two distinctly separate polar opposites. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2015, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957/100 "2015-03-15T02:42:25Z")
> [@Robert163](#): > > so how do you get from: > excessive luxury is immoral when so many people suffer > to: > if you’ve EVER spent money on anything beyond basic survival, you’re an amoral child-murderer Cute, kid, but you STILL haven’t answered the question. I’ll show you how it’s done: Money spent on anything beyond basic survival is “exessive luxury”. By the stupid standards you implied, you’re saying that you going to see the “My Pretty Pony” movie and eating a jumbo popcorn is more important that feeding the homeless. If an expensive car when people are suffering is “immoral”, so’s your Broney movie and popcorn, to a lesser degree. You’re willing to accept luxury–which is excessive by the standards of say, a Rwandan kid dying of Kwashiorkor rather than spend that same money feeding someone. The only difference by the stupid-ass standards you set is that the guy with the $100,000 car is more successful at being immoral than you. Now howsabout answering my question: Do you ever spend time/energy/money on luxuries? If so, how do you justify those “excessive” luxuries given that you could easily give them up and send the money to starving children? Easy questions. You gonna try to dodge 'em for a fourth time? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/affluence-is-morally-corrupt-example-inside/714957.md?page=6)