The idea that we “harbored” the terrorists is specious at best. There was no knowing aid or assistance provided these scum. Had our authorities had the least inkling of what was to happen they would have acted swiftly and decisively.
I do not say this out of nationalism. I say this out of preservation of the world from murderous vermin that would endanger the safety of all in their twisted quest for power. I do not advocate this out of hatred for the Afghani people or Muslims, for that matter.
I advocate this out of the desire for a world that is free of such atrocities. No amount of negotiation will avert future incidents of the same sort. Only force will be respected by such thugs. The Taliban accepted this sort of activity within their borders, it is now time to pay the price for that decision. I wouldn’t care if it were Denmark that conducted this program of actively sheltering such terrorist activity. My response would be the same.
Extermination of walking excrement like the Taliban and Osama bin Laden represents one of the only solutions to eliminating the chance for further atrocities. Japan and Germany both engaged in such conduct during WWII. Both of them were taken over and had their populations re-educated after bloody battles costing each of them many thousands of lives. It is time to re-educate the Afghani people as to the poor choices that they have made in allowing the Taliban to conduct their affairs.
Again, none of you are posting any sort of solutions to this problem. For what I can see, you are merely pissing in my ear and telling me that it is raining. Show me some real solutions and I will be happy to listen. Has anyone noticed that many of the most admired people at these boards are advocating even harsher measures than I promote? There is a reason for this, try to consider why this is so.
Sue, that’s the idea, I believe. This is the open door to clean house on all those that have ruled by or spread terror. This is something that will take months and years, but those that we have, up 'til now, observed and monitored will now be the recipients of aggresive actions to wipe them out. Not just the leaders, the entire networks of terror, all the way to the ground. Those that lend safe haven, financial or moral support will be irradicated.
Let me be clear, I firmly believe that we will not be stopping with OBL, we will take this opportunity to clear all those that have sewn terror and we will continue until they are gone.
Nah, not necessary. If he isn’t responsible, we do need to get the person who is. But bin Laden has said in the past that he is at war with us. We are about to declare war on terrorism. That makes it mutual. I say he goes down whether he had anything to do with it or not, because he’s guilty of plenty of other things.
My gut feeling is that the Taliban really wasn’t actively supporting him, at least in the last few years. Yes, he’s in their country, but that’s not enough reason to take war to their people. They most definitely should cooperate with us, and we may as well not disabuse them of the fear that we are minutes away from unleashing hell, since it only helps convinve them. But I almost feel sorry for them after seeing them beg for mercy. I still think that whole regime is one of the most evil in the world, but suddenly they just seem pathetic rather than evil.
Of course, if they were actively involved, look out…
Horrified as I am about the recent terrorist attacks and as backward as the Afghanistan government is (the Taliban makes Iraq look downright enlightened), I am not naive enough to think that this insidious anger is not rooted in pain.
Rossarian, you’re right. I probably should have said something like “First, let’s find out precisely who is behind this, and then prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.”
Look, we cannot hold the average Afghani responsible for this. We can definately demand that the dictatorial Taliban hand over bin Laden, and every other terrorist present there. But the thing to remember is that Afghanistan is not really a country anymore. There is no real effective government, only bands of armed thugs drunk on the Koran.
Afghanistan has gone through 25 years of invasion and civil war. Think about that. The average Afghani has been at war their entire life. When the Taliban moved in, they looked better than the Soviets and the warlords. I’m sure the average Afghani is sick of them, but what can they do?
But, I imagine the Taliban will probably collapse soon. Even if they hand over OBL, suddenly there will be all sorts of funding for rebel groups. Ironically, the biggest enemy of the Taliban until now is Iran, of all places. Seems the Taliban persecutes the Shiite minority. Iran, being Shiite, naturally takes a dim view of this.
But the point is that the average Afghani is as responsible for harboring terrorists as the average Oklahoman was for harboring McVeigh. Yes, if the Taliban won’t cooperate then the Taliban will go and be replaced with a government that will cooperate. But we don’t need to involve the average Afghani, many of whom are probably on our side after all.
Zenster, was that you I saw on Pineapple street? With your friends? Surrounding those two Arab women with strollers?
It was you! You and your friends were calling them “towel heads” and “sand niggers”. You even threw your Snapple at them. It made you laugh when the open bottle bounced off one of the cowering women and your Peach Tea spilled all over her baby.
I will refrain from calling you what I think you are, since this is MIPSIMS and not The Pit.
This is a defining moment for the United States of America. Our role in the world has officially passed from “policemen of the world” to “terrorist avengers of the world.” Bush and Powell have stated, and rightly so, that the focus of the administration will be an ongoing war on terrorism.
We will not stop with Osama bin Laden, if he is indeed responsible.
We will not stop with Saddam Hussein, if he is in any way involved.
We will not stop with those rulers or governments that willfully harbor and support known terrorists.
To paraphrase Winston Churchill: “We shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never stop.”
Civilians on four passenger planes are hijacked and killed in the murder of at least 10,000 other civilians? Sorry, did anyone tell the terrorists that “blood lust was not allowed”?
Anyway, this isn’t a matter of blood lust. We’re not going to be lobbing cruise missiles because we’re pissed off. No, revenge is a dish best served cold, and make no mistake, this is a matter of revenge.
Cycle of violence? We’ll end the cycle of violence by making sure the other side is dead.
Given the repulsive (to me, anyway) nature of the sentiments expressed in the OP, I feel morally obligated to point out that the Taliban rose to power largely because of American aid – we helped them while they and other Afghanistanians were fighting the Russians back in the '80s – and that Osama Bin Laden was trained by our very own CIA.
Don’t succumb to the darkness, folks; otherwise the terrorists will have won.
Thanks, Mauvaise, for expressing exactly what I was feeling.
The thought of more bloodshed is abhorrent, and heaps tragedy upon tragedy. It seems that it’s likely to happen, though, and for the record, I agree with most of the OP. I just feel so fucking sad.
Regards of who does it, the meditated, wholesale slaughter of the innocent is universally repugnant. If you feel the need to stoop to their level, you’re welcome to it. You won’t convince me, however.
I live in a nation of rules and morals, which happens to be the same one you do as well. An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth is a middle-eastern tenant, not a western one.
Um, isn’t that why they are terrorists?! To justify the slaughter of entire country because of the act of a few simply makes America terrorists. That is the rationale they use – I don’t want to be associated with that type of thinking.
Revenge on the terrorists, yes. Killing innocent men, women, and children doesn’t punish anyone except those that die, those that are left behind to mourn … and us for sinking to the level of terrorism.
How are innocent men, women, and children “the other side” simply by being born in a particular country?