# AFI's 100 Heroes & Villains **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 4, 2003, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553 "2003-06-04T10:11:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/61 "2003-06-04T18:28:56Z")
P.S. What the hell _was_ John Connor’s father’s name anyway? ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/62 "2003-06-04T18:32:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dewey Cheatem Undhow \*\*\*Why do we need to know a name? Here’s what the entry should be: “The Demon – The Exorcist.” If the AFI can include entries like “Man,” “The Martians” and “The Shark,” there’s no reason why “The Demon” would be an invalid choice. \*\* I also thought it was odd to see Regan’s name on the list – talk about blaming the victim! Although early in the film there’s speculation that the possession is in Regan’s head, the supernatural explanation wins out in the end. Although the name “Pazuzu” is thrown around quite a bit, I don’t think the identity of the demon is totally clear. It refers to itself as “the devil”, which one of the priests takes as meaning Satan. I think it also refers to itself as “we” or “us”, implying there’s more than one entity involved. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/63 "2003-06-04T18:40:47Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Biggirl \* > \*\*P.S. What the hell _was_ John Connor’s father’s name anyway? \*\* [Dan Connor](http://www.carseywerner.net/inflight/roseanne/roseanne_210.htm)? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/64 "2003-06-04T18:47:54Z")
Kyle Reese. Ok, I can get on with my life now. ---
**Author:** ![wolf\_meister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf_meister/32/15202_2.png) [@wolf\_meister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolf_meister)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/65 "2003-06-04T18:54:10Z")
Hi FOlks, If you are like me, reading any Adobe PDF document is a royal pain in the ass isn’t it? So, I converted the PDF to text (another royal pain) and uploaded it to one of the free websites I have set up. * * * THE LINK IS: [http://www.geocities.com/Internet\_web\_surfer\_dude/Heroesv.html](http://www.geocities.com/Internet_web_surfer_dude/Heroesv.html) * * * ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/66 "2003-06-04T19:04:59Z")
I didn’t see the program or was even aware of such an installment until this thread, but from a cursory look at the list, if there’s one reason this list isn’t as idiotic as the AFI Best Movies list, it’s because nothing could be worse than that moronic list. Something to remember from these lists is that they’re not the “Best”, just the “Best-loved” or “Best-remembered”, typically made by people with very little historical knowledge or awareness doing the remembering. So the Wicked Witch and Robin Hood become two of a few token 30s representatives–Whoop De Do! Do you honestly think anyone 50 years from now is going to remember _Training Day_ and _Philadelphia_ as much more than Oscar footnotes? Please. All these AFI lists indulge in reinforcing the obvious, not broadening the awareness of those who may not remember Buster Keaton or Lon Chaney or Douglas Fairbanks (all notably absent). In the film archival community, they are seen as largely a joke, since they _do_ very little, but are attention whores when it comes to taking credit for things and/or immersing in periodic displays of blatant self-promotion. Yet another list that’s gutless when it should be fearless, narrow-minded when it should be expansive, and tediously predictable when it should be provocative. But then, that’d make for poor ratings, wouldn’t it? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/67 "2003-06-04T19:05:01Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally posted by Marley23_ > **Pazuzu.** This was the name given in the (much inferior) sequel to the _Exorcist_. But, in the original, I recall the local priest offering to give the out-of-town expert (Max von Sydow) the “names of the manifested demons” and Max replying “There is only one”, meaning, presumably, THE devil. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Carnage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/max_carnage/32/12775_2.png) [@Max\_Carnage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Carnage)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/68 "2003-06-04T19:45:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BrotherCadfael \* > \*\*This was the name given in the (much inferior) sequel to the _Exorcist_. But, in the original, I recall the local priest offering to give the out-of-town expert (Max von Sydow) the “names of the manifested demons” and Max replying “There is only one”, meaning, presumably, THE devil. \*\* Pazuzu was also the name of Professor Farnsworth’s pet demon that he raised from a little tyke who rescued the Planet Express crew from the Fountain of Oldth. ---
**Author:** ![vl\_mungo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc8723/32.png) [@vl\_mungo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vl_mungo)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/69 "2003-06-04T19:51:57Z")
Thanks for doing the grunt work **wolf\_meister**. Glad to see Robert Mitchum’s Reverend made the cut (although I would have ranked him higher). Some of the missing… Villains **Jonathan Brewster** - Arsenic and Old Lace **Tommy DeVito** - Goodfellas **The Thing** - The Thing **George and Martha** - Who’s Afraid of Virginia Woolf? Heroes **John J. Macreedy** - Bad Day At Black Rock **Jonathan E.** - Rollerball (1970’s version, of course) **Lucas Jackson** - Cool Hand Luke **Lt. (j.g.) Doug A. Roberts** - Mr Roberts ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Carnage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/max_carnage/32/12775_2.png) [@Max\_Carnage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Carnage)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/70 "2003-06-04T19:55:15Z")
Actually, Luke Jackson was number 30. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/71 "2003-06-04T20:28:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Max Carnage \* > \*\*Yes she did, somewhere in the middle. One of a few real people to make the list of characters, alongside Ghandi and Patton./B] Joan Crawford was the only real-life villain. Real-life heros were Ghandi, Patton, T.E. Lawrence, Oskar Schindler, Alvin York and Lou Gehrig. (I’m drawing a blank momentarily…Schindler’s List was based on fact, right?) ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/72 "2003-06-04T20:30:05Z")
Forgot Capt. Blight – real-life villain. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/73 "2003-06-04T20:32:33Z")
[deep sigh] Only if you believe her daughter’s total bullshit, which has been exposed in several threads in the past. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/74 "2003-06-04T20:43:33Z")
But she was still a real life person… ---
**Author:** ![Wumpus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8c91f0/32.png) [@Wumpus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wumpus)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/75 "2003-06-04T20:53:17Z")
And mind you, most historians don’t think the real Capt. Bligh was a villain at all. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/76 "2003-06-04T20:54:52Z")
Yes, Oskar Schindler was a real person. I don’t know what departures the film did and didn’t make - if I picked one filmmaker to be a historian, it wouldn’t be Spielberg - but in essence at least, it’s a true story. ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/77 "2003-06-04T20:56:05Z")
**Eve** , any idea why Angela Lansbury seemed to confirm the “no wire hangers”? **BrotherCadfael** , Pazuzu may not have been mentioned by name, but he was definitely depicted in the first film, in statuary form in the prologue and as a spiritual manifestation later. (Pazuzu is an actual mythological figure.) **jsc1953** , here’s something on [the real Capt. Bligh.](http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/discover/archive_features/05.shtml) ---
**Author:** ![Balle\_M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/13edae/32.png) [@Balle\_M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balle_M)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/78 "2003-06-04T20:58:38Z")
I was a bit disappointed that none of the classic cowboy heroes such as Tom Mix, Gene Autry or Roy Rogers made the list. Yeah, today they seem hokey and simplistic but these guys were heroes to millions of kids. And yes, I STILL watch 'em… ---
**Author:** ![greenphan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c37758/32.png) [@greenphan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/greenphan)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/79 "2003-06-04T20:59:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jsc1953 \* > \*\*Joan Crawford was the only real-life villain. \*\* Nope; Amon Goeth from Schindler’s List, Bonnie and Clyde, and…that’s it, I believe. As for heroes, wasn’t Spartacus real, along with Karen Silkwood, Moses, Erin Brokovitch, Woodward and Bernstein, and Butch and Sundance? I’m really curious about some of them (like Karen Silkwood). –greenphan ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2003, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553/80 "2003-06-04T21:41:07Z")
Spartacus was real, although I’m not sure Hollywood came close to the actual story. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/afis-100-heroes-villains/179553.md?page=5)