# Again??? HS teacher has relationship with student \[edited title\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 27, 2010, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941 "2010-05-27T13:12:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/21 "2010-05-28T12:27:46Z")
I might get pitted for this, and perhaps deservedly, but every time one of these stories happens I click on the link mostly to see how hot the teacher is. This one? Not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Telcontar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3bc359/32.png) [@Telcontar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telcontar)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/22 "2010-05-28T14:05:31Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Which is often the case in sexual harassment and abuse of power situations. And why this is so terribly wrong - and would be wrong if he were a 24 year old graduate student and she were his adviser. You just don’t do this. Because even if you are completely on the up and up, you are going to be wrong if your subordinate doesn’t like his A-. This is exactly right. As a college level TA, I once dated a FORMER student who was 20 at the time. There is a world of difference between making a move before grades are submitted and making a move after (which is also the distinction the university’s policy draws: relations are fine provided the teacher is no longer evaluating the student). For a teacher to date someone they were actively teaching and to alter that student’s grade when the relationship soured is first order professional misconduct. That the student in questions is HS age makes me squeamish, but I’m not sure that it should given the age of consent. Also: My understanding is that the commonality of this varies greatly by school. One of my friends reported that it was so common in her HS that there was no effort to even hide it (low income area, north jersey). Another, elite women’s HS, said that she herself had dated a teacher and that it had been horribly risky and taboo (and she greatly regrets it). ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/23 "2010-05-28T14:28:41Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Which he refused and turned her in for. Also, he’s not a minor, the age of consent in Georgia is 16. > > This is solely an ethical question. You might want to reconsider (from Official Code of Georgia, 1992 Edition, Title 16): \*\* 16-6-5.1. Sexual assault against persons in custody\*\*; sexual assault against person detained or patient in hospital or other institution; sexual assault by practitioner of psychotherapy against patient. (a) As used in this Code section, the term: 1. “Actor” means a person accused of sexual assault. 2. “Intimate parts” means the genital area, groin, inner thighs, buttocks, or breasts of a person. 3. “Psychotherapy” means the professional treatment or counseling of a mental or emotional illness, symptom, or condition. 4. “Sexual contact” means any contact for the purpose of sexual gratification of the actor with the intimate parts of a person not married to the actor. (b) A probation or parole officer or **other custodian or supervisor of another person referred to in this Code section commits sexual assault when he engages in sexual contact with another person who is** a a probationer or parolee under the supervision of said probation or parole officer or who is in the custody of law or who is **enrolled in a school** or who is detained in or is a patient in a hospital or other institution and such actor has supervisory or disciplinary authority over such other person. A person convicted of sexual assault shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than one nor more than three years. **(c) 1. A person commits sexual assault when such person has supervisory or disciplinary authority over another person and such person engages in sexual contact with that other person who is:** In the custody of law; or Detained in or is a patient in a hospital or other institution. 2. A person commits sexual assault when, as an actual or purported practitioner of psychotherapy, he or she engages in sexual contact with another person who the actor knew or should have known is the subject of the actor’s actual or purported treatment or counseling, or, if the the treatment or counseling relationship was used to facilitate sexual contact between the actor and said person. **3. Consent of the victim shall not be a defense to a prosecution under this subsection.** 5. A person convicted of the offense of sexual assault under this subsection shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than one nor more than three years. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/24 "2010-05-28T15:00:32Z")
> [@ShibbOleth](#): > > You might want to reconsider (from Official Code of Georgia, 1992 Edition, Title 16) Well alright then. It appears this is illegal even though he’s over the age of consent. Ignorance fought. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/25 "2010-05-28T15:37:48Z")
> [@ShibbOleth](#): > > You might want to reconsider (from Official Code of Georgia, 1992 Edition, Title 16): Am I the only one who finds it sad that the law is equating school with prison? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/26 "2010-05-28T15:43:45Z")
I am utterly horrified---- that the “Teacher of the Year,” an \*English \*teacher no less, is unable to properly spell the word “consensual.” ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/27 "2010-05-28T15:48:54Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > I am utterly horrified---- that the “Teacher of the Year,” an \*English \*teacher no less, is unable to properly spell the word “consensual.” Meh. She’s in big trouble and probably rattled. Typos happen when the shit hits the fan and you’re upset. Her proofreading may suck, but given that she was panic-writing, again: meh. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/28 "2010-05-28T17:18:20Z")
Romantic relationships between a student and their teacher is always an unethical situation, regardless of age. Honestly, I think teachers should keep their hands out of the pants of anyone going to their school. And of course, massive age gaps are creepy- though I know more than my share of 30 year old men dating late teens/early twenties girls without getting too much shit for it. I’m not sure why this particular set up is so shocking. If it happened between a male teacher and his female student, we’d all understand what was going on. Not all young men are bumbling nitwits. A full grown friend of mine recently had an encounter with a charming, hilarious, well-read, sexually experienced and extremely attractive eighteen year old boy travelling the world until he starts at Harvard. She reports that it was hot for the same reasons men fantasize about younger women- the innocence, the taboo, the smooth skin of youth, etc. Not every women is looking for the older protector type. Plenty of women find men their own age or older unattractive- the paunch, the balding, the wrinkles, etc. They may indeed be looking for “young and hot.” Sexually, the higher sex drives of younger men and older women are actually a pretty good match. It’s really not that absurd that an emotionally healthy woman might want to have sex with a much younger man. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/29 "2010-05-28T17:26:33Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Except he was the victim of a sexual crime - assuming his allegations are true. Ignoring the “he’s a minor” part - he was blackmailed into exchanging sex (and a baby!) for grades. He may have entered into the initial relationship voluntarily, but at least eventually, this became quid pro quo sexual harassment. That ^ But it doesn’t follow that all teacher-pupil relationships are wrong because of the possibility of that kind of abuse. You would think that a teacher who wanted to sleep with a teenage boy was wrong in the head though. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/30 "2010-05-28T18:58:51Z")
> [@Happy\_Poster](#): > > That ^ > > But it doesn’t follow that all teacher-pupil relationships are wrong because of the possibility of that kind of abuse. > > You would think that a teacher who wanted to sleep with a teenage boy was wrong in the head though. The thing is is that even if that sort of abuse doesn’t happen, the teacher is in a load of hurt if the student ALLEGES it did. The student ends up holding all the cards if the relationship sours. And when you are having sex with a seventeen year old, how often does the relationship NOT sour? The odds are really against you. Not only is the relationship unethical, illegal (in at least the civil sense) and probably something that would cause you to loose your teaching license - its a stupid position for any teacher to get themselves into. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/31 "2010-05-28T19:12:18Z")
> [@EvilTOJ](#): > > In before “Where were these teachers when I was in school” and “She’s hot” and “He just couldn’t keep his big mouth shut could he?” Nah, I think she’s kinda ugly. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2010, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/32 "2010-05-28T22:51:37Z")
> [@Chicagojeff](#): > > “I am very disturbed by this situation, I think she should have been terminated,” said Ericka Pender, the teen’s mother, from her North Carolina home. “She wanted the relationship to go further and was threatening my son. She said she was going to make him fail.” > > The Atlanta Journal-Constitution is not publishing the name of the student because it does not generally identify victims of sexual crimes. No, we won’t publish the student’s name. We’ll just publish his mother’s name, where she lives, the teacher’s name, the name of the school, and the student’s age. 'Cause nobody could figure out the student’s name from that. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/33 "2010-05-29T06:54:45Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > I am utterly horrified---- that the “Teacher of the Year,” an \*English \*teacher no less, is unable to properly spell the word “consensual.” Apparently she gets that from her mother: > [@](#): > > “My daughter didn’t have any inappropriate relationship with no under-aged student.” Technically incorrect. Mixing _any_ with _no_? The proper form of this is “…ain’t had no inappropriate relationship with no under-aged student.” ---
**Author:** ![sjc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e5b9ba/32.png) [@sjc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sjc)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2010, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/34 "2010-05-30T23:53:14Z")
> [@AboutAsWeirdAsYouCanGet](#): > > RIGHT ON!!! Teens are still very much kids emotionally. > Heck, I gotta say I’ve changed even since I was in my early twenties. > On the other hand…doesn’t it seem like cases like these require a “perfect storm” of the “perfect” circumstances to happen? Like a girl or guy with really crappy self esteem being predated on by self centered teachers who for some reason feel the need to prey on the naitivite of little kids? > Like, it’s prolly VERY rare that a kid with good self esteem and who’s had exposure to healthy realtionships would fall for the manipulations of a teacher. > I do have to say…anyone else notice that the boy is a football player? I love that…I find it VERY ironic, as it seems like a Jock type is usually the kind who is taking advantage of his status and playing sex games with the brainless cheerleaders or scoring a few points with a 14 year old freshman. Now the tables are turned, and HE’s the “victim”…almost like an Onion headline. It doesn’t always have to be the teacher “preying on the innocent student”, I’m pretty sure that sometimes it’s the student who is putting the moves on the emotionally needy (or messed up in some other way) teacher. I’m not saying this is what happened here, nor am I saying that it’s necessarily very common (I really don’t know), but my gut tells me that it happens some times. Does it excuse the teacher for their behaviour? No, they are the adult and they should know better. ---
**Author:** ![Teacake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Teacake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Teacake)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/35 "2010-05-31T00:02:08Z")
I started teaching kids aged up to 18 when I had just turned 22. There was no way then, and there is certainly no way now, that I would ever be tempted to have any kind of relationship with any of my students. They’re just kids. I’ve had some students who I could see were attractive or even hot, but I just don’t think of them that way at all. Ew. Even the ones who are now adults, who haven’t been my student for years but are now (casual, facebook-type) friends, I just couldn’t go there. It would be wrong, and not in a good way. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/36 "2010-05-31T00:07:21Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > Nah, I think she’s kinda ugly. Exactly. She had to resort to blackmail to get laid. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/37 "2010-05-31T08:46:57Z")
I’m not sure this is purely civil–even my state, where age of consent is 16, a high school teacher having sex with a student is a prosecutable offense. I remember reading in my local paper about a 30-year-old teacher getting with a 17-year-old student who had criminal charges brought against her. ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/38 "2010-05-31T10:58:30Z")
Damn, she’s still teacher of the year in my book. ---
**Author:** ![Serenata67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/serenata67/32/10646_2.png) [@Serenata67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Serenata67)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2010, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/39 "2010-06-01T12:08:31Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > I didn’t say it wasn’t unethical, I just think the article identifying him as a “victim of a sexual crime” is a little :dubious: I’m with you **Justin**. He went from being the lucky fuck who was banging his hot teacher to the guy who was exploited once his grade dropped. She shouldn’t have done it. She was totally in the wrong. But still… ---
**Author:** ![Chicagojeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b19c9b/32.png) [@Chicagojeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicagojeff)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2010, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941/40 "2010-06-01T13:29:03Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Well alright then. It appears this is illegal even though he’s over the age of consent. Ignorance fought. Actually nooo.. You were right originally. I know the cited law is 1992.. but the local courts have recently ruled on this matter.. [http://blogs.ajc.com/get-schooled-blog/2009/12/09/gross-awful-but-legal-judge-calls-it-in-teacher-sex-case/](http://blogs.ajc.com/get-schooled-blog/2009/12/09/gross-awful-but-legal-judge-calls-it-in-teacher-sex-case/) Gross, awful, but legal: Judge calls it in teacher sex case 4:12 pm December 9, 2009, by Maureen Downey I think both the judge and the school district made the right decisions in the sexual assault case against former Marietta High School teacher Christopher King. When the Marietta system found out that King was involved in a sexual relationship with a 17-year-old student, it made him resign. Today, a judge in Cobb County ruled that while the 36-year-old King’s relationship with a student repelled him, it wasn’t a crime. Former Marietta High School teacher, Christopher King , right, and prosecutor Maurice Brown, listen as defense attorney Scott Semrau gives opening arguments inhich the st case growing out of King’s sexual relationship with a student. Brant Sanderlin [bsanderlin@ajc.com](mailto:bsanderlin@ajc.com) Former Marietta High School teacher Christopher King, right, and prosecutor Maurice Brown, listen as defense attorney Scott Semrau gives opening arguments in a case growing out of King’s sexual relationship with a student. Brant Sanderlin [bsanderlin@ajc.com](mailto:bsanderlin@ajc.com) Judge Robert Flournoy issued a direct verdict Wednesday afternoon in the case. “It was gross, it’s awful, but it ain’t illegal,” he said. “This was a consensual relationship.” The Georgia Supreme Court ruled in June that when the student is a willing participant and is 16 or older, the student’s consent can be a defense for teachers facing a sexual assault charge. Had King been convicted of sexual assault, he faced 10 to 30 years in prison. In his favor was the testimony of the former student on the stand today; she said she was not coerced and the relationship was absolutely consensual. [The student] was obviously persuasive, ” said King’s attorney Scott Semrau. “She was thoroughly knowledgeable about what she wanted.” No one can complain that King was not punished at all. His immaturity and lack of judgment in pursuing an honors student who worked on his school newspaper staff cost him his teaching career. King resigned in lieu of termination and had his teaching certificate revoked by the Professional Standards Commission. Now working as a salesman, King would like to resume his relationship with the girl, according to his attorney. (Hearing that, I think the charge of immaturity still stands against King.) “I know he cares very deeply about her, but at this point the ball’s in her court,” Semrau said. As for teaching again, “Realistically, [King]’s put [that] behind him,” said the attorney. Many people say the high school student will someday regret the relationship and suffer because of it, but is that reason enough to say she was incapable of giving consent? Is the prospect of pain and regret reason to argue that she was not competent to consent to the affair in the first place? After all, some high school girls will eventually regret the relationships they are having now with boys their own age, too. (And there are probably women today who still feel pain over high school romances.) There is the issue of balance of power in relationships between teachers and students, and there are valid concerns about whether the teacher pressured the student. That does not appear to be the case here, based on the young woman’s comments on the stand. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/again-hs-teacher-has-relationship-with-student-edited-title/540941.md?page=1)