# Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D S01E16: End of the Beginning (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 2, 2014, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132 "2014-04-02T02:09:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/41 "2014-04-03T14:15:16Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Won’t somebody think of the airframe?!?!? > > What I wonder about is how heavily reinforced the deck of the aircraft carrier is to withstand the force of those monster turbofans blowing straight down. That’s not your father’s CVN. They’re lucky all their fighter jets didn’t get washed off the desk as well. ---
**Author:** ![Sean\_Factotum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/50afbb/32.png) [@Sean\_Factotum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sean_Factotum)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/42 "2014-04-03T14:21:17Z")
> [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](#): > > They’re lucky all their fighter jets didn’t get washed off the desk as well. In real life jets that are left unattended on an aircraft carrier deck are securely tied down. If not, just the normal pitch and yawl motion of a day at sea would slowly slide them overboard, (even with the brakes locked). ---
**Author:** ![Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/intergalactic_gladiator/32/112_2.png) [@Intergalactic\_Gladiator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Intergalactic_Gladiator)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/43 "2014-04-03T14:31:00Z")
And by desk, I mean deck. What can I say, I was an Army guy. ---
**Author:** ![Cayuga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Cayuga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cayuga)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/44 "2014-04-03T15:04:18Z")
My WAP (wild-ass prediction), which may or may not be what **smiling bandit** was saying: Hand is neither the Clairvoyant nor working for the clairvoyant. But the Clairvoyant has somehow tricked/convinced/deluded her into believing that Coulson’s team are traitors. ---
**Author:** ![Cayuga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Cayuga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cayuga)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/45 "2014-04-03T15:07:11Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > Seemed a waste of Brad Dourif. A complete and total waste. I didn’t even realize it was him. And I was trying to figure out who it was, and if it was an actor or just a mannequin. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/46 "2014-04-03T15:53:45Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > After thinking about it for a while, I find it amusing how little this episode moved the plot forward. > > The team finds the Clairvoyant - except that it’s probably not really him. The Clairvoyant is a SHIELD insider - which we all figured out already. May is making secret phone calls from the plane - something we already knew. She could be the traitor - except we also know she isn’t. Hand is not happy with the team - like that’s big news. A SHIELD guy is shot - but we don’t care about him and he isn’t even dead. Fury makes his appearance - no, that’s from a movie. > > People ran around a lot and time got filled. But nothing _happened_. All we got is a teaser that said if you come back _next_ week, stuff happens! Gosh, thanks. True. If you wanted to summarize what changed this week from last week, the only thing would be the rest of the team found out about May’s secret calls. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/47 "2014-04-03T15:59:02Z")
> [@Wile\_E](#): > > She wasn’t using a regular gun, it was one of the special non-killy ones they use. Coulson pointed out that his was real. So, if she wanted to eliminate Fitz she would have had a regular gun. That there makes her seem a little less like one of the bad guys. Understood - but her actions took her from being ‘person following orders’ to ‘enemy leaking information’ in 2 seconds with little time to explain. (which, of course, is typical comic book fashion for cliff hangers) ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/48 "2014-04-03T15:59:59Z")
My money is on Bill Paxton being the Clairvoyant. It’s always the new guy. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/49 "2014-04-03T16:26:17Z")
> [@Sean\_Factotum](#): > > Re: Ward shooting Nash: Garrett made a comment about how Ward is a Specialist, and that cold-bloodedness is basically a job requirement. So I don’t think that there is anything deper to this - Ward is NOT a deep thinker, more of a spur-of-the-moment reaction guy. As apposed to Coulson, who doesn’t adjust his tie without having three other actions already in play. I take it as another demonstration of The Clairvoyant’s “power”. The plan was always to have Ward kill Nash and the words he “spoke” were carefully designed to make Ward do what he did. Anyone who’s seen enough of The Mentalist knows the type. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/50 "2014-04-03T16:29:06Z")
The “new guy” in this case would probably be Paxton’s new trainee. Paxton is playing an established character in the Marvel Universe, whom they’re unlikely to veer too far in characterization. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/51 "2014-04-03T16:33:21Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > So… can anyone explain Sky’s retarded “double-blind” plan, please? When she brings it up, Coulson smirks like he thinks she’s his secret genius, but it makes absolutely no sense. Also, that’s not what “double-blind” means. It doesn’t mean that there are two people who don’t know everything. For it to be double blind, Skye herself would also not know who was going where. Instead, it seemed that she did the deciding and then parceled out the information, meaning the entire plan was in her head, thus defeating the purpose. Also also, if I were an all-knowing, all-seeing bad guy, and there were three teams coming after me, and I had one bodyguard available, I would maybe consider having the bodyguard show himself in a place where I WASN’T. Sure enough, as soon as he showed up, the other two teams immediately packed up and quit, despite the fact that one team had just spotted a series of very suspicious delaying tactics. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/52 "2014-04-03T16:35:49Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > Seemed a waste of Brad Dourif. If I was among the producers and director, when it came up that we had a character that would be a speechless quadriplegic I would immediately have said “O.K. we need to cast the _best possible actor that we can cast_.” You take away an actor’s voice and body, and you’ve taken away pretty much all of the tools of the craft. A moderately good actor would have _sucked_ > [@Lightray](#): > > So… can anyone explain Sky’s retarded “double-blind” plan, please? When she brings it up, Coulson smirks like he thinks she’s his secret genius, but it makes absolutely no sense. > > Random teams after random targets was _already_ part of the plan. Sky thinks that only telling one team member who the target is once they’re en route somehow makes them more secure from the Clairvoyant (who may, or may not, read their minds). > > But if the Clairvoyant _can_ read minds, having only one mind to read the information from isn’t much harder than having two. I think a mind-reader would need to make choices of when and who when it comes to reading minds. So, splitting the information _would_ make it harder to find. So, I was o.k. with this idea. You’re right, though, that it was just stupid that the partners _immediately_ shared the information. _However_, the evil mystery guy isn’t called “The Mind Reader”, he’s called “The Clairvoyant”. Clairvoyance as an ability to see the future would not require actual mind reading. But, they were still acknowledging that “The Clairvoyant” might not truly be Clairvoyant but, rather, getting information through other means. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/53 "2014-04-03T16:44:11Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > The “new guy” in this case would probably be Paxton’s new trainee. Paxton is playing an established character in the Marvel Universe, whom they’re unlikely to veer too far in characterization. Ok I didn’t know that so I’ll change my guess to the trainee. He has a budding romance thing going on with Simmons so it would be some nice drama for him to get her involved in his “Clairvoyant” activities and for her to be devastated and probably put in danger when she finds out it’s him. On another note, does anyone else feel like Skye is Scrappy Doo? It seems like she is supposed to be a character the audience can identify with, but I just find her pretty but annoying. I can identify with almost all the other characters more than her. ---
**Author:** ![Lightray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightray/32/391_2.png) [@Lightray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightray)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/54 "2014-04-03T16:48:03Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > _However_, the evil mystery guy isn’t called “The Mind Reader”, he’s called “The Clairvoyant”. Clairvoyance as an ability to see the future would not require actual mind reading. But, they were still acknowledging that “The Clairvoyant” might not truly be Clairvoyant but, rather, getting information through other means. Except that Coulson’s explanation for meeting on the plane was that the Clairvoyant couldn’t read their minds if they were so high up. Mind you, _that_ explanation _also_ sounded dubious. Instead of convincing me that Skye is brilliant and Coulson knows what he’s doing, the writing here actually did the opposite. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/55 "2014-04-03T16:51:33Z")
> [@Bozuit](#): > > I take it as another demonstration of The Clairvoyant’s “power”. The plan was always to have Ward kill Nash and the words he “spoke” were carefully designed to make Ward do what he did. My take on it as well. It was designed to tie things up and have SHIELD think TC was dead. ---
**Author:** ![Cayuga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Cayuga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cayuga)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/56 "2014-04-03T17:00:15Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > If I was among the producers and director, when it came up that we had a character that would be a speechless quadriplegic I would immediately have said “O.K. we need to cast the _best possible actor that we can cast_.” > You take away an actor’s voice and body, and you’ve taken away pretty much all of the tools of the craft. A moderately good actor would have _sucked_ Yeah, but he just sat there motionless. I’m not sure he even blinked. Seriously, an Academy Award winner, a dinner theater reject, and a mannequin would all have done exactly the same job. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Doom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Dr\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Doom)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/57 "2014-04-03T17:00:16Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > … it seemed that she did the deciding… The entire episode seemed as though Skye was in charge of _everything_. Coulson somehow convinces Hand (off-camera) to agree to elevating Skye to _Agent of S.H.I.E.L.D._ status. Garrett is completely taken with her, although he _is_ pretty affable anyway. Ward and Coulson both are being entirely anal about her safety, to the point of assigning her _armed guards_ FFS. Fitz is taking orders from her re: May’s phone line. Coulson is taking her psych-eval idea and eating it up with a spoon, and discussing the possibility of treason within S.H.I.E.L.D. as though she’s suddenly his equal. Only several episodes ago this is the young woman who had a freaking tracking bracelet._Skye, Skye, Skye_! [/Janet Brady] > [@](#): > > … the fact that one team had just spotted a series of very suspicious delaying tactics. Don’t forget the oddity of Ward and Triplett being greeted by nobody in the guardhouse of a high-security prison. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/58 "2014-04-03T17:14:48Z")
> [@Cayuga](#): > > Yeah, but he just sat there motionless. I’m not sure he even blinked. Seriously, an Academy Award winner, a dinner theater reject, and a mannequin would all have done exactly the same job. Yeah, you’re just wrong about this. Even a moderately talented professional actor would have been at a loss being tasked at putting depth of character into only his eyes with no other tools of the craft at his disposal- I wouldn’t allow a dinner theater reject within a hundred miles of the casting session for this role. The effective buildup of tension in that scene was all due to a performance that Dourif had going on with just his eyes. You need an excellent actor to pull that off. ---
**Author:** ![obfusciatrist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/4af34b/32.png) [@obfusciatrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obfusciatrist)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/59 "2014-04-03T17:21:03Z")
I watched the episode after having seen The Winter Soldier. The movie contains some events that will have to seriously impact the course of the show if they try to stay in sync. So the whole time I was watching the episode I was processing everything through that filter (so I had thoughts on Mae and her reaction). But I don’t know if I was supposed to and how synched they will be and when (since if the show incorporates it all immediately it will be a huge spoiler for the movie. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2014, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132/60 "2014-04-03T17:37:30Z")
“It all ties together.” My guess is that next week’s episode will still deal with stuff that is background in CA:WS, but the end of the season will get more directly involved. Then next season will totally incorporate the changes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-s-h-i-e-l-d-s01e16-end-of-the-beginning-open-spoilers/685132.md?page=4)