# Agents of SHIELD - S02E11 - Aftershocks (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 4, 2015, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192 "2015-03-04T13:03:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/41 "2015-03-05T18:51:38Z")
As a scientist, I felt physical pain hearing Simmons say, “I analyzed her DNA with gel electrophoresis.” (Pulls up a fancy 3-D computer animated model of DNA) “It’s got completely new macromolecules in it!” No one wants to be bored by why exactly that’s so incredibly wrong, so let me explain via analogy. It’s as if a builder said “Look! I built this house! I did it with this hammer and some nails!” and then pulls up a picture of a giant skyscraper. And the skyscraper is a living thing. I can appreciate the need for technobabble, but that’s not an excuse for writers to completely misuse words that already exist. These are real words, that actually MEAN things. Make something up if you want, but you can’t just keep pretending that no one out there will understand you. See also every computer scene in every show ever. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/42 "2015-03-05T18:54:48Z")
Hydra is gone. It’s history. If there’s any moppig up to do, it’ll be done in bthe next two months. Look, it’s like this: the Marvel TV universe will always be subordinate to the Marvel cinematic universe. At the end of\* Winter Soldier\*, the general movie audience was under the impression that with the possible exception of Von Strucker, Hydra was eliminated. That means that by the time _Avengers 2_ comes out, this has to be the case in practice. The TV show can never contradict the movies, and can never be the source of information needed to understand them. That’s not storytelling - that’s business. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/43 "2015-03-05T19:35:18Z")
I disagree. Hydra will be crippled and underground, but it will still be around in some form, if dormant. All it will take is the return of Red Skull for the whole thing to pop back into action. It isn’t Uncle Ben, after all. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/44 "2015-03-05T19:46:16Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > That was one thing that bothered me about the episode. Raina was never represented as blood thirsty or that vicious before. Those killings were unnecessary and exceedingly violent. Perhaps that’s part of the terragenisis, or just the result of expecting to become a super being and instead becoming a freak. Well, she never had a problem with torture and killing. She’s not physically inclined, and got her way via wits, charm and manipulation, but she was always pretty cold blooded. When she found herself in a strong, weaponized body, it’s not surprising she’d use it. Plus, she’s a Cal groupie going way back, so slicing people’s throats open is nothing to her. She’s very dangerous. Question is whether this new character who teleported her away, is prepared for how dangerous she really is. Re: Hydra. Never going away completely. Never, never, never gonna happen. 🙂 But we should get a break from that storyline for a bit. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/45 "2015-03-05T22:33:02Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > Re: Hydra. Never going away completely. Never, never, never gonna happen. 🙂 But we should get a break from that storyline for a bit. I want AIM to come back and I want Secret Empire to be introduced (I was hoping Ward’s brother was going to be a member of a new faction.) ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/46 "2015-03-05T22:40:03Z")
> [@Push\_You\_Down](#): > > I want AIM to come back and I want Secret Empire to be introduced (I was hoping Ward’s brother was going to be a member of a new faction.) I’d like to learn more about SWORD, or whoever was holding the blue Kree but not SHIELD, but someone SHIELD works with. And of course, whoever Bobby & Hunter are working with. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/47 "2015-03-05T22:46:16Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Hydra is gone. It’s history. If there’s any moppig up to do, it’ll be done in bthe next two months. > > Look, it’s like this: the Marvel TV universe will always be subordinate to the Marvel cinematic universe. At the end of\* Winter Soldier\*, the general movie audience was under the impression that with the possible exception of Von Strucker, Hydra was eliminated. That means that by the time _Avengers 2_ comes out, this has to be the case in practice. The TV show can never contradict the movies, and can never be the source of information needed to understand them. That’s not storytelling - that’s business. You can always make the assumption that Hydra was simply the front end of the inhumans, and that it will be reformed at some point, perhaps under a new name. Right now tho, they do have a balkanized structure. Hydra pure , folks that were in Hydra from the beginning. Hydra hybrid, Shield agents that were sleepers Hydra Chaos, Shield agents that went over, deciding that Hydra was the new world order and got in on the ground floor when cap made the speech. So we got a bunch of people with a leadership vaccum, something will emerge. Declan ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/48 "2015-03-06T01:56:34Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Hydra is gone. It’s history. New to the Whedonverse, are we? Or, as I understand it, ANY comic book universe? Nobody and no organization dies forever. They can always be revived if the writers need them. Did anybody miss the overwhelming, unmissable, similarity of the Duchess to Hilary Clinton? Even that shade of blue suit! ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/49 "2015-03-06T07:01:20Z")
One thing I can’t work out - who did Eyeless Guy rescue Raina from? SHIELD, Hydra, or someone else? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/50 "2015-03-06T07:39:09Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > I think Bobbi and Mack are working for Fury. They’re obviously not Hydra and that doesn’t leave too many other possibilities. My guess is they work for S.W.O.R.D . With a Captain Marvel movie tie-in/teaser coming up. Shit, the Captain Marvel movie will be the _20th_ MCU installment! ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/51 "2015-03-06T07:41:03Z")
> [@Declan](#): > > You can always make the assumption that Hydra was simply the front end of the inhumans Hydra isn’t a _front_ for the Inhumans - or they wouldn’t be vivisecting them… ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/52 "2015-03-06T11:25:11Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > That was one thing that bothered me about the episode. Raina was never represented as blood thirsty or that vicious before. Those killings were unnecessary and exceedingly violent. Perhaps that’s part of the terragenisis, or just the result of expecting to become a super being and instead becoming a freak. The flashback scene with Cal’s wife (I DON’T KNOW HER NAME!!!) made it pretty clear that the transformation is extremely distressing on an emotional level- even for those who had been mentally prepared for it ahead of time. Raina got no counseling in the immediate aftermath (and Cal doesn’t seem like he had been an especially good mentor for the mental preparation beforehand). That opening scene with eyeless guy’s trauma counseling made me perfectly prepared to accept Raina getting all slashy. > [@galen\_ubal](#): > > One thing I can’t work out - who did Eyeless Guy rescue Raina from? SHIELD, Hydra, or someone else? I’m assuming it was SHIELD since Coulson had already said they had a team out looking for her. I’d guess that Whitehall would have been the only person from HYDRA who’d have considered her valuable, and he was dead at this point. > [@Alessan](#): > > Hydra is gone. It’s history. If there’s any moppig up to do, it’ll be done in bthe next two months. > > Look, it’s like this: the Marvel TV universe will always be subordinate to the Marvel cinematic universe. At the end of\* Winter Soldier\*, the general movie audience was under the impression that with the possible exception of Von Strucker, Hydra was eliminated. That means that by the time _Avengers 2_ comes out, this has to be the case in practice. “HYDRA is gone. It’s history …except for Von Strucker” isn’t an especially meaningful statement. Whitehall was in North America\* while Von Strucker was in Europe but it’s not like Von Strucker is the European version of what Whitehall was. They weren’t peers. Whitehall was subordinate to Von Strucker. When Ward first meets up with Bakshi he says something to the effect of “Von Strucker is in Europe so I assume you have someone else you answer to over here?” [(episode 7)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Writing_on_the_Wall_(Agents_of_S.H.I.E.L.D.)) making it clear that Von Strucker is at the very top and that there’s a middle management type heading operations in North America. So, sure, Von Strucker has an administrative nightmare on his hands with the loss of Whitehall and every obvious replacement, but HYDRA still has it’s head and it’s the same head that movie audiences were introduced to at the end of _Winter Soldier_ set up to be a major player in _Age of Ultron_. So, movie audiences who do not watch the T.V. show are still meant to expect HYDRA to exist. \*My paraphrased memory of Ward’s line “Von Strucker is in Europe so I assume you have someone else you answer to over here?” is pretty much correct, I’m quite sure, but I’ll rewatch that episode if anyone wants to challenge my memory. Here’s the bit that seems out of continuity perhaps: When Simmons was working for HYDRA, wasn’t that facility in London? Bakshi and Whitehall were both definitely at that facility, and I _think_ I remember that facility being in London. If so, Ward’s line asking about who’s in charge “over here” while in North America seems like it dismisses the previously established breadth of Whitehall’s operations. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/53 "2015-03-06T11:57:02Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > When Simmons was working for HYDRA, wasn’t that facility in London? Delaware, at least that’s what the[MCU Wiki](http://marvelcinematicuniverse.wikia.com/wiki/Jemma_Simmons#Undercover) says. Unless she had an interstate commute. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/54 "2015-03-06T12:48:21Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > New to the Whedonverse, are we? Hardly. And I don’t remember Buffy fighting the Master in Season 6, either. > [@bienville](#): > > T > “HYDRA is gone. It’s history …except for Von Strucker” isn’t an especially meaningful statement. Whitehall was in North America\* while Von Strucker was in Europe but it’s not like Von Strucker is the European version of what Whitehall was. They weren’t peers. Whitehall was subordinate to Von Strucker. When Ward first meets up with Bakshi he says something to the effect of “Von Strucker is in Europe so I assume you have someone else you answer to over here?” [(episode 7)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Writing_on_the_Wall_(Agents_of_S.H.I.E.L.D.)) making it clear that Von Strucker is at the very top and that there’s a middle management type heading operations in North America. > > So, sure, Von Strucker has an administrative nightmare on his hands with the loss of Whitehall and every obvious replacement, but HYDRA still has it’s head and it’s the same head that movie audiences were introduced to at the end of _Winter Soldier_ set up to be a major player in _Age of Ultron_. So, movie audiences who do not watch the T.V. show are still meant to expect HYDRA to exist. And after Von Strucker dies in the first act of _Age of Ultron_, moviegoers are going to assume Hydra is gone. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/55 "2015-03-06T13:02:05Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > And after Von Strucker dies in the first act of _Age of Ultron_, moviegoers are going to assume Hydra is gone. Well, o.k., then _at that point_ HYDRA will be gone, history. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/56 "2015-03-06T14:35:11Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > The flashback scene with Cal’s wife (I DON’T KNOW HER NAME!!!) According to her birthmark, her name is Priya Tsetsang. No? Nobody? Okay, her name is Jiaying. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/57 "2015-03-06T14:37:51Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > Well, o.k., then _at that point_ HYDRA will be gone, history. Hydra’s very motto states they will never be gone. They secretly stuck around for 70 years after Red Skull died. Someone, somewhere, will always be Hydra. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/58 "2015-03-06T14:39:12Z")
Exactly. Then they pop up when you least expect them, like the… ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/59 "2015-03-06T15:28:14Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > Hydra’s very motto states they will never be gone. They secretly stuck around for 70 years after Red Skull died. Someone, somewhere, will always be Hydra. You really think Red Skull is dead ??? ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192/60 "2015-03-06T15:33:09Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > According to her birthmark, her name is Priya Tsetsang. > > No? Nobody? Are you suggesting Skye’s _real_ father will be revealed to be Agent Sousa? Oh, Cal is not going to like that one bit! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s02e11-aftershocks-open-spoilers/714192.md?page=4)