# Agents of SHIELD: S3 E14 "Paradise Lost" 4/12/16 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 13, 2016, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054 "2016-04-13T02:15:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/1 "2016-04-13T02:15:10Z")
The sordid Malick family history is exposed, old scores are settled, and the SHIELD team goes after Hydra forces. Well, you can’t say that nothing happened in this episode. The only part I didn’t care for was Crocodile Dundee and the alien relic hidden in a coffee can in the fridge. The Malick family backstory was good, the Ward/Hive/Nathaniel character got more interesting, and someone actually died, although no one cared about her. Not sure I buy the plan to capture the jet, maybe it was just a fortunate turn of events but it’s pretty hard to believe the sequence of events. The containment box didn’t work for the first time - thanks to a seat belt? I honestly don’t care about the Agent Coulson angst, but it hasn’t gotten in the way. The Lincoln backstory was fine; but I just don’t care. “I knew it would come back to haunt me, but I didn’t think it would actually come back to haunt me.” ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/2 "2016-04-13T03:28:40Z")
If the guy can only manipulate things he can see, I think I’d blindfold him. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/3 "2016-04-13T12:09:32Z")
I thought Ward/It/Hive worked well in this episode. Understated but still terrifying. BTW, have they actually called him “Hive” yet on the show? The close captioning described him as Hive, but I didn’t think anyone had actually used that name yet. > [@Folacin](#): > > If the guy can only manipulate things he can see, I think I’d blindfold him. And maybe keep a guard watching him at all times? ---
**Author:** ![Gothic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Gothic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gothic)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/4 "2016-04-13T12:15:26Z")
That was really creepy when Ward brought out Nathaniel, I hope Ward(Will) and Simmons are never alone together. Lincoln continues to be flat even after a bunch of opportunities to show some range. I wonder who will be on the next boat to Tahiti? ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/5 "2016-04-13T12:38:25Z")
I did find it amusing that Crocodile Dundee has cut himself off from the world so effectively that he hasn’t heard about all the people going through Teragenesis through fish oil pills or a rainstorm. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/6 "2016-04-13T13:45:59Z")
I wanted to like this episode because I could see that major things were happening in it, but it fell totally flat to me. I felt like things happened for no reason or convenience and I was shooting holes in things left and right like… - Why is Coulson suddenly all butthurt over killing Ward? He’s killed hundreds of people and deserved to die and justified it a million times. Now he’s suddenly regretting it? - How is killing Stephanie a “sacrifice”? If she would have volunteered to take the elder Malick’s place then it would be, but how could Hive possibly think that senselessly murdering his daughter would endure his cooperation at all? - Why is Skye so worked up about “one of our team will die”. She saw the cross just like we did, and she knows that none of the crew wears one…so it’s not the immediate team member - How did Simmons magically know that the bugs aren’t send by Hive, but ARE hive just based on those pictures? - How is the Asian security guy able to use his powers in the box when literally no one else could? How did he know how to fly the plane? Which controls to take over? How to make it land? - Surely Malick would know when they were doing a circle vote to send a sacrifice person, why did he choose to sit where he did? Be in the middle and you guarantee that you aren’t killing your brother, it’s more to chance I honestly could go on but I’m not going to. It wasn’t a terrible episode, it just seemed like they assumed A LOT in it ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/7 "2016-04-13T14:04:26Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > - Why is Coulson suddenly all butthurt over killing Ward? He’s killed hundreds of people and deserved to die and justified it a million times. Now he’s suddenly regretting it? I think he’s been regretting it since the moment it happened. The scene when they got back he was showing regret (as he hugged May). He’s talking about it more now but they’ve talked about it the whole time. In his mind there’s a line between killing someone and murdering them; and that’s the line between good guys and bad guys. Shield is always coming close to that line; Coulson fears crossing that line and turning into what he has been fighting all his life. > [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > - How is killing Stephanie a “sacrifice”? If she would have volunteered to take the elder Malick’s place then it would be, but how could Hive possibly think that senselessly murdering his daughter would endure his cooperation at all? My guess is that Malick feels so much guilt for sending Nathaniel to die that he understands this revenge. It’s about breaking his will, not turning him into a fervent follower. I’m more squicked out by Hive/Nathaniel giving his niece a romantic kiss before dusting her. > [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > - How is the Asian security guy able to use his powers in the box when literally no one else could? How did he know how to fly the plane? Which controls to take over? How to make it land? This whole sequence didn’t work for me. It’s really just a plot point to put the team in danger and make Daisy assemble the Power Rangers. The big MacGuffin in the episode is the coffee can alien artifact - clearly it’s going to be used to stop Hive but we just have to wait and see it played out. One thing I liked was Hive throwing a white stone into the pond mimicking what Gideon had done all those years ago, nice foreshadowing that Hive retained Nathaniel’s memories. Hive’s line about “getting everything they deserve” hasn’t been brought to fruition yet, I don’t think it was just about Gideon and his daughter. Do all the hosts’ memories change Hive? Why would Hive care about how his hosts suffered as long as they provided a body for him? What is Nathaniel’s suffering to him/it? ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/8 "2016-04-13T14:25:18Z")
> [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > I wanted to like this episode because I could see that major things were happening in it, but it fell totally flat to me. I felt like things happened for no reason or convenience and I was shooting holes in things left and right like… > > - Why is Coulson suddenly all butthurt over killing Ward? He’s killed hundreds of people and deserved to die and justified it a million times. Now he’s suddenly regretting it? Coulson had already beaten Ward in their fight. Ward was laying on the ground, unable to move. Coulson could have left him there, or dragged him back through the portal to face trial. Instead, he had a quick flashback to Rosalyn’s face, then slowly killed Ward. In Coulson’s mind, and any US court of law, that was murder. > [@](#): > > - How is killing Stephanie a “sacrifice”? If she would have volunteered to take the elder Malick’s place then it would be, but how could Hive possibly think that senselessly murdering his daughter would endure his cooperation at all? Hive knows that under everything, Malick is a coward and a liar. He didn’t kill Stephanie to ensure Malick’s loyalty, he did it to ensure his fear, and to get his cooperation that way. Plus Hive doesn’t know that Malick has seen his own death at Hive’s hands, so he doesn’t realize that Malick still has a very good reason to betray him. > [@](#): > > - Why is Skye so worked up about “one of our team will die”. She saw the cross just like we did, and she knows that none of the crew wears one…so it’s not the immediate team member Right before the end of the sequence, you see a SHIELD arm patch, so it’s definitely a SHIELD agent. Why it’s someone on the team, I got nuthin. > [@](#): > > - How did Simmons magically know that the bugs aren’t send by Hive, but ARE hive just based on those pictures? It was a theory, not magical knowledge. But she based it on the fact that the company Malick took over had been studying swarming invasive species and ways to resist them. So that led her to think that Hive was also a swarming invasive species. I actually thought that was pretty cool. > [@](#): > > - Surely Malick would know when they were doing a circle vote to send a sacrifice person, why did he choose to sit where he did? Be in the middle and you guarantee that you aren’t killing your brother, it’s more to chance Yeah, he screwed that one up. Maybe he was counting on the white rock being picked before it got to them, so Nathaniel wouldn’t know he had used the trick rock. But he didn’t really think through what would happen if the white rock did reach him. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/9 "2016-04-13T14:39:46Z")
I should point out that Coulson says that Mr.Giyera was an agent before he got his powers, so his skill sets are more likely in line with Mae’s than Paul Blart. I do think that him getting out of the containment chamber was ridiculous considering the other individuals who have much more ability couldn’t. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/10 "2016-04-13T19:39:45Z")
An episode with a decent pace and standard SHIELD plot silliness. Not having Dacascos have an eye-muzzle on is ridiculous. Also: the name Dacascos is _so_ much cooler than Giyera. Also: - the daughter reminded me of a young Jeri Ryan. I will miss her fleeting hotness. - The “Secret Warriors Unite” sounds _so_ freakin’ retarded. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2016, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/11 "2016-04-13T20:53:23Z")
> [@WordMan](#): > > - the daughter reminded me of a young Jeri Ryan. I will miss her fleeting hotness. [Bethany Joy Lenz](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0502342/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t10) - I guess I sort of recognize her from _One Tree Hill_, but I never watched that show. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/12 "2016-04-15T14:22:43Z")
My understanding of the escape is that he had the seat belt piece wedge in the door before it shut, so it never completely sealed. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/13 "2016-04-15T15:31:11Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > My understanding of the escape is that he had the seat belt piece wedge in the door before it shut, so it never completely sealed. That’s what I thought too. However, my 10 year old car notices when a door isn’t closed properly but the super human security pod doesn’t? ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/14 "2016-04-15T15:53:10Z")
Also, I wish they would clarify his powers. He seems to basically be Magneto, but then they said it was “anything inorganic.” Why isn’t he just picking people up by their clothes? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/15 "2016-04-15T16:11:18Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > Also, I wish they would clarify his powers. He seems to basically be Magneto, but then they said it was “anything inorganic.” Why isn’t he just picking people up by their clothes? Shield agents all wear 100% cotton for that very reason. 😉 I didn’t notice them say “anything inorganic”. I thought he was a low level Magneto too. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/16 "2016-04-15T16:54:46Z")
I always got the impression he’s just a powerful telekinetic. But thinking about it now I don’t know if we’ve seen him move any non-metal objects. ---
**Author:** ![BrianJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/54ee81/32.png) [@BrianJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrianJ)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2016, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/17 "2016-04-15T22:02:47Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > Also, I wish they would clarify his powers. He seems to basically be Magneto, but then they said it was “anything inorganic.” Why isn’t he just picking people up by their clothes? Or they could all arm themselves with wooden baseball bats. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2016, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/18 "2016-04-16T00:05:11Z")
I would say the biggest thing this episode did is confirm that not all of Hydra was about bringing back Hive. All the various heads had their own goals. I wonder what the Red Skull thought about it. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2016, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/19 "2016-04-16T16:13:56Z")
If we’ve established that Hive inherits the memories of his hosts, then why did he spend a couple of months reading books and watching TV, to learn about Earth? > [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > - How is the Asian security guy able to use his powers in the box when literally no one else could? How did he know how to fly the plane? Which controls to take over? How to make it land? The box doesn’t prevent someone from using their powers, it just has Hulk-proof walls (as verified by using the real Hulk). Though, this episode would seem to imply that Hulk would be able to escape by wedging a fingernail between the doors and twisting (so apparently, Hulk didn’t try this). I was more impressed that he somehow made them fly a line which caused them to pass over a Hydra (?) base, despite not knowing that they were coming to get them, not knowing where they were going, and not having mind control abilities. And further that he was able to break out at the exact right moment to arrive in the cockpit to dive directly into it, despite the lack of a GPS. > [@CarnalK](#): > > Shield agents all wear 100% cotton for that very reason. 😉 I didn’t notice them say “anything inorganic”. I thought he was a low level Magneto too. At the molecular level, it’s all just molecules. While not a chemist, I can’t think of anything that magical powers would care about between molecules produced through organic processes rather than other chemical reactions. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2016, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054/20 "2016-04-17T09:57:03Z")
> [@Agents of SHIELD: S3 E14 "Spacetime" 4/5/16](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-spacetime-4-5-16/751317/7): > > _Thread from the previous week’s episode_\* > Nice tie in to the flash forward of the Quinjet filled with blood exploding in space. Have we seen anyone else wearing a cross besides Yo-Yo? \*Added red text to draw readers’ attention to the fact that this is a Quote from a different Thread. > [@Sir\_T-Cups](#): > > - Why is Skye so worked up about “one of our team will die”. She saw the cross just like we did, and she knows that none of the crew wears one…so it’s not the immediate team member Anyone have a better memory of the Yo-Yo episode than I do? I had actually completely forgotten about the “_x_ months from now…” opening of that episode until **Telemark** mentioned it. I watch on Hulu which only saves the 5 most recent episodes and the Yo-Yo episode was 6 episodes ago, so I can’t just rewatch it. Was there any different information comparing Daisy’s vision to the opening scene from the Yo-Yo episode? Same exact footage? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/agents-of-shield-s3-e14-paradise-lost-4-12-16/752054.md?page=2)