# Air Force Uber Alles! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 29, 2008, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615 "2008-02-29T06:25:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/41 "2008-02-29T16:37:21Z")
[QUOTE=Fuji] … What exactly was wrong with “Aim High” anyway? I thought that was a pretty catchy one … [/QUOTE] Not to mention, a nicely humanitarian one for an air force. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/42 "2008-02-29T16:38:13Z")
How about a rewording of an old Avis slogan: “We Fly Harder” ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/43 "2008-02-29T16:45:48Z")
Deutschland, Deutschland über alles, Über alles in der Welt, wenn es stets zu Schutz und Trutze… Which means… Germany, Germany above all! above everything in the world When it always, for protection and defence… So… Air Force, Air Force above all! Above everything in the world! When it always, for protection and defence… ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/44 "2008-02-29T16:54:46Z")
Or how 'bout an Air Force version of _Die Wacht Am Rhein_: A call roars like Thunderbolts Like clashing Eagles and Fighting Falcons To the Euphrates, the Euphrates, to the Euphrates Who wants to be the stream’s guardian? Dear Homeland, put your mind at rest Dear Homeland, put your mind at rest Solid stands, and staunch, Air Force! Air Force at the Euphrates! Solid stands, and staunch, Air Force! Air Force at the Euphrates! ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/45 "2008-02-29T17:03:53Z")
In advertising they always come up with two dummy pitches along with one solid one, so the client thinks he’s making a good choice. Maybe the OP was one of the dummies, but the USAF selected it, anyway. Because the best choice should have been “Thundercats Are Go!” ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/46 "2008-02-29T17:06:27Z")
[QUOTE=Slithy Tove] In advertising they always come up with two dummy pitches along with one solid one, so the client thinks he’s making a good choice. Maybe the OP was one of the dummies, but the USAF selected it, anyway. Because the best choice should have been “Thundercats Are Go!” [/QUOTE] Thunder **birds** are GO! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/47 "2008-02-29T17:10:16Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] Thunder **birds** are GO! :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] [Obligatory YouTube link](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2K9rVRuehGU) ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/48 "2008-02-29T17:29:17Z")
[QUOTE=Gala Matrix Fire] For the longest time there was a memo on a bulletin board at work that stated, “Our airmen are America’s most precious resource.” [/QUOTE] The Navy should grab that slogan for themselves for sure. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Hellestal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3ab097/32.png) [@Hellestal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hellestal)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/49 "2008-02-29T18:01:36Z")
[QUOTE=Airman Doors, USAF] I am aware of this, and while your points are well-taken, my problem is that _uber alles_ in conjunction with military organizations raises an issue that does not exist when it is used in the German National Anthem. While I am a member of the military, I am not a big fan of militarism as practiced by the Nazis, and this has horrible connotations that I really do not want to be associated with my service. [/QUOTE] I think you’re giving **psychonaut** too much slack here. First, though the poster was correct that the _Deutschlandlied_ wasn’t specifically a Nazi anthem, it did remain the national anthem during Nazi times (specifically, the first stanza with “Deutschland über alles”; the other stanzas, talking about freedom and rainbows and stuff, were discarded). In Nazi times, the first stanza was followed by the Horst-Wessel-Lied, which was the song for the Nazi Party. Next, I wouldn’t call the Weimar Republic’s adoption of the _Deutschlandlied_ as “long before” Nazi times (it was just 11 years), though that’s a relative term and a matter of opinion. But **psychonaut** was just plain oversimplifying by saying that it’s “still” the national anthem, since officially (after reunification), it’s only the third stanza that’s the national anthem, and the third does not contain the phrase “Deutschland über alles”. And even when the whole song was the anthem, it was the _official policy_ of the post-war German government to sing only the third stanza. This was the official policy precisely because of the Nazi connotations that you find so disturbing. So I would suggest not to accept those points as “well-taken”. They shouldn’t be. They were oversimplifications whose only purpose was unfair criticism of your OP. **psychonaut** had no cause to lay in with words like “lame” and “ill-informed” when the Germans themselves have skirted around the “über alles” stuff for over fifty years. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/50 "2008-02-29T18:02:26Z")
The slogan is a bit lame, but then so is the comparison to Hitler. Does everything in this country have to result in a knee-jerk reaction? ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/51 "2008-02-29T18:10:11Z")
[QUOTE=Fuji] This does seem like a pretty lousy idea for a USAF slogan, however. Even without Nazi associations, it’s just a lame slogan. What exactly was wrong with “Aim High” anyway? I thought that was a pretty catchy one, IMHO. Is it like re-branding or pro sports uniforms where they just have to make a change every decade or so, regardless of the necessity for doing so? [/QUOTE] Military service people are rotated to new duty stations every 3 to 5 years. (It helps spread the talent around, and gives folks new perspectives to draw from.) So, the (newly assigned) Air Force General in charge of recruiting has to do _something_ to make it look like he’s actually at his desk. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/52 "2008-02-29T18:21:10Z")
[QUOTE=Kendall Jackson] And even when the whole song was the anthem, it was the _official policy_ of the post-war German government to sing only the third stanza. This was the official policy precisely because of the Nazi connotations that you find so disturbing. [/QUOTE] Well, no, it’s because the first stanza lays out the borders of the German speaking peoples circa 1840, and since the Meuse, Neman, and Adige rivers were all in other countries in the post war era, it was seen as expansionist. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/53 "2008-02-29T19:01:00Z")
[QUOTE=Chefguy] The slogan is a bit lame, but then so is the comparison to Hitler. Does everything in this country have to result in a knee-jerk reaction? [/QUOTE] It’s not that simple. That particular turn of phrase in conjunction with a military organization invokes a brand of militarism that we as a country don’t want any part of. The timing of it, given our recent military misadventures, is exceptionally inapt. I don’t want the comparisons to be made. There is no comparison. Yet there it is, and all it does is give fodder to people. Of all the slogans they could have come up with, they chose this one? What a shame. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/54 "2008-02-29T19:04:13Z")
[QUOTE=asterion] What did Horst Wessel lie about? [/QUOTE] Host Wessel lied, you can see it in his eyes, when every word I used to say to you was true Are you with me Dr Goebbels? Are you really just a shadow of the man who wanted global domination?[/apologies to steely dan] ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Knig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cdc98d/32.png) [@Typo\_Knig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Knig)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/55 "2008-02-29T19:06:06Z")
**Airman Doors** , to your knowledge has anyone complained to USAF public affairs people about the implications of their new slogan? Preferably before someone puts a word-for-word German translation of their ad on YouTube, and then sends a copy to Jon Stewart. (It won’t be me - I don’t have the 133t video editing skillz.) Quick googling found these two articles: [USAF Public Affairs](http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123087033) and [Stars and Stripes](http://www.stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=52936) They seem to think the new slogan is just dandy - but these were both announcements of the new slogan. What are they going to say - “We picked a new slogan even though we know it stinks”? Who the heck vetted this slogan? I mean really? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/56 "2008-02-29T19:13:07Z")
I wouldn’t have thought to try and translate the USAF slogan into other languages. In English (the only language I read and speak at the moment), the slogan didn’t raise the “stink flag” in my mind. But now that the German translation is pointed out to me, it does cause me to wince slightly. Heh. Hopefully someone will slip the Air Force a clue before any egg gets on their face. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/57 "2008-02-29T19:19:56Z")
[QUOTE=Chefguy] Does everything in this country have to result in a knee-jerk reaction? [/QUOTE] Had the air force chosen “ **Totally Tubular** ” as their new slogan, would we be upbraided for knee-jerking if we mentioned that the phrase made us think of surfing? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/58 "2008-02-29T19:20:02Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Isn’t it _Arbeit Mit Fries_? [/QUOTE] _Arby’s Sauce Mit Mein Fries._ And not by McDonald’s. I’d always wondered what uber alles meant. And I’m not sure I understand why you’re disturbed. Keep in mind that “above all” is a common phrase in _English_ too, with a completely different meaning and no negative connotations I’m aware of. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/59 "2008-02-29T19:20:52Z")
For my part, I am a fairly avid reader on World War II, and it jumped out at me right away. It’s not as though I went looking for reasons to be bothered by it. Ordinarily the motto is eminently ignorable. But this, as the official public motto of the Air Force? Thank God LeMay is dead, or there would be hell to pay for this. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2008, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615/60 "2008-02-29T19:22:07Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] And I’m not sure I understand why you’re disturbed. Keep in mind that “above all” is a common phrase in _English_ too, with a completely different meaning and no negative connotations I’m aware of. [/QUOTE] Again, when combined with the military aspect it becomes an issue. No more, no less. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/air-force-uber-alles/439615.md?page=4)