# "Airline passengers getting heads examined" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 17, 2002, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153 "2002-11-17T10:34:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/1 "2002-11-17T10:34:19Z")
Nah…too easy. From [CNN.com](http://CNN.com): [Logan Airport to look for unusual passenger behavior](http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/Northeast/11/16/logan.profiling.ap/index.html) > [@](#): > > Last week Logan International Airport began the nation’s first “behavioral recognition program,” in which police give what they describe as a “human lie detector test” to passengers with odd or suspicious behavior. You know, I used to **joke** about airline security thinking I was dangerous because I was carrying **Holidays in Hell** by P.J. O’Rourke (only makes sense to read about traveling _while_ you’re traveling). But the most I was ever scrutinized was when someone flipped through the pages to make sure it **was** a book. I can see the flaw in this already. If someone’s terrified of flying, their behavior might be such as to be interpreted as “odd or suspicious”. And this is going to cause **how** much more of a bottleneck? We’re getting closer and closer to the announcer on TV yelling, “6079 Smith, W! Yes, _you_!” ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/2 "2002-11-17T11:33:19Z")
I don’t see much of a problem with the practice as it’s described, and I’m one of those who might be considered by some as more comfortable with the idea of being blown out of the sky than that of having my civil liberties trodden on. Worth keeping an eye on, though. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/3 "2002-11-17T11:46:40Z")
I’m just saying, **Larry** , that it’s difficult (cough) to do an on-the-spot psychological profile. Not to mention time-consuming. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/4 "2002-11-17T12:13:16Z")
The so-called “airline security” is such a fucking joke. It’s just being busy for show, to prove they’re “doing something” even if the something is dancing the hokey-pokey while chanting “TSA! TSA! TSA!” The whole point of commercial air transit is to move large numbers of people great distances at high speed. I’m sorry, that’s simply incompatible with examing minutely large numbers of people for “suspicious behavior” What is suspicious? What isn’t? The guys who did 9/11 were comfortable and famillar with airports, and were almost always described by those who met them prior as very polite. In other words, “nice young men”. Sort of like how Jeffrey Dahmer was a “nice young man” who worked in a chocolate factory - and, oh yes, used to do home lobotomies on people, fuck them, kill them, fuck them again, then eat them. In other words, Bad Guys can look and act perfectly normal sometimes. Meanwhile, nuns and people in wheelchairs are stripped searched. That’s just plain fucking stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/5 "2002-11-17T12:51:42Z")
Amen, **Broomstick**. That’s what I was getting at. ---
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/6 "2002-11-17T21:50:23Z")
What’s your point? Do nothing? Do something else? Do this differently? Easy to sit at your computer in the chair you found on the curb and bitch and moan about this and that, WTF do you want them to do? Or do you just not care? ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/7 "2002-11-17T22:11:32Z")
I had my head examined last time I flew. No really! Turns out my barrettes set off the metal detector! ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2002, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/8 "2002-11-17T22:13:11Z")
Personally, I’d rather be held up at the check-in desk for 10 minutes than be blown out of the sky because a terrorist had got on board my flight. The system isn’t perfect - I think we all know that. Having said that, anything which may reduce the risk of terrorism surely has got to be a good thing. It doesn’t sound like Big Brother to me. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/9 "2002-11-18T00:02:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Rhum Runner \* > What’s your point? Do nothing? Do something else? Do this differently? Easy to sit at your computer in the chair you found on the curb and bitch and moan about this and that, WTF do you want them to do? Or do you just not care? Oh, I care - I’m a pilot, I spend lots of time in the air. Granted, I don’t fly for the airlines, but there have been occassions when the pilot of a small plane had a gun held to his or her head and was hijacked. What would improve things? Shit, I don’t know for sure… but what we have now is NOT helping and is sucking up money and resources. Example: random profiling. This is stupid. A five year old is NOT a terrorist, OK? Frail, 80 year old grandma unable to rise from a wheelchair is NOT a terrorist. Yeah, ask grandma if someone has been fucking around with her wheelchair, but she ain’t gonna hijack a 747 on her own, OK? Watch most closely the men (of any ethnic group) between 15 and 45 - which are most likely to commit any crime outside of prositution - and keep an eye out for _people_ who are “wrong”, not just confiscating “weapons”. A gun in my hands is harmless, because I don’t use guns and have no intentions of committing a crime. A ballpoint pen in the hands of a trained terrorist, however, could be used to kill. If the problem is most likely to be an Arab Muslim then you damn well better look at every Arab Muslim boarding an airplane - the innocent will know why they’re being looked at, it’s an unfortunate resemblance to a national enemy. Sorry about that. But I presume innocent and harmless Muslims don’t want to be blown up any mroe than I do. Sure, you’ll have to watch out for the random oddball anyway, but we’ve always had that problem. It’s the _organized_ assholes most likely to cause severe damage. Oh, and those goddamned “Temporary Flight Restrictions” - they’re _fucking useless_, OK? Most of them are 3-5 miles in diameter. Uh… and how fast can you cover that at 120 mph? And that’s a _slow_ airplane. Here’s a clue: if a jetliner is highjacked and flying 360 mph, that’s _six miles a minute_ or, for the math-impaired, _one mile every 10 seconds_. They’ll blast through a 5 mile TFR in _less than a minute_. Do you honestly think this does jackshit for national security? But it sure the hell inconveniences a fuck of a lot of people. Think it doesn’t matter to you? You want a chopper-ambulance pickup if you have a bad car wreck? Do you use FedEx or any other overnight services? UPS and snail mail spend time on airplanes, too. You want your commercial flight escorted back to the point of origin because air traffic mistakenly misrouted the pilots through a no-fly zone? (It’s already happened multiple times) Even the 30 mile TFR’s would be covered in 5 minutes - or less, because 360 isn’t the top speed of a 747. It takes 15 minutes to scramble and launch a fighter. So what’s the fucking point? It’s an _illusion_ of security. And it’s expensive. And it’s not solving the problem, just lulling folks so they don’t bother to come up with _real_ solutions. If this shit was at all useful it would be one thing - but it isn’t useful. It’s pissing good money after bad. ---
**Author:** ![Rhum\_Runner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rhum\_Runner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhum_Runner)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/10 "2002-11-18T00:13:41Z")
Well, ok then! 🙂 I agree that this is not the end all solution, and I agree further that some of the restrictions etc. are illusionary. No doubt about it. But I don’t think that asking people a few questions is a bad idea, and I think if the guards/police etc are going to be there anyway there is nothing wrong with having them do more than just stand on the side and watch. It is a little thing, but it might help. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/11 "2002-11-18T01:35:46Z")
I can’t add much to what **Broomstick** said, except this: I don’t mind being inconvenienced by something that I think will work. I’m just not convinced that this will work. And one other thing: Airports have probably had to hire a lot more security to carry out these procedures. I wonder how well the new staff is being screened. ---
**Author:** ![TVGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/82dd89/32.png) [@TVGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/12 "2002-11-18T02:09:24Z")
I’m already at a point where I will drive to any destination less than about 250 miles away. Flying those distances simply isn’t time efficient anymore - by the time you check in and go through the [snicker]“security”[/snicker] at the airport, you could have driven half way to your destination. Face it folks, the terrorists ARE winning. They’re making us spend more money, take more time and divert more resources to “fighting terrorism” than anything else. They are forcing us to live, in whatever small measure, in fear and increasing isolation. The smartest thing the FAA and the airlines have done since 9/11 is to FINALLY eliminate the stupid, assinine and idiotic set of questions on check in - the “did you pack you bags and have they been in your control” questions. I knew years ago that when they started asking those questions and requiring a photo ID for “security” purposes, that they would never take security seriously. They didn’t then and they still don’t now. The only people who give a damn about aircraft security and do something about it are the flight crews themselves. Everyone prior to them is pretty much useless, frankly. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/13 "2002-11-18T04:04:44Z")
One thing that might help is to publicly and loudly let the world know that the folks on Flight xzy to BFE captured and KILLED the 2-6 hijackers that tried to take over the plane. Let the wold know that they are heroes and all passengers are expected to do the same ion the future. he he he No jail and attorney for hijackers. Of course we would be back to bombs on board but that is a lot easier to defend against in reality. YMMV :: am I serious? I donno… :::::::: ---
**Author:** ![j\_kat\_251](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/71c47a/32.png) [@j\_kat\_251](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j_kat_251)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/14 "2002-11-18T06:11:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Broomstick \* > \*\* > > Watch most closely the men (of any ethnic group) between 15 and 45 - which are most likely to commit any crime outside of prositution - … > > \ > > \*\* I hate to say this (it being so rude and all), but do you have a cite for that crime thing? Also, by ethnicity does that include non-Hispanic whiteness? > [@](#): > > \*\* > A gun in my hands is harmless, because I don’t use guns and have no intentions of committing a crime. A ballpoint pen in the hands of a trained terrorist, however, could be used to kill. \*\* Are you saying people who don’t fit terrorist profiles should be allowed to board planes with guns? Or were you just making a point about the ineffectivity of most current airport security measures? ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/15 "2002-11-18T13:17:13Z")
I had the honor of being picked at random for searching at Logan Airport. At least I think it was random… And they did check my shoes. which is probably the greatest danger the screeners faced _that_ day. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/16 "2002-11-18T13:28:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by FairyChatMom \* > \*\*I had my head examined last time I flew. > > No really! > > Turns out my barrettes set off the metal detector! \*\* Well, they might have been dangerous. We’ll just call you “Barretta” from now on. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/17 "2002-11-18T17:05:58Z")
I’ll never believe that the bulk of the searching is truly random. I’ve been searched at least once, and sometimes more than once, for every goddamn domestic flight I’ve taken since 9/11. I look Middle Eastern, although it’s because I’m Jewish (and look it), not Muslim. I was not searched before the one international flight, although for that I showed my passport for ID, which shows my U.S. birthplace, not my driver’s license, which doesn’t. The number of times I’ve been searched frankly defies the odds. Isn’t there some more sensible way to profile potential terrorists than by complexion? ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2002, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/18 "2002-11-18T17:29:34Z")
Did anyone read the thread title and think of Blur’s Song 2? _I got my head checked By a jumbo jet It wasn’t easy But nothing is, no._ Everytime my husband flies— every single time-- he gets “randomly” checked. Once, when the whole family was going to Florida, he wasn’t pulled aside in the terminal and we thought we’d made it. But the pulled him out of line _while we were boarding the plane_. He must wear C4 aftershave or something. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2002, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/19 "2002-11-19T00:29:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by j\_kat\_251 \* > > > [@](#): > > > > _Originally posted by Broomstick_ > > Watch most closely the men (of any ethnic group) between 15 and 45 - which are most likely to commit any crime outside of prositution - … > > I hate to say this (it being so rude and all), but do you have a cite for that crime thing? FBI. Look it up. Male offenders vastly outnumber female, whether you’re talking misdemeanor or felony, probation or incarceration, with very few exceptions. > [@](#): > > Also, by ethnicity does that include non-Hispanic whiteness? What? You think white boys aren’t dangerous, too? McVeigh looked pretty Caucasian to me. How far out in left field do you have to be to come up with that? **I said _any_ ethnic group,** I didn’t mention any exceptions, did I? I didn’t say “All males of any ethnic group except left-handed half-Polynesians”, did I? I didn’t say “All males of any ethnic group but whites” either. WTF - white folks don’t have ethnicity? What are they, then, transplants from Mars? > [@](#): > > Are you saying people who don’t fit terrorist profiles should be allowed to board planes with guns? Or were you just making a point about the ineffectivity of most current airport security measures? _Jumping Jiminy Crickets!_ **I was making a point about goddamn non-security!** Any other fucking obvious items that _whooshed_ over your head? Anything else you need explained in words of one syllable? ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2002, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153/20 "2002-11-19T00:59:27Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Broomstick \* > FBI. Look it up. Male offenders vastly outnumber female, whether you’re talking misdemeanor or felony, probation or incarceration, with very few exceptions._\* Since you made the statement, shouldn’t you be the one who has to “look it up”? > [@](#): > > What? You think white boys aren’t dangerous, too? McVeigh looked pretty Caucasian to me. How far out in left field do you have to be to come up with that? **I said _any_ ethnic group,** I didn’t mention any exceptions, did I? I didn’t say “All males of any ethnic group except left-handed half-Polynesians”, did I? I didn’t say “All males of any ethnic group but whites” either. WTF - white folks don’t have ethnicity? What are they, then, transplants from Mars? I’m sure **j\_kat** will correct me if I’m misunderstanding, but it sounded like he/she was asking for clarification, not making an accusation. Is it possible that you are overreacting? > [@](#): > > _Jumping Jiminy Crickets!_ **I was making a point about goddamn non-security!** Any other fucking obvious items that _whooshed_ over your head? Anything else you need explained in words of one syllable? This seems like a hysterical shriek to a reasonable question. Why is it when people ask a question in this forum, those who choose not to answer it feel free to just scream their fool head off? Just because we’re in here doesn’t mean that logic, sensibility, and intelligence have to fly out the window, unused. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airline-passengers-getting-heads-examined/137153.md?page=2)