# airstrikes on Gaza **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 11, 2014, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856 "2014-07-11T14:55:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/461 "2014-07-18T14:18:59Z")
Here’s a [clue](http://www.oregonlive.com/today/index.ssf/2014/07/israel_deepens_gaza_push_to_de.html) - you need one. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/462 "2014-07-18T14:32:41Z")
Sorry, what is it Oregon has to offer of life in Gaza? What I state is hardly controversial or new. Except maybe if you read US media. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/463 "2014-07-18T14:40:42Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > You must surely have grasped by now launch infrastructure is utterly minimal and the rockets are launced on timers. For very obvious reasons. > > You really think those dumb Arabs are going to spend weeks building some fancy launch platform and then hang around smoking watching the launch? > > So tired, so cliched. Yes. Exactly. That’s exactly what I’m saying. Your penetrating intellect leaves me staggered by its capacity to construct bad arguments. First, just to make it clear to you, we’re talking about Hamas not Arabs. I don’t have many reservations about calling Hamas stupid but I object to smearing an ethnic group in such a manner. Then you’ll note (and you’re not good at this) that I said part of Hamas’ gross negligence towards the population of Gaza is their obvious intention to have their civilians die or be injured. If you actually want to hang your argument on Hamas’ superior moral position by pointing out the launchers of rockets are leaving the civilians behind to deal with Israeli retaliation well…best of luck with that. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/464 "2014-07-18T14:45:02Z")
> [@](#): > > Sorry, what is it Oregon has to offer of life in Gaza? > > What I state is hardly controversial or new. Except maybe if you read US media. So you are not familiar with the concept of “international news”? Imagine my astonishment. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/465 "2014-07-18T15:31:08Z")
Hold the stage coach! LOL. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/466 "2014-07-18T15:34:06Z")
> [@Grey](#): > > Yes. Exactly. That’s exactly what I’m saying. Your penetrating intellect leaves me staggered by its capacity to construct bad arguments. You’re stuck circa 2006. You are far from alone. Coming soon: the real reasons why Israel wants those tunnels and why everything else is a cover for that. One day, we might get you up-to-date. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/467 "2014-07-18T15:35:05Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > Sorry, what is it Oregon has to offer of life in Gaza? > > What I state is hardly controversial or new. Except maybe if you read US media. Palestinians repeatedly and continually fire their vengeance weapons into Israel hoping to murder as many Israelis as possible. Very controversial but not new. You continue to justify the Palestinian attacks. The Israelis abided by the truces in an attempt to stop the killing and destruction. It’s the Palestinians who have chosen not to abide by either truce and have chosen to continue to attack Israel. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Israel has every right to DEFEND themselves from vengeance weapon attacks, tunnel attacks, and suicide murderers. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/468 "2014-07-18T15:43:25Z")
Actually, my thing in this thread is I can’t believe how out-of-date the cliches and assumptions are. It’s like no one here has updated since XP. You’re stuck in a time warp, consequently what comes from that is absurd and redundant. Wars evolve, daily. Reciting the same old mantras must beome embarassing after years? Loving “vengeance weapon attacks” - does it breath fire and shit? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/469 "2014-07-18T15:56:50Z")
Tell us the _real_ reason Israel wants the tunnels please. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/470 "2014-07-18T16:02:34Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Tell us the _real_ reason Israel wants the tunnels please. Mysterious tunnels? Perhaps the Old Ones are involved, or even dread Cthulhu himself! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/471 "2014-07-18T16:25:12Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > Loving “vengeance weapon attacks” - does it breath fire and shit? It’s [an apt name](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vergeltungswaffe) for rockets fired into cities in order to terrorize and kill civilians. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/472 "2014-07-18T16:27:46Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > Actually, my thing in this thread is I can’t believe how out-of-date the cliches and assumptions are. It’s like no one here has updated since XP. > > You’re stuck in a time warp, consequently what comes from that is absurd and redundant. > > Wars evolve, daily. Reciting the same old mantras must beome embarassing after years? > > Loving “vengeance weapon attacks” - does it breath fire and shit? Palestinians have been firing their V1 and V2 vengeance weapons into Israel for years. Israel has defended itself. Palestinians are still firing their V1 and V2 vengeance weapons into Israel. Israel is, once again, defending itself. Palestinians continue to complain that the Israelis are still defending themselves from Palestinian attacks. That doesn’t seem to be out-of-date information. Palestinians can chose to stop trying to kill Israelis and destroying Israel. But that just ain’t gonna happen as long as people like yourself can justify the rocket attacks. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/473 "2014-07-18T16:57:34Z")
Even if it’s hopeless I can sorta respect the whole “throw rocks at giants” mindset. Live on your feet, not on your knees, that whole cliche spiel. But launching thousands of rockets and not killing anyone? And then you get smacked down like a kid, come on. How embarrassing is that for the guys on the ground trying to hype up the holy cause? Sure, many want to be martyrs, but I’d want my death to mean _something_. You’d think they’d kill someone by chance eventually. Reminds me of school shooters who expend hundreds of rounds of ammunition and kill like three people even though everyone is stuffed into classrooms. You’re doing it wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/474 "2014-07-18T20:21:51Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > Even if it’s hopeless I can sorta respect the whole “throw rocks at giants” mindset. Live on your feet, not on your knees. Sure. Hell, I’d do it just for the kids - to teach them not to be subservient. Gaza now is basically the Hollywood set for Terminator; drones, helicopters, satellites - so Hamas now live underground in ever-larger bases. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/475 "2014-07-18T20:24:46Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > vengeance weapons Stop it with the comic book talk. Seriously, walk into a bar and start talking to normal people like this for 5 minutes. If you get 5 minutes. Weird, weird talk. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2014, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/476 "2014-07-18T23:52:32Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > . . . Gaza now is basically the Hollywood set for Terminator . . . > [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > Stop it with the comic book talk. . . . Blatant self-contradiction in consecutive posts. Magnificent. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2014, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/477 "2014-07-19T00:29:04Z")
One is an analogy suitable, it seemed, for this audience. The other a childish descriptor. Would you like a metaphor more upscale, Shakespeare perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2014, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/478 "2014-07-19T01:14:12Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > CNN is reporting a ground [del]war.[/del] “operation.” > > ETA: it’s just an operation. Small-scale so far. [However:](http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/19/world/middleeast/israel-gaza.html?_r=0) > [@](#): > > The start of the ground campaign was a stark contrast to Israel’s 2009 invasion, when forces quickly bisected the tiny coastal enclave and blockaded Gaza City, where they engaged in gun battles with Hamas fighters. On Friday, the troops operated mainly in farmland within about a mile of Gaza’s northern, southern and eastern edges, and quickly announced they had uncovered more than 20 tunnel exit points. > > Setting the bar relatively low helps hold back public expectations, provide the military with achievable goals, and build international legitimacy. It also reflects Israel’s reluctance to re-engage long-term in Gaza or rout Hamas only to find it replaced by even more radical groups. **Though on Friday, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu ordered the military to “prepare for the possibility of widening, significantly,” its offensive.** ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2014, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/479 "2014-07-19T02:09:12Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > The United States was created in 1776. This isn’t really a debate point, you’re confusing a country’s constitution with the country itself. I guess France has only existed since the current Fifth Republic then? And you would have guessed wrong. ☹ In 1776, there were 13 colonies and each had it’s own government. 13 States and 13 governments. 14 if you count England’s Parliament. The 2nd Continental Congress issued a declaration of independence from the 13 separate and independent entities (aka the 13 States united in a common cause). In 1776, the Constitutional Convention of 1787 hadn’t taken place yet. The 2-house “Connecticut Compromise” hadn’t been thought of yet. The U.S. Constitution had not been ratified yet. In 1776, the Articles of Confederation, which would established the 13 States/colonies as a confederation of sovereign states, had not yet been ratified. That occurred in 1777. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2014, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/480 "2014-07-19T02:13:22Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > One is an analogy suitable, it seemed, for this audience. The other a childish descriptor. > > Would you like a metaphor more upscale, Shakespeare perhaps? I think people would prefer you stop insulting them and actually lay out a position and an argument. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856.md?page=25)