# airstrikes on Gaza **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 11, 2014, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856 "2014-07-11T14:55:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/161 "2014-07-12T15:45:06Z")
> [@Johnny\_Cashless](#): > > An independent cite will be easy, I’m sure? For what, specifically? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/162 "2014-07-12T16:15:44Z")
[So far](http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4542107,00.html) IDF has attacked 1,220 targets in Gaza since the beginning of the operation Protective Edge. Palestinians claim the death toll of 127. That’s one fatality per ten attacks. Judging by previous Israeli operations, most of those 127 fatalities are enemy combatants. Saying that Israelis don’t care about civilian casualties on Palestinian side is absolutely ridiculous, and flies in the face of reality. If Israel didn’t care, there would be thousands and thousands of Palestinian fatalities in the last week. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/163 "2014-07-12T17:41:05Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > For what, specifically? For your “understanding”. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/164 "2014-07-12T17:54:21Z")
So Hamas just said that they’re going to bomb us at [9 PM](http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4541998,00.html). Awfully polite of them, I guess. 6 more minutes. I’ll let you know how it turns out. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/165 "2014-07-12T18:13:35Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > So Hamas just said that they’re going to bomb us at [9 PM](http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4541998,00.html). Awfully polite of them, I guess. 6 more minutes. I’ll let you know how it turns out. Well, apparently Israel informs Palestinian civilians of airstrikes beforehand, so I suppose its only fair they return the favour. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/166 "2014-07-12T18:18:11Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > My understanding is the Israelis have technology that sometimes enable them to actually shoot at these rocket crews in real time, **sometimes before they’ve even fired their rockets.** (emphasis mine) I dunno about the other guy, but I would like to see a cite for this. Even an explanation that goes beyond ‘technology’ would be nice. > [@](#): > > That, combined with the surety of the counterstrike to where the rocket came from gives the crews little time to work on accuracy and other things. Because that would be critical to support this claim. I assume(I could be wrong), that accuracy would be a function of how much time you take in setting up beforehand, not how little time you have to escape after. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/167 "2014-07-12T18:28:58Z")
Couple of sirens, a bunch of explosions. Nothing sounded too close. > [@bldysabba](#): > > (emphasis mine) > I dunno about the other guy, but I would like to see a cite for this. Even an explanation that goes beyond ‘technology’ would be nice. > . Surveillance drones? Satellites? It’s hardly unknown technology. If you’re lucky, it’s possible to catch a guy setting up a missile launcher before he launches, if you already have assets in the air. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/168 "2014-07-12T18:30:14Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > (emphasis mine) > I dunno about the other guy, but I would like to see a cite for this. Even an explanation that goes beyond ‘technology’ would be nice. Ah, that makes sense. I don’t want to present myself as knowing much about the technology or tactics involved here, I was going off half-remembered news articles. That’s my bad and I do try to stop myself from doing that, especially in GD, but it is what it is. I believe [this](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/30/world/middleeast/israeli-drone-strike-kills-militants-in-gaza.html) article is what I was remembering, in that the Israeli drone found the Palestinian rocket crew setting up when it wiped them out. I would guess drones would be effective at this type of preventive strike because their real time and local “eye in the sky” capabilities would mean if they happened to be over air and saw something they could indeed strike right away. I have no conception as to what portion of the Israeli strikes into Gaza at present are anything like this drone strike > [@](#): > > Because that would be critical to support this claim. I assume(I could be wrong), that accuracy would be a function of how much time you take in setting up beforehand, not how little time you have to escape after. I think that makes more sense to me, too. But I would also posit if there was general fear that being out preparing rockets for very long was likely to get you noticed (by say Israeli drones), then you’d be rushing both the setup and the escape and accuracy would suffer because of it. And actually I think I’m missing what the debate is here. Is it being argued Israel shouldn’t attack Palestinian rocket crews? ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/169 "2014-07-12T19:02:35Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > Ah, that makes sense. I don’t want to present myself as knowing much about the technology or tactics involved here, I was going off half-remembered news articles. That’s my bad and I do try to stop myself from doing that, especially in GD, but it is what it is. > > I believe [this](https://boards.straightdope.com/2011/10/30/world/middleeast/israeli-drone-strike-kills-militants-in-gaza.html) article is what I was remembering, in that the Israeli drone found the Palestinian rocket crew setting up when it wiped them out. I would guess drones would be effective at this type of preventive strike because their real time and local “eye in the sky” capabilities would mean if they happened to be over air and saw something they could indeed strike right away. > > I have no conception as to what portion of the Israeli strikes into Gaza at present are anything like this drone strike > > I think that makes more sense to me, too. But I would also posit if there was general fear that being out preparing rockets for very long was likely to get you noticed (by say Israeli drones), then you’d be rushing both the setup and the escape and accuracy would suffer because of it. > > And actually I think I’m missing what the debate is here. Is it being argued Israel shouldn’t attack Palestinian rocket crews? Thanks for the cites. My understanding of the debate was that the pro-Israel side was claiming that Israel’s attacks were a causal factor in the low fatalities among Israeli civilians, and your posts were meant to further that claim. If Israel is indeed surveying and attacking(or even attempting to attack) rocket crews while they set up, I think that’s a strong argument. FWIW, I view myself as a neutral, though I find myself agreeing that Israel’s response is justifiable. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/170 "2014-07-12T19:27:10Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > And actually I think I’m missing what the debate is here. Is it being argued Israel shouldn’t attack Palestinian rocket crews? Maybe they should be more contrite as they do, or something. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/171 "2014-07-12T21:04:03Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > So Hamas just said that they’re going to bomb us at [9 PM](http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4541998,00.html). Awfully polite of them, I guess. 6 more minutes. I’ll let you know how it turns out. Good luck and stay safe. I mean that sincerely. There must be few things in the world more depressing than having to check your son’s gas mask to make sure it’s been properly secured while awaiting the alert that allows you to come outside. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/172 "2014-07-12T21:16:51Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Er… You do realize that Jordan is part of Palestine don’t you? . . . Well, if you want to play that game, so is Israel. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/173 "2014-07-12T21:21:59Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Surveillance drones? Satellites? It’s hardly unknown technology. If you’re lucky, it’s possible to catch a guy setting up a missile launcher before he launches, if you already have assets in the air. I was wondering if the Americans had satellites in a passing orbit that could see into the infrared and locate rocket launches. If it were possible to aim a weapon from a satellite, it would be an excellent way to destroy rocket launchers and their crews. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/174 "2014-07-12T21:30:49Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I was wondering if the Americans had satellites in a passing orbit that could see into the infrared and locate rocket launches. If it were possible to aim a weapon from a satellite, it would be an excellent way to destroy rocket launchers and their crews. Chloe can access satellite data showing exactly where people are inside building by their heat signatures. My cite is _24_. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/175 "2014-07-12T21:57:43Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > There must be few things in the world more depressing than having to check your son’s gas mask to make sure it’s been properly secured while awaiting the alert that allows you to come outside. The gas masks are still in the cabinet, thank God. 1991 was enough for a lifetime. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/176 "2014-07-12T22:09:44Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > The gas masks are still in the cabinet, thank God. 1991 was enough for a lifetime. What type of warhead, if that is the correct term for small rockets, do they have, explosives? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Cashless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ad7895/32.png) [@Johnny\_Cashless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Cashless)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/177 "2014-07-12T22:15:19Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > I was going off half-remembered news articles. That’s my bad and I do try to stop myself from doing that, especially in GD, Which is why I asked. Anyway, back to the Alessan and his gas masks. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/178 "2014-07-12T22:22:52Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > What type of warhead, if that is the correct term for small rockets, do they have, explosives? Of course. It’s all been conventional weapons so far. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/179 "2014-07-12T23:20:09Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Well, if you want to play that game, so is Israel. We all know that. Damuri seemed unaware that Jordan was considered Palestine or that the PLO had fought a short, bloody, ultimately failed war to turn it into a Palestinian state. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856/180 "2014-07-12T23:23:03Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > The gas masks are still in the cabinet, thank God. 1991 was enough for a lifetime. I’m very glad to hear that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/airstrikes-on-gaza/692856.md?page=10)