# Al Qaeda in Iraq: mutiplying like bread and fish? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 25, 2007, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392 "2007-06-25T21:19:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/61 "2007-06-30T19:54:18Z")
Well, you could just go count the mentions of al-Qaida and see if they’ve even gone up. A person in the first site I linked to did that, and found that al-Qaida was only being mentioned 17% of the time as compared to Shia and Sunni insurgents. That in itself seems like a pretty good slam-dunk against the notion that the U.S. government has replaced mentions of other insurgents with al-Qaida. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/62 "2007-06-30T20:02:44Z")
Over what period of time? In what context? We talking about a speech from The Leader, or a press release from a shavetail Lt in the Green Zone? Quantification may be very misleading. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/63 "2007-06-30T20:28:41Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] A person in the first site I linked to did that, and found that al-Qaida was only being mentioned 17% of the time as compared to Shia and Sunni insurgents. That in itself seems like a pretty good slam-dunk against the notion that the U.S. government has replaced mentions of other insurgents with al-Qaida. [/QUOTE] Baloney. What percentage was it 6 months ago? Show us the data that supports that it is stable over time, or falling, I will concede the point. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/64 "2007-06-30T20:38:21Z")
Daily Kos is running an excellent piece on one of this month’s deceptive ‘al Qaeda’ headlines: [Air Strikes Kill 17 Iraq Al Qaeda Fighters](http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/6/30/14501/9812). If Kos is too much for weak stomachs, [Glen Greenwald](http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/) also has the story. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/65 "2007-06-30T21:32:26Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] Baloney. What percentage was it 6 months ago? Show us the data that supports that it is stable over time, or falling, I will concede the point. [/QUOTE] Actually, this question was addressed in an earlier [link](http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/17471.html) provided by **RedFury** : > [@](#): > > A similar pattern has developed in Iraq, where the U.S. military has cited al Qaida 33 times in a barrage of news releases in the last seven days, and some news organizations have echoed the drumbeat. Last month, al Qaida was mentioned only nine times in U.S. military news releases. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/66 "2007-06-30T22:35:47Z")
[QUOTE=Boyo Jim] Actually, this question was addressed in an earlier [link](http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/17471.html) provided by **RedFury** : [/QUOTE] And during that time, the U.S. started major operations specifically against al-Qaida in al-Anbar province and in Diyala. Why would it be surprising then that this would be mentioned in press releases? If you go back to the operations in Mosul you’ll find a similar spike in press releases mentioning al-Qaida. So what? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/67 "2007-07-01T00:52:25Z")
Thanks guys, for keeping The Rajin’ Canuck in check while I took a much deserved beach break – though I’m not loving the sunburn on my bald pate and shoulders at the moment, I’m hoping the Aloe I just rubbed in will shortly work its soothing magic. As for Sam’s increasingly hysterical claims, can’t say that I blame him. I’d be doing the same thing if I was buried up to my nostrils in Bushit. Then gain, he keeps ignoring the poop-saver rings we all keep chucking his way, so I suppose he likes to wade in excrement. Oh well, to each their own. Although I won’t disclose them here, I have my own particular fetishes…but I will volunteer that being buried in scat is not one of them. One more silver bullet – not that I think it’s necessary as the self-appointed werewolf was rather a BB caliber one, but what the hey, at this point I’m rather amused by **Stone’s** bullheadedness in light of all the facts that have been unearthed. Anyway. [**No evidence ties al Qaida to recent bombing of a Shiite shrine**](http://www.mcclatchydc.com/homepage/story/17530.html) > [@](#): > > **Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Friday that the U.S. has no “hard evidence” that the Sunni Muslim insurgent group al Qaida in Iraq was responsible for the recent bombing of a Shiite shrine in Samarra, although Bush administration officials cite the attack as proof that al Qaida in Iraq is stoking sectarian violence.** > > It “ **seems to me that that’s probably an analytical conclusion. I’m not sure whether they have a lot of hard evidence about it** \*\*\*\*\*,” Gates told reporters at the Pentagon. > > His comments come as the Bush administration has renewed its focus on Iraqi insurgents who claim to be affiliated with al Qaida. **In a speech Thursday, President Bush called al Qaida the biggest threat in Iraq and said that al Qaida in Iraq was the same group that was responsible for the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks. U.S. military spokesmen in Iraq also have begun citing al Qaida in Iraq more often after years of downplaying its importance.** > > \ > > “I believe that it is al Qaida that has done the most in terms of trying to stoke sectarian violence, from the bombing of the Samarra mosque a year ago February to the second bombing of the mosque just a couple of weeks ago, and to try and provoke exactly the kind of reaction that happened after February of last year,” Gates said. “So I think that at least in terms of the combat operations that we’re conducting now, the principal enemy that they are facing is in fact al Qaida.” > > But when a McClatchy reporter asked him about the assertion, **Gates said that he knew of no hard evidence linking al Qaida in Iraq to the explosion.** \* – highlights mine. \*\*\*\*\*In a word: pathetic. Got more Bushit, **Sam**? As I said before, don’t be shy, bring it on. Hey, have a great Saturday evening all. I know I will. Hell, the aloe is already kicking in. And I also see a J&B or two in the horizon as well as some good dinner company. Later kids. Don’t do anything I wouldn’t do. Even if I’m not sure what, exactly, that would be. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/68 "2007-07-01T01:06:21Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] And during that time, the U.S. started major operations specifically against al-Qaida in al-Anbar province and in Diyala. [/QUOTE] And how do we know this? Why, because they are reporting so many AQ terrorists killed in battle! And around and round he goes, where \*\*Sam \*\* stops, nobody knows! ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/69 "2007-07-01T01:11:34Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] And during that time, the U.S. started major operations specifically against al-Qaida in al-Anbar province and in Diyala. [/QUOTE] Reminds of the time, just after the the invasion, when every rusted out shell, or old insecticide drum got trumpeted as ‘proof’ of Saddam’s possession of stockpiles of Weapons of Mass Destruction. It would have been quite the feather in the cap of any officer who delivered up the goods; and they _tried hard_. This time around, there’s quite an incentive to claim everyone killed is ‘al Qaeda’. Although, I must say I’m a little suprised we haven’t caught up with al Qaeda’s number two man in Iraq recently. That used to happen every two or three months. Perhaps the current round of major operations against al Qaeda isn’t going quite so well as it should? I hear that most of the al Qaeda fighters in Baquba _got away._ ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/70 "2007-07-01T02:21:39Z")
What is that old saying? Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice and it’s an indication that I believe in actual press releases issued by the army? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/71 "2007-07-01T03:19:30Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] …I hear that most of the al Qaeda fighters in Baquba _got away._ [/QUOTE] Who knows? Maybe they heard the grinding tank treads approaching some thirty clicks away, and decided to play Alamo, collect their martyrdom chits, Maybe the whole thing was a rousing success, and AlQ is crushed as a force in Iraq. Would we notice the difference? Who is in a position to give us the clean, objective facts, and would they if the could? War buggers truth. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/72 "2007-07-01T22:06:33Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > …Although, I must say I’m a little suprised we haven’t caught up with al Qaeda’s number two man in Iraq recently. That used to happen every two or three months. Now, that was funny. And true. 🙂 As for what **'luc** says vis-a-vis the fog of war (well, he said it a bit more colorfully), here’s a perfect example: [**Sunni faction alleges 350 dead in US military operation in Baquba**](http://news.monstersandcritics.com/middleeast/news/article_1324646.php/Sunni_faction_alleges_350_dead_in_US_military_operation_in_Baquba) Perhaps there was yet another AQ “number two” amongst the pile of corpses? Or someone is full of shit? ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2007, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392/73 "2007-07-02T00:09:09Z")
[QUOTE=elucidator] Who is in a position to give us the clean, objective facts, and would they if the could? [/QUOTE] The sad fact is that the group which was much closer to the clean, objective facts chose to consistantly lie about them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaeda-in-iraq-mutiplying-like-bread-and-fish/409392.md?page=3)