# Al-Qa'ida: "We have the right to kill 4 million Americans" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 25, 2002, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810 "2002-06-25T01:50:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/1 "2002-06-25T01:50:58Z")
Al-Qa’ida spokesman Suleiman Abu Gheith, originally from Kuwait, said in this statement - [http://memri.org/bin/articles.cgi?Page=archives&Area=sd&ID=SP38802](http://memri.org/bin/articles.cgi?Page=archives&Area=sd&ID=SP38802) > [@](#): > > “We have the right to kill 4 million Americans - 2 million of them children - and to exile twice as many and wound and cripple hundreds of thousands. Furthermore, it is our right to fight them with chemical and biological weapons, so as to afflict them with the fatal maladies that have afflicted the Muslims because of the [Americans’] chemical and biological weapons.” The offenses of the USA are summarized. And of course, there’s nothing in this statement about negotiations. It’s been said that we should try to understand the reasons Islamic fanatics attacked the U.S. The question in my mind was “How many more Americans would they want to kill to even the score for our alleged offenses?” Now I know. And I understand nothing short of force will make them give up. Bin Laden and this spokesman refer to America as “Hubal”. This article explains this word (and a lot more) - [http://education.guardian.co.uk/higher/humanities/story/0,9850,616377,00.html](http://education.guardian.co.uk/higher/humanities/story/0,9850,616377,00.html) > [@](#): > > In the years between Abraham and Mohammed, the tradition runs, the Arabs fell away from true belief and began to worship idols, with Hubal the most powerful of many. When Bin Laden calls America “the Hubal of the age”, he suggests that it is the primary focus of idol worship and that it is polluting the Kaaba, a symbol of Islamic purity. > > His imagery has a double resonance: it portrays American culture as a font of idolatry while rejecting the American military presence on the Arabian peninsula (by his definition, the holy land of Islam, a place barred to infidels). This article also says the hijackers recited this battle prayer: “All of their equipment, and gates, and technology will not prevent [you from achieving your aim], nor harm [you] except by God’s will.” ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/2 "2002-06-25T02:06:37Z")
What did you expect? I mean, it’s Al Quada! I’m not defending them, mind you, I just don’t get why people are all up in arms and in an uproar when people like Al Quada or the KKK say horrible, nasty, racist crap. It’s what they do. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/3 "2002-06-25T10:34:34Z")
Hello? Anyone still not clear that these are Very Bad People? They schoolyard bullies with better weaponry - the death and maiming is always someone _else’s_ fault. Just like wifebeaters who say “she _made me_ beat her” - uh, yeah, she grabbed your hand, forced your fingers into a fist, and shoved that fist into her own face with enough force to knock out her teeth and break her jaw. Uh-huh. God forbid these guys take responsbility for their own actions. No one has a “right” to kill or maim. Unfortunately, these guys are pretty rabid, we may have to shoot them all just to protect our own lives. ---
**Author:** ![CRorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CRorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CRorex)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/4 "2002-06-25T14:50:32Z")
Hrrm it seems like we’ve been doing a lot more maiming and killing of Al Qaida than they have done of us. They destroyed two buildings and we overthrew a country. We had more casualities from friendly fire/accidents than from Al Qaida troops shooting people. I wonder if Al Qaida members killed by bombing the caves they were hiding in told themselves and each other not to worry, they are protected by God… Ugh I’m in a bad mood today. Stupid dog was howeling all night… Goddamn neighbors ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/5 "2002-06-25T14:58:08Z")
You didn’t overthrow a country - you gave it back to its people. The only thing the US overthrew was a fundamentalist Taliban government, who rose to power by undemocratic means, to put it mildly. ---
**Author:** ![jk1245](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/49beb7/32.png) [@jk1245](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jk1245)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/6 "2002-06-25T15:20:19Z")
Anyone get the feeling these guys are just talking out of their ass to get attention now? I’m not suggesting that we ignore them or stick our head in the sand, but they seem almost desperate to instill fear now. I wonder if their capability to carry out their plans has been hurt more than we know, and they’re blustering to keep up the facade. If they truly had a feasible plan to cause some widespread damage, I doubt they’d be broadcasting it. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/7 "2002-06-25T15:23:09Z")
Good grief, CR. Are you completely unaware that approximately three thousand people died in those two buildings? Strike that question, please. You are evidently so damned stupid that you are that unaware. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/8 "2002-06-25T17:58:55Z")
I wholeheartedly agree with you **jk1245**. ---
**Author:** ![miamouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ad7895/32.png) [@miamouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miamouse)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/9 "2002-06-25T18:41:32Z")
From the first site: “They thought that oppression begets surrender, that repression begets silence, that tyranny only leaves humiliation. Perhaps they also thought that this [oppressive] atmosphere is sufficient to kill man’s virility, shatter his will, and uproot his honor. These people erred twice: once when they ignored [the consequences of] treating man with contempt, and again when they were unaware of man’s ability to triumph.” Ironically, one could say the same thing about the Taliban regime. Also from the first website: “America knows only the language of force. This is the only way to stop it and make it take its hands off the Muslims and their affairs. America does not know the language of dialogue!! Or the language of peaceful coexistence!!” Umm yeah, if anything we spend too much time sitting on our asses arguing over what the hell we should be doing, and whether or not it’s an election year. ---
**Author:** ![flyboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/4da419/32.png) [@flyboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flyboy)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/10 "2002-06-25T18:44:48Z")
I suspect what they really mean is that they have the _need_ to kill Americans, just like we, in a reciprocal fashion, have a _need_ to kill them. What they lack is the reasonable man standard. The civilized world (or most of it, anyway) knows that a “reasonable man” does not feel the need to kill others based on their ideologies and whatnot. That a “reasonable man” does not rush out into the street and cheer upon learning of the death of any (much less thousands) of noncombatant men, women, and children. So while I know what you mean, **Broomstick** , I see them in a much different light as a bully. A bully can be reasoned with, I think. These people are so whacked that they can’t be reasonable in the way we define it. So they can’t be reasoned with. Not only do I think we have a _right_ to kill them, I think we have an obligation to do so. On behalf of civilization as a whole, if not only for ourselves. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2002, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/11 "2002-06-25T19:06:34Z")
Frankly, the fact that it **wasn’t** OBL making that announcement speaks volumes, IMHO. This tells me that either the cocksmoker’s dead or he was so fucked up by our actions that they haven’t been certain he’d pull through until now. We’re not through with them yet, but I’d be willing to bet that they’re not able to pull off anything so spectacular again. ---
**Author:** ![miamouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ad7895/32.png) [@miamouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miamouse)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2002, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/12 "2002-06-26T15:11:00Z")
I agree and dissagree with you **flyboy88**. They absolutely are irrational and unreasonable, but that doesn’t mean we have the ‘right’ or the ‘obligation’ to kill anybody. Deal with, yes. Kill? maybe, if it comes down to it. I think that killing them would empower them further by creating martyrs. I’m not so sure that OBL is dead because they would turn him in to a martyr or capitalize on the belief that he’s enjoying his virgins in heaven now. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2002, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/13 "2002-06-26T22:56:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Coldfire \* > \*\*You didn’t overthrow a country - you gave it back to its people. The only thing the US overthrew was a fundamentalist Taliban government, who rose to power by undemocratic means, to put it mildly. \*\* I sure as hell hope we gave it back to its people(s). The Afghans have been through such an amazing amount of crap in the past 100 years, it’s fucking unbelievable. It’s a miracle they haven’t all slit their own wrists by now, especially the women. I’m afraid, though, that: a) the U.S. will not learn a damn thing from the Soviet experience; and b) the West thinks that Karzai will be able to solve all Afghanistan’s problems in one fell swoop. I don’t know much about the guy, but I suspect that he has a few of his own axes to grind, and that even if he’s 100% sincere and legit, he has quite a horrendous road ahead of him in terms of rebuilding the country, which had quite a ways to go in terms of development even before the Soviets marched in. ---
**Author:** ![CRorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CRorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CRorex)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2002, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/14 "2002-06-27T19:16:36Z")
Hrrm two things: Coldfire, it is actually debatable as to if the USA overthrew the country. The Taliban WAS officially recognized by another soverign state, and it did function as well as any number of officially recognized governments. (Look at some of the countries in Africa… they kinda work to the same degree…) We sent troops into a country without the request of the ruling government and their actions, in combination with non-governmental forces replaced the current regime in power. Seems like we overthrew that country nicely. And Monty. Where to start. I was respondly mainly to the end of the OP you know their little battle prayer. Their god didn’t do a whole heck of a lot to stop air fuel bombs, spy sats or ‘bunker buster’. And now: Monty… I decided that it wouldn’t have been a good idea to bring up the civilian deaths they caused. Yes 3000 people died. But obviously you are incapable of grasping that we killed a hell of a lot more afganis than that. Between 85% accurate bombings… accidentially attackign friendly militias, people killed by unexploded bomblets oh lets not forget the refugees that fled in the MIDDLE OF WINTER! How many people do you think starved or froze to death as they tried to save themselves as they fled from areas were WE were fighting? So NO I didn’t want to bring up the civilian deaths on EITHER side. The point my little primate friend, is that once we were actively engaged against Al Qaida and their Taliban allies we suffered nothing much exceeding casuality levels common in TRAINING. To me, that seems pretty damn important. It kinda shows the world that when we as a nation are finally able to launch a military strike against fundamentalist terrorists we can destroy them with little effort. The terrorists are recruited to believe they are fighting a nobel holy war against us and that god will protect them in their cause. But our fight against Al Qaida and the Taliban was much closer to a child stomping bugs. That sort of humiliating defeat usually doesn’t moral or recruitment. Hopefully you can understand what the hell I was talking about now. I wasn’t talking about the terrorist attacks on NY and DC. I was talking about the ease of our rout of the Taliban and Al Qaida AFTER the terrorist attacks. From OP “All of their equipment, and gates, and technology will not prevent [you from achieving your aim], nor harm [you] except by God’s will.” Seems like all of our equipment and technology did a damn good job of killing them as they cowered in their caves or as they tried to escape from their prisions. And it looks like our gates are pretty effective to since we have how many stuck in little tiny cages? That Monty, was my point. And nowhere into this does civilian casualties nor the terrorist attacks that started this come into play. ---
**Author:** ![CRorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CRorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CRorex)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2002, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/al-qaida-we-have-the-right-to-kill-4-million-americans/115810/15 "2002-06-27T19:26:29Z")
Hrrm two things: Coldfire, it is actually debatable as to if the USA overthrew the country. The Taliban WAS officially recognized by another soverign state, and it did function as well as any number of officially recognized governments. (Look at some of the countries in Africa… they kinda work to the same degree…) We sent troops into a country without the request of the ruling government and their actions, in combination with non-governmental forces replaced the current regime in power. Seems like we overthrew that country nicely. And Monty. Where to start. I was respondly mainly to the end of the OP you know their little battle prayer. Their god didn’t do a whole heck of a lot to stop air fuel bombs, spy sats or ‘bunker buster’. And now: Monty… I decided that it wouldn’t have been a good idea to bring up the civilian deaths they caused. Yes 3000 people died. But obviously you are incapable of grasping that we killed a hell of a lot more afganis than that. Between 85% accurate bombings… accidentially attackign friendly militias, people killed by unexploded bomblets oh lets not forget the refugees that fled in the MIDDLE OF WINTER! How many people do you think starved or froze to death as they tried to save themselves as they fled from areas were WE were fighting? So NO I didn’t want to bring up the civilian deaths on EITHER side. The point my little primate friend, is that once we were actively engaged against Al Qaida and their Taliban allies we suffered nothing much exceeding casuality levels common in TRAINING. To me, that seems pretty damn important. It kinda shows the world that when we as a nation are finally able to launch a military strike against fundamentalist terrorists we can destroy them with little effort. The terrorists are recruited to believe they are fighting a nobel holy war against us and that god will protect them in their cause. But our fight against Al Qaida and the Taliban was much closer to a child stomping bugs. That sort of humiliating defeat usually doesn’t moral or recruitment. Hopefully you can understand what the hell I was talking about now. I wasn’t talking about the terrorist attacks on NY and DC. I was talking about the ease of our rout of the Taliban and Al Qaida AFTER the terrorist attacks. From OP “All of their equipment, and gates, and technology will not prevent [you from achieving your aim], nor harm [you] except by God’s will.” Seems like all of our equipment and technology did a damn good job of killing them as they cowered in their caves or as they tried to escape from their prisions. And it looks like our gates are pretty effective to since we have how many stuck in little tiny cages? That Monty, was my point. And nowhere into this does civilian casualties nor the terrorist attacks that started this come into play.