Do you dispute that there are black women who take offense at black man/white woman couples? Do you dispute that there are some black women are so offended by it that they might be heard to make mean-spirited comments to either the man or the woman in that situation?
Maybe you don’t feel that way, but I know others who do. I’ll bet you do, too.
And I am aware of such mean-spirited comments being made, either directly to such couples or behind their backs.
You’re right, though. There is still plenty of racism around. My point is that it’s a two-way street.
Well, I have to echo what spoke- said in regards to the “black women” part. You yourself said that racism is unfortunately shared by both blacks and whites; to wonder if some of (or how much of) the opposition to repeal may have come from black voters isn’t unreasonable. The only info I found–which I posted above–indicated that rural whites were more likely to vote against repeal, whereas big city types–presumably blacks and whites–voted for. That still leaves open the possibility that rural blacks may also have been more inclined to vote against repeal.
The turnout part is partly a question of assessing just how bad the problem is. There’s a difference between “40% of Alabamans want interracial marriage to be illegal” and “40% of Alabamans who bothered to show up and vote that day want interracial marriage to be illegal”; the people who actually voted may or may not be an unbiased sample of the population as a whole. It’s not really unreasonable to wonder if maybe people with an axe to grind might have been overrepresented compared to more reasonable people who just didn’t bother to vote.
Does anybody know where there are some good exit poll numbers with breakdowns on this?
But I did say it was a two way street. Yes, black as well as white people are racists and it is true that many black women talk about all of “their men” going off with white women.
But there is a big difference between talking about all the good men who marry white women and voting to outlaw interracial marriages. The prevailing attitude amongst the racist black people is that white people can not be trusted to treat blacks as equals. Even though some black folks don’t think there should be interracial marriages, I think it is safe to assume that they would not vote to be discriminated against.
I’d like to understand why so many smart, wonderful, non-racist people keep looking for some other reason besides the obvious. Maybe it’s a reflection on this board’s almost complete lack of racism. The “there has to be something else going on here” attitude shows, perhaps, that many people find these ideas unthinkable. This is good.
Slightly over 300,000 people, according to one poster. My hope is that it really is a generational thing and that thinking is going the way of the dinosaur, to be replaced by the lot of you, who can’t understand how this could be.
What’s all this about the vote not being repesentative due to low turnout? The low turnout on such a significant matter in itself indicates a deeply racist populace.
No. That would be true if this had been a contentious issue, or if there had been any possibility whatsoever that the amendment would not pass. As it was, the whole matter recieved almost no coverage–I suspect that many, many people who voted did not know the refrendum was even going to be on the ballot until they saw it. I live in Alabama, read the op/ed page most days, and honest to god the only thing I even saw on this issue pre-election was one editorial that basically said “it’s about damn time”. I also do not remember a single letter to the editor encouraging people to vote against it, or anything like that. To the urban population, this was a complete non-issue, a technacality that was overdue to be fixed. To suggest that there was anything racist about failing to show up to vote in favor of what was for all intents and purposes a sure thing is hyperbole.
Just for the record, I agree that there is way to argue around the fact that this is blatently racist. On the other hand, my own personal experience seems to agree with the idea that if nothing else time will take care of this discrepancy. This sort or irrational repulsion at the idea of intermarrige seems to be strongest among the older generations (who are disproportionaly represented at the polls).
Thank you (and MandaJo)for saying what I’ve been trying for the past week. Maybe I should be less ‘poetic’ and more plainspoken with my observations. Since this is largely a symbolic vote, there isn’t much reason for ‘enlightened’ to vote to kill the amendment. However since it’s a symbolic vote, it’d be a moral victory for the segregationist to say they have the power and the support to keep this statue in the state constitution. They’d have more to gain if this resolution failed (to kill the interracial relationship ban) than everyone else would if the bill passed (to kill the ban). So the segregationist would have more incentive to vote.
A similar pheonemon exists reguarding the Religious Right. I think its called the 13% Rule. I remember reading an opinion explaining it on The New Republic’s old website. Basically it states that all the Religious Right needs to do to control national policy is get 13% of the vote. OK, in general elections (with a presidential race occuring) turnout has been hovering at 50%. (A majority of that would be just around 25% of the population.) In off year elections (Congress, smaller offices, ballot initiatives), (and in many cases down ballot issues), turnout is only half of that for the presidential election. With only 25% of the pop. going to the polls, you’d just need to sway 13% of the people passionately to get off their duffs to go the polls. What about the other 87%. Well, apathy isn’t as good a motivating factor as the “destruction of your way of life” so you can deduce where I’m heading with this…
Precisely. There are still young bigots, too, but the percentages seem to dwindle with each new generation. I’ll wager that a clear majority of those who voted to keep the marriage ban were over the age 45.
You know, bigotry in general has its roots in the theory “I’m better than those folks because of X.” I’m not sure the opinions expressed here make the OP any less bigoted than those misguided souls who voted against ending the interracial marriage ban.
Fair enough. Here’s my bigotry: I feel morally superior in one aspect to racists…I admit it. The “even in Alabama” and “shee-it” were (failed) attempts at levity. Again, I admit to perpetuating a stereotype of an Alabama bigot. Sorry for being unclear.
I got no problem with feeling morally superior to racists, Gundy. I’m right there with ya. Just don’t go thinking you’re superior to all Alabamians, though. As an Alabamian, I can confidently assert that I’m superior to you.
Then there is the problem of potraying the bigots as hillbilly rednecks. This trivializes the problem and the attitude. It also removes black people from the equation in many people’s eyes.
In is my deepest hope that in just a few more generations and this dicussion will be moot.
I don’t believe the problem will ever completely vanish, but I do think it will at least be mitigated with the passage of time.
In my earlier post, I noted that the bigoted attitudes seem to dwindle generation-by-generation in the South. The most pronounced generational difference is that between the attitudes of the last generation that attended segregated schools and the first generation that attended integrated schools. (Hence my guess in the earlier post that most voting to keep the marriage ban were over 45).
In addition to integration, I would not underestimate the impact of mass media on changing attitudes. Before the advent of television, it was much easier to maintain bigotry from generation to generation. There were few outside sources to contradict the casual racism heard around the dinner tables in the South.
Television changed things tremendously in my view. A kid might hear bigoted remarks from his or her parents, but then after dinner everyone sits down and watches, say, All in the Family, or a documentary on the Civil Rights movement, and the kid realizes how ridiculous those parental attitudes are.
Network television gets its share of ridicule, but I give the networks a lot of credit for helping to change attitudes in the South.
Hmmm. That theory might be worthy of a thread of its own at some point.
