# Alabama Crimson Died **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 11, 2012, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637 "2012-11-11T00:18:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MadTheSwine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MadTheSwine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MadTheSwine)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/1 "2012-11-11T00:18:40Z")
Aggies! ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/2 "2012-11-11T00:40:46Z")
I am very surprised. All the SEC detractors are in over drive right now. I don’t we will see an SEC team in the BCS game this year now. I think two of these three teams will remain undefeated (Notre Dame, Oregon, K-State). quite possibly all three. Oregon probably has the toughest schedule with California (tonight) Stanford and Oregon St and PAC12 Championship game. Notre Dame has Boston College (tonight), Wake Forest, USC K-State has TCU (tonight) , Baylor and Texas. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/3 "2012-11-11T02:08:35Z")
What’s most interesting to me is… this victory for the Aggies was NOT a fluke. The Aggies earned this win by thoroughly outplaying the Tide for most of the game. I don’t think he can win, but I’m sure Johnny Manziel has earned an invitation to the Downtown Athletic Club. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/4 "2012-11-11T02:19:33Z")
HeisManziel? I think there really needs to be a bigger playoff just because of situations like this. Just because the SEC has horrific infighting and this year isn’t going to offer up an undefeated team, doesn’t at all mean that Alabama wouldn’t crush K-State like piddly little bugs, and probably Notre Dame as well. Hell, I think that any of the top 4 SEC teams would beat Notre Dame or K-State handily, and Oregon is the only one that would give any of them a run for their money. ---
**Author:** ![MadTheSwine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MadTheSwine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MadTheSwine)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/5 "2012-11-11T02:57:50Z")
> [@bump](#): > > HeisManziel? > > I think there really needs to be a bigger playoff just because of situations like this. > > Just because the SEC has horrific infighting and this year isn’t going to offer up an undefeated team, doesn’t at all mean that Alabama wouldn’t crush K-State like piddly little bugs, and probably Notre Dame as well. Hell, I think that any of the top 4 SEC teams would beat Notre Dame or K-State handily, and Oregon is the only one that would give any of them a run for their money. I assume you think lsu and florida are two of the top 4 sec teams, neither of which belong in the top 15, and would be blown out by K State and Oregon. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/6 "2012-11-11T02:59:11Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I think there really needs to be a bigger playoff just because of situations like this. I completely agree, voting for 2 teams is pretty weak. > [@](#): > > Just because the SEC has horrific infighting and this year isn’t going to offer up an undefeated team, doesn’t at all mean that Alabama wouldn’t crush K-State like piddly little bugs, and probably Notre Dame as well. Hell, I think that any of the top 4 SEC teams would beat Notre Dame or K-State handily, and Oregon is the only one that would give any of them a run for their money. All conferences beat each other up. You realize that, right? It’s not just the SEC that plays other teams from their own conference…the other conferences also play tough teams within their conference. At the risk of sounding a little rude, that has got to be the dumbest freaking argument anyone can make. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/7 "2012-11-11T03:35:44Z")
Whoooop! ---
**Author:** ![notfrommensa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f14d63/32.png) [@notfrommensa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notfrommensa)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/8 "2012-11-11T03:36:54Z")
Its going to be another **My SEC Dad** can beat up **your [Insert Conference] Dad** argument. Buckle up. It is going to be a wild ride. ---
**Author:** ![azraiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@azraiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/azraiel)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/9 "2012-11-11T05:13:15Z")
EMAW! That is all. ---
**Author:** ![sitchensis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sitchensis/32/4892_2.png) [@sitchensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sitchensis)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/10 "2012-11-11T07:13:51Z")
The Ole Ball Coach, “Alabama, gosh, they look like they could beat a couple of those NFL teams that I’ve watched on Sundays,” That man is a brilliant little shit. Well played sir ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/11 "2012-11-11T13:52:24Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I think there really needs to be a bigger playoff just because of situations like this. You are aware that starting in 2014 there is a 4 team playoff format, right? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/12 "2012-11-11T14:07:56Z")
A title game without an SEC team! I might actually watch it this time around. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/13 "2012-11-11T15:18:13Z")
> [@RaftPeople](#): > > I completely agree, voting for 2 teams is pretty weak. > > All conferences beat each other up. You realize that, right? > > It’s not just the SEC that plays other teams from their own conference…the other conferences also play tough teams within their conference. > > At the risk of sounding a little rude, that has got to be the dumbest freaking argument anyone can make. The argument I’m making is that just because all the SEC teams have at least one loss, it shouldn’t necessarily and obviously make them ineligible to be in consideration for the natl. championship. in the absence of a larger non-conference schedule played by ALL conferences, and some sort of guarantee that they play real opponents, not creampuffs like Missouri State, South Carolina State or Tennessee Tech, it’s awfully hard to really get a good sense of who’s actually good and who’s not. Basically, I’m saying that Alabama is still probably the overall best team in the country, even considering the A&M win, and just because they lost to another 8-2 SEC team, that’s not prima facie evidence that they’re not the best team in the country. Put another way, I’m saying that one loss is not prima facie evidence that a team is ineligible for the national championship, because there are too many variables in play to reasonably claim that, not least among them is the fact that conferences like the SEC tend to have several top 10 teams in any given year. ---
**Author:** ![zamboniracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e9a140/32.png) [@zamboniracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zamboniracer)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/14 "2012-11-11T16:27:05Z")
> [@bump](#): > > \ > > Put another way, I’m saying that one loss is not prima facie evidence that a team is ineligible for the national championship, because there are too many variables in play to reasonably claim that, not least among them is the fact that conferences like the SEC tend to have several top 10 teams in any given year. If that is true, then of course last season 11-1 Oklahoma State, Stanford and Boise State had an equally valid claim along with 11-1 Alabama to playing against LSU in the championship game. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/15 "2012-11-11T16:47:14Z")
I don’t think Alabama is even in the Top 5 at this point. They’ve played a bunch of relatively weak teams and 2 good teams. They struggled vs. one of those and lost to the other. I’m not impressed that Saban has been able to run up the score a bunch against mediocrity. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/16 "2012-11-11T17:40:29Z")
> [@zamboniracer](#): > > If that is true, then of course last season 11-1 Oklahoma State, Stanford and Boise State had an equally valid claim along with 11-1 Alabama to playing against LSU in the championship game. 😃 They absolutely had a valid claim, and that’s why I’d say a larger than 4 team playoff is the way to go. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/17 "2012-11-11T17:44:57Z")
> [@bump](#): > > The argument I’m making is that just because all the SEC teams have at least one loss, it shouldn’t necessarily and obviously make them ineligible to be in consideration for the natl. championship. > > in the absence of a larger non-conference schedule played by ALL conferences, and some sort of guarantee that they play real opponents, not creampuffs like Missouri State, South Carolina State or Tennessee Tech, it’s awfully hard to really get a good sense of who’s actually good and who’s not. > > Basically, I’m saying that Alabama is still probably the overall best team in the country, even considering the A&M win, and just because they lost to another 8-2 SEC team, that’s not prima facie evidence that they’re not the best team in the country. > > Put another way, I’m saying that one loss is not prima facie evidence that a team is ineligible for the national championship, because there are too many variables in play to reasonably claim that, not least among them is the fact that conferences like the SEC tend to have several top 10 teams in any given year. In other words, Alabama deserves to be in the NC regardless of how they do on the field because you think they are simply that good. Yep, we should add the **bump** column to the BCS calc: 20% Polls 20% computers 60% Whatever the hell **bump** thinks ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/18 "2012-11-11T18:10:37Z")
I wouldn’t count Bama out of the NatChamp game yet. They only fell to 4th in the AP. If a team like Georgia with only one legit win on their resume can be ranked 5th in the BCS, why can’t Bama be ranked 2nd? ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/19 "2012-11-11T19:37:31Z")
> [@RaftPeople](#): > > In other words, Alabama deserves to be in the NC regardless of how they do on the field because you think they are simply that good. > > Yep, we should add the **bump** column to the BCS calc: > 20% Polls > 20% computers > 60% Whatever the hell **bump** thinks Man, you seem awfully angry about this. My whole point is not necessarily that Alabama in particular is that awesome, but that simply because a team (in a tough conference no less) has one loss, it doesn’t at all mean that they’re clearly and obviously national championship caliber. There are too many variables in play for that to be true, or for anyone in their right mind to believe that. You have things like the general retardation of sports journalists, the difficulty of measuring strength of schedule, things like rivalries, momentum, etc… That’s why I think an 8 team playoff would give us a much better way to determine the national champion. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2012, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637/20 "2012-11-11T21:31:02Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Man, you seem awfully angry about this. You’re right, I didn’t need to word it the way I did. > [@](#): > > My whole point is not necessarily that Alabama in particular is that awesome, but that simply because a team (in a tough conference no less) has one loss, it doesn’t at all mean that they’re clearly and obviously national championship caliber. I agree with you that a playoff with 4 or 8 teams is a better way to determine the NC. If so, many deserving teams over the last 10 years would have had a shot instead of getting blocked due to our current ridiculous setup. But in the context of our current ridiculous setup, Alabama, at this point doesn’t deserve to be in there because they lost to a decent but not great team. Just like OkSt got shutout last year (last year I argued Alabama deserved a shot over OkSt due to the quality of their loss). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alabama-crimson-died/640637.md?page=2)