# Albright Abroad? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 28, 2000, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971 "2000-02-28T19:02:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ben42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d07c76/32.png) [@ben42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ben42)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2000, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/1 "2000-02-28T19:02:00Z")
A number of news organizations are repeating Time’s story about Madeleine Albright considering running for president of the Czech Republic after Vaclav Havel steps down. Some of the the stories mention that a few Americans have become government officials in other countries. All of those people, though, were ordinary citizens in the U.S. Wouldn’t the United States object to a Secretary of State (or someone else with access to classified material) working for a foreign goverment—even an ally? ---
**Author:** ![NickyLarson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b2d939/32.png) [@NickyLarson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NickyLarson)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2000, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/2 "2000-02-28T20:20:00Z")
They’re talking about her doing this **after** her term as Secretary of State expires, so, she can do what she wants then. Of course, she’d have to renounce her citizenship, since no American citizen can hold office in another government. * * * If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway. ---
**Author:** ![ben42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d07c76/32.png) [@ben42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ben42)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/3 "2000-02-29T00:03:00Z")
I understand that this is after her term. But she’d presumably still know a lot of secret stuff. ---
**Author:** ![ben42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d07c76/32.png) [@ben42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ben42)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/4 "2000-02-29T00:07:00Z")
I understand that this is after her term. But she’d presumably still know a lot of secret stuff. To put it another way: if the embattled John Deutch (former CIA director) decided he’d had enough of Uncle Sam, could he go and work for somebody else? ---
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/5 "2000-02-29T02:27:00Z")
Ben raises an interesting point. After all, her knowledge of classified information isn’t going to disappear (or become immediately obsolete) just because her tenure as Sec’y of State ends. Let’s say an issue comes up between the Czech Republic and another nation in the area. She knows something classified about that nation or its leadership as a result of her U.S. service that would give the Czechs an advantage in their dealings with that other country. Does she use it or remain silent? And what about the inevitable dealings that she woould have to have with the U.S.? Sounds like a conflict of interest to me. ---
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/6 "2000-02-29T02:29:00Z")
Weird. Ben’s last two posts, bearing times from 2 hours ago, were not there when I wrote the above reply. (And my typing is not THAT slow!) ---
**Author:** ![Ursa\_Major](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a88e57/32.png) [@Ursa\_Major](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ursa_Major)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/7 "2000-02-29T03:03:00Z")
I don’t know if I’d call Madeleine Albright a broad. Then again, she’s not really a dame or a skirt or a chick either. ---
**Author:** ![Olentzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90ced4/32.png) [@Olentzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Olentzero)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/8 "2000-02-29T17:34:00Z")
Broad, chick, Secretary of State… IMO, she looks like Grandpa Munster. * * * Cave Diem! Carpe Canem! ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2000, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/9 "2000-03-01T06:50:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by NickyLarson: > Of course, she’d have to renounce her citizenship, since no American citizen can hold office in another government. I’ve read that the rule is “You lose your citizenship if you hold \*certain[/] offices in another government.” I tried to find a list of the offices that would cause you to lose citizenship, but couldn’t find it. Has anyone seen such a list? I’m not convinced that president of the Czech Republic would be an office that would cause you to lose your nationality. ---
**Author:** ![Andy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/aeb1de/32.png) [@Andy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/10 "2000-02-29T19:10:00Z")
But unless dual citizenship is tolerated in both countries, wouldn’t you think that the Czechs might have something to say about having a president with an American passport? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/11 "2000-02-29T19:22:00Z")
Ask and ye shall receive, straight from the Master: [www.straightdope.com/columns/970627.html](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/970627.html)[www.straightdope.com/columns/970808.html](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/970808.html) ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/12 "2000-02-29T19:44:00Z")
Thank you for the links, andros, but I don’t see anywhere in the columns a discussion about which foreign offices an American citizen isn’t allowed to hold. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2000, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/13 "2000-02-29T19:52:00Z")
Sorry, Jacques, I was responding to android’s off-the-cuff “unless dual citizenship is tolerated” line. I actually had a followup to that extent, but my ISP ate it. Have no answer to your question, yet, but I’m talking to an ex-pat friend of mine (now Israeli) about it. -andros- ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2000, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/14 "2000-03-01T04:00:00Z")
Unless I’m missing something, I don’t think Ms. Albright would automatically lose her citizenship just by becoming President of the Czech Republic. The relevant provision appears to be: > [@](#): > > United States Code, Sec. 1481. > (a) A person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by voluntarily performing any of the following acts **with the intention of relinquishing United States nationality** - > … > (2) taking an oath or making an affirmation or other formal declaration of allegiance to a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, after having attained the age of eighteen years; or > … > (4) (A) accepting, serving in, or performing the duties of any office, post, or employment under the government of a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, after attaining the age of eighteen years if he has or acquires the nationality of such foreign state; or (B) accepting, serving in, or performing the duties of any office, post, or employment under the government of a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, after attaining the age of eighteen years for which office, post, or employment an oath, affirmation, or declaration of allegiance is required. So, there are two elements to losing citizenship. First, you have to do certain things, like swear allegiance or take an office under a foreign nation, but the second requirement is that you have to do it with the intention of renouncing U.S. citizenship. Becoming President of the Czech Republic would likely qualify under the “office” requirement, and I assume she would have to swear an oath of allegiance, but that would not be enough to make her lose her U.S. citizenship. She would also have to do it with the intention of renouncing, as set out in the opening words of para. (a). I would be surprised if someone like Ms. Albright would voluntarily renounce her U.S. citizenship. * * * and the stars o’erhead were dancing heel to toe ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2000, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/15 "2000-03-01T17:37:00Z")
Thank you, **jti**. Now where did you find that information? I need to hone my www searching skills. I’m relieved. Now when I go on vacation, and in a drunken celebration gather a group of disaffected locals, start a rebel movement and fight my way to president of the country, I know I’ll always be welcome back in the US of A. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2000, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/16 "2000-03-01T17:54:00Z")
American citizen Milan Panic served a term as either president or prime minister (I forget) of Yugoslavia in the early 1990s. Congress passed a law excepting him from the requirement of foregoing his American citizenship. There was also a case around that time of a US Army general who was asked to head up the armed forces of one of the Baltic countries. I believe the Army told him no. ---
**Author:** ![TomH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@TomH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TomH)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2000, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/17 "2000-03-01T17:59:00Z")
Wasn’t Eamon de Valera a US citizen? I’m presuming that he took Irish (and possibly British) nationality at some stage in his life, but he was born in the US and, IIRC, his connection with the US was one of the reasons he wasn’t executed in 1916—the British Government thought it might cause a diplomatic incident. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2000, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/18 "2000-03-02T02:21:00Z")
TomH, According to _Chambers Biographical Dictionary_, De Valera was born in Brooklyn, New York, of Irish-Spanish parentage, in 1882. In his youth, he moved to Ireland, where he was raised by an uncle and entered the nationalist movement. The entry doesn’t specifically address the citizenship issue, but he would have been an American by virtue of his birth in the U.S. I’m not quite sure how the rules worked back then, but I think that if his father was Irish, he would have been born a British subject, by inheritance. Britain at that time recognised all children of British subjects born abroad as British subjects themselves. If his father was Spanish and his mother Irish, I doubt that he would be a British subject by birth, since I think the children of mixed marriages at that time acquired their father’s nationality, not their mother’s. If he wasn’t a British subject by birth, he could have been naturalised when he moved to Ireland and was raised by his uncle. And, you are correct about his fate after the Easter Uprising. He was convicted by court-martial and sentenced to death, but the sentence was commuted after the intervention by the U.S. Consul. As senior survivor of the Uprising, he was elected to Parliament upon his release in 1917. * * * and the stars o’erhead were dancing heel to toe ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2000, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/19 "2000-03-02T02:27:00Z")
Arnold, You’re welcome. The source that I normally use for American statutes, constitutions, etc. is the [Legal Information Institute](http://www.law.cornell.edu/index.html), operated by Cornell Law School. It has links to damn near everything, including the United States Code. (By the way, the home page for the LII doesn’t like MacJava on IE5, if that’s an issue for you. Not all of the page shows up. I use Netscape to surf the LII.) * * * and the stars o’erhead were dancing heel to toe ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2000, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/albright-abroad/7971/20 "2000-03-02T06:50:00Z")
> [@](#): > > If his father was Spanish and his mother Irish, I doubt that he would be a British subject by birth, since I think the children of mixed marriages at that time acquired their father’s nationality, not their mother’s. This is correct, at least in the case of Britain. Any child born to a British woman outside of Britain before 1984 is not considered a British national; however, the child is if the father is British. * * * ~Harborina “Don’t Do It.”