# Alexander the great .
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577
**Category:** In My Humble Opinion
**Created:** [September 13, 2010, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577 "2010-09-13T08:44:55Z")
**Posts on this page:** 13
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)
#### Post date: [September 15, 2010, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/41 "2010-09-15T14:13:57Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> As for your concerns re: Elizabeth I, well, she \*was \*wimminfolk. Had she conquered the entire world and ushered everlasting peace on Earth, the best she could have hoped for was “Elizabeth the Not Quite Totally Inferior”.
> [@Alessan](#):
>
> Bear in mind that the Russians, who are not notably less misogynistic than the English, had no problem calling their own Tsarina “Catherine the Great”. My guess that it’s more a matter of the English constitutional approach to monarchy - ever since the Magna Carta, the Brits have been suspicious of monarchs who think too highly of themselves.
“The Great” tends to be appended only when there are lesser monarchs of the same name in the same country. Elizabeth was the only ruling English monarch of that name for over three hundred years. Catherine the Great, on the other hand, was Catherine II of Russia. Are there any cases of a monarch being called “the Great” who didn’t have namesakes in the same country?
It wouldn’t have been necessary to give Elizabeth I a distinguishing sobriquet until 1953. Of course, to start calling her “the Great” at that point would imply that Elizabeth II was “the Lesser,” which would be rather insulting to a monarch who was just starting her rule. Maybe in a few hundred years people will start referring to Elizabeth I as “the Great.”
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### Author:  [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)
#### Post date: [September 15, 2010, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/42 "2010-09-15T15:51:46Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#):
>
> Genghis Khan wouldn’t fit the Blank the Great formula. You need a single name like Alexander or Alfred or Catherine or Frederick or Peter. Genghis Khan the Great sounds silly.
As others have said above, Genghis Khan is a title, not a name (“Genghis” = something like “universal”; “Khan” = king, ruler).
His _name_ was Temujin. So, “Temujin the Great”.
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### Author:  [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)
#### Post date: [September 15, 2010, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/43 "2010-09-15T16:25:44Z")
> [@Colibri](#):
>
> Are there any cases of a monarch being called “the Great” who didn’t have namesakes in the same country?
Peter I of Russia was known as “the Great” during his own lifetime. To be fair, it could also be a reference to his height - the man was 6’8".
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### Author:  [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)
#### Post date: [September 15, 2010, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/44 "2010-09-15T16:37:30Z")
> [@Colibri](#):
>
> “The Great” tends to be appended only when there are lesser monarchs of the same name in the same country. Elizabeth was the only ruling English monarch of that name for over three hundred years. Catherine the Great, on the other hand, was Catherine II of Russia. Are there any cases of a monarch being called “the Great” who didn’t have namesakes in the same country?
The aforementioned Alfred the Great is the only King Alfred of Wessex, the Anglo-Saxons or England.
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### Author:  [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)
#### Post date: [September 15, 2010, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/45 "2010-09-15T17:13:17Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#):
>
> The aforementioned Alfred the Great is the only King Alfred of Wessex, the Anglo-Saxons or England.
True, though his family did spit out another contender - [Alfred Aetheling](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Aetheling).
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### Author:  [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)
#### Post date: [September 16, 2010, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/46 "2010-09-16T00:10:18Z")
> [@Colibri](#):
>
> > [@indian](#):
> >
> > Why not Genghis Khan the great ?
>
> Alexander was Alexander III of Macedon. He was called “the Great” to distinguish him from the other rulers of the same name.
>
> Since there were no other Genghis Khans, it was unnecessary to distinguish him from any others.
>
> Likewise, King Alfred the Great is distinguished from King Alfred Aetheling.
>
> At least these guys got “the Great” to distinguish them from other monarchs of the same name. We also have had:
>
> Ethelred the Unready
> Charles the Bald
> Charles the Bad
> Louis the Fat
> Juana the Mad
> Ivan the Terrible
Terrible wasn’t a bad thing, it meant something like “mighty” or “will make you cower in terror because he’s so awesome.” Of course, it didn’t help that he had a murderous secret police to bolster his government and earn the sobriquet.
Unready was a mistranslation of unræd apparently. It’s still not a very positive nickname.
Edward, the Black Prince sounds scary, although he didn’t have a bad reputation, except perhaps to his enemies. I don’t know if we know the origin of this name.
We also have Philip IV, who was “the Fair.” It certainly wasn’t given because he slandered the Templars and had them murdered in order to steal their coffers, or because he oppressed the Jews. It was because of his appearance. He did have relations with the Mongols, although Genghis was dead by then.
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### Author:  [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)
#### Post date: [September 16, 2010, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/47 "2010-09-16T04:30:31Z")
Yep. Ivan the Terrible is, in translated as _Ivan Grozny_, which actually means, “the Dreaded”. Someone you don’t want to fuck with. (He was Ivan IV)
His grandfather, Ivan III, was known as Ivan the Great.
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### Author:  [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)
#### Post date: [September 16, 2010, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/48 "2010-09-16T14:28:54Z")
Since Genghis Khan translates as “Ruler of the universe”, it’s like asking “Why not Charlemagne the Great?”
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### Author:  [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)
#### Post date: [September 16, 2010, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/49 "2010-09-16T14:32:43Z")
That’s not what it translates to.
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### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [September 16, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/50 "2010-09-16T14:49:31Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#):
>
> Yep. Ivan the Terrible is, in translated as _Ivan Grozny_, which actually means, “the Dreaded”. Someone you don’t want to fuck with. (He was Ivan IV)
Precisely. He could just as easily have been dubbed “the Awful”, “the Dreadful”, “the Atrocious” or “the Appalling”
As in “someone who inspires awe”, “someone who inspires fear”, “someone heinous/who commits atrocities” and “someone who makes you grow pale (with fright)” respectively. Funny how the meaning of words shifts, innit ?
[QUOTE=thelurkinghorror]
We also have Philip IV, who was “the Fair.” It certainly wasn’t given because he slandered the Templars and had them murdered in order to steal their coffers, or because he oppressed the Jews. It was because of his appearance. He did have relations with the Mongols, although Genghis was dead by then.
[/QUOTE]
That one’s clearer in the original French, where he’s called Philippe le Bel. “Bel” being a dated form of the adjective “beau”, which you can recognize as coming from the same Latin root as “beautiful”.
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### Author:  [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)
#### Post date: [September 16, 2010, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/51 "2010-09-16T16:57:20Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#):
>
> Unready was a mistranslation of unræd apparently. It’s still not a very positive nickname.
Ethelred Unraed very loosely translates as something like Wiseman the Foolish (more literally Noble Counsel-No Counsel), so while it has nothing to do with him being unprepared it was not complimentary.
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### Author:  [@KRC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KRC)
#### Post date: [September 17, 2010, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/52 "2010-09-17T00:38:35Z")
Seeing as Ghengis sounds like a disease (sorry, you have Ghengis, we’ll have to amputate your leg) I’m starting a movement for calling him The Khanster.
As for Alexander the Great, he brought ringneck parrots to Europe. As a longtime owner of ringnecks, I’m still not certain how great he was.
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### Author:  [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)
#### Post date: [September 17, 2010, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alexander-the-great/553577/53 "2010-09-17T03:44:28Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#):
>
> Edward, the Black Prince sounds scary, although he didn’t have a bad reputation, except perhaps to his enemies. I don’t know if we know the origin of this name.
I think it was because he wore black armor.
> [@Colibri](#):
>
> Ethelred Unraed very loosely translates as something like Wiseman the Foolish (more literally Noble Counsel-No Counsel), so while it has nothing to do with him being unprepared it was not complimentary.
He didn’t apparently get the nickname until quite a while after his death. And it’s not derogatory to him…it’s derogatory to the people around him.
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