# all my friends like empire strikes back the best but I like return of the jedi **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 4, 2010, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257 "2010-05-04T04:26:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/41 "2010-05-04T20:14:00Z")
> [@shy\_guy](#): > > Like other posters, _Jedi_ was my favorite of the movies when I was a kid. > > Nowadays, though, I find that the movie pretty much goes off the rails as soon as the scene at Jabba’s palace ends. I actually don’t mind the ewoks so much, but the goofy stuff with C-3PO acting as their god is really annoying and the script practically mines vaudeville for jokes. This, incidentally, is why _Last Crusade_ is my least favorite of the Indy movies. (Or second least favorite, depending on whether one counts the fourth as existing or not.) I liked the relationship between Indy and his dad, and it had two great lines, (“No ticket!” and “He has chosen… poorly.”) but that’s about all the film has going for it. _Temple_ worked better as a movie, although it’s astounding how racist it comes off by contemporary standards (although that also sort of works on a meta level, as the original adventure serials to which it was supposed to pay homage were not exactly bastions of enlightened racial harmony). _Raiders_, on the other hand, is one of the few absolutely perfect movies in existence. Which is not to say it’s one of the best movies in existence, but rather it succeeds on its rather modest goals so completely that there’s simply no room for improvement. The “standard action/adventure movie” may not be the greatest film genre, but within that genre, there is no movie that so perfectly fulfills the tropes and themes that define the genre as _Raiders of the Lost Ark_. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/42 "2010-05-04T20:20:16Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > I saw it when it opened, and Lucas was very clear that it was part 2 of a trilogy, not the second in a series of standalone movies. Were you equally annoyed at things not being wrapped up at the end of Fellowship of the Ring and The Two Towers? I’m guessing you’re a bit older than **Gangster Octopus**. It’s a lot easier to appreciate a movie existing as part of a larger narrative when you’re twenty five (which is how old I was when _Fellowship_ came out) then it is when you’re five (which is how old I was when _Empire_ came out.) ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/43 "2010-05-04T20:55:15Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I’m guessing you’re a bit older than **Gangster Octopus**. It’s a lot easier to appreciate a movie existing as part of a larger narrative when you’re twenty five (which is how old I was when _Fellowship_ came out) then it is when you’re five (which is how old I was when _Empire_ came out.) I was 12 when I saw TESB so yes my sensibilites were quite different back then. Plus, there really was no template for a trilogy that I recall. There were Satruday serials in the 50’s, but not in the late 70’s. Back then sequels were basically James Bond, in which each movie was its own entity. Sp in a fashion this was uncharted territory for a lot of us youngsters. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/44 "2010-05-05T00:23:30Z")
How come Yoda acts so silly when he first meets Luke? ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/45 "2010-05-05T00:29:16Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > How come Yoda acts so silly when he first meets Luke? 1.) It’s a test for Luke. Not everything is as it seems. The last person Luke expects to be the master Jedi is this silly little alien. Demonstrating how Luke treats those he finds inferior with impatient disregard could be a part of it, too. 2.) I can’t think of a story in specific to support this, but it’s my understanding that a strange little hermit that winds up being a wise and powerful mentor is a common archetype in fantasy and one that Lucas was attempting to emulate. ---
**Author:** ![Covered\_In\_Bees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ab992/32.png) [@Covered\_In\_Bees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covered_In_Bees)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/46 "2010-05-05T00:29:38Z")
To test Luke’s patience. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/47 "2010-05-05T00:32:51Z")
> [@Covered\_In\_Bees](#): > > To test Luke’s patience. Given that Yoda’s first words when he breaks his cover are something to the effect of “I cannot teach him. He has no patience.” I’d say this is a good summation. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/48 "2010-05-05T00:47:23Z")
And, he is a muppet after all. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/49 "2010-05-05T04:00:47Z")
did George Lucas seriously think those CGI entertainers in Jabba’s palace was a good idea? ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/50 "2010-05-05T04:11:11Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > did George Lucas seriously think those CGI entertainers in Jabba’s palace was a good idea? Yes. Yes, he did. He’s worshiped as a God and so no one had the balls to tell him what a retarded idea it was. I’ve seen clips of him and his people watching Episode I for the first time and they all look seriously worried. George’s first response is “I think I might have gone overboard” or something to that affect. Ten minutes later he’s rationalizing all the decisions he made and his team of workers are nodding along with him. Have you ever seen a video clip of him making a joke? A roomful of pliant laughter. I hate George Lucas for what he’s done to his own creation. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/51 "2010-05-05T04:12:35Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > The only thing that really redeems **RotJ** as anything other than a rehash of **ANH** is Leia in a brass bikini. But then, Liea in a brass bikini could redeem **Plan 9 From Outer Space**! Yeah, but what was the likelihood of Ed Wood (of all people) doing that? We’re probably lucky he didn’t have Bela Lugosi in a brass bikini. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/52 "2010-05-05T05:50:49Z")
Why is Boba Fett so popular? Does he even have 3 minutes total screentime in both movies he is in? also don’t tell me about PT or EU stuff for that doesn’t count ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/53 "2010-05-05T05:54:34Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > Why is Boba Fett so popular? Does he even have 3 minutes total screentime in both movies he is in? The small amount of screen time he gets is actually part of what makes him cool. He’s this quiet, menacing bounty hunter who hardly talks. His helmet looks cool. His ship has a badass name. He’s smart enough to know how Han escaped the Star Destroyers in ESB. George ruined him in the original trilogy. ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/54 "2010-05-05T06:13:27Z")
I didn’t even know his ship had a name I didn’t even know his name until the RotJ although he is in the ESB credits (am I right about that or did I miss his name being said in ESB?) ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/55 "2010-05-05T06:26:56Z")
You, my friend, are a Star Wars noob. 😉 > [@PSXer](#): > > I didn’t even know his ship had a name Boba Fett’s ship is named _The Slave I_. > [@PSXer](#): > > I didn’t even know his name until the RotJ although he is in the ESB credits (am I right about that or did I miss his name being said in ESB?) His name was first mentioned in _Return of the Jedi_. ---
**Author:** ![GreedySmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a698b9/32.png) [@GreedySmurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreedySmurf)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/56 "2010-05-05T06:53:04Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > The small amount of screen time he gets is actually part of what makes him cool. He’s this quiet, menacing bounty hunter who hardly talks. His helmet looks cool. His ship has a badass name. He’s smart enough to know how Han escaped the Star Destroyers in ESB. > > George ruined him in the original trilogy. And also the fact that he didn’t take any guff from Vader. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/57 "2010-05-05T06:55:25Z")
> [@GreedySmurf](#): > > And also the fact that he didn’t take any guff from Vader. That too. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/58 "2010-05-05T17:32:22Z")
Fett’s popularity is ultimately down to clever marketing. After the first movie, of course, they started selling action figures of the characters, which were (as I think everyone knows) extremely popular. Well, they also made another action figure which hadn’t appeared yet in the original, but which was a sneak preview of a character who’d appear in the sequel. And you couldn’t buy this action figure in stores: You had to go through some complicated mail-order thing with proofs-of-purchase and what-not. So, since this action figure was so hard to get, that automatically made it (and by extension, the character it was based on) cool. ---
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/59 "2010-05-05T18:27:28Z")
I also think _Last Crusade_ is the worst of the Indy movies. In the previous two, Indy was surviving on his wits, knowledge, and skill as an adventurer/archeologist and was a credible hero. In _Crusade_ he was turned into a bumbler, accidentally stumbling his way from one set piece to the next purely on slapstick fortune. JarJar Binks in a fedora. Gah, I hate that movie. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257/60 "2010-05-05T19:18:02Z")
Empire is a better movie. Jedi is more fun to watch. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-my-friends-like-empire-strikes-back-the-best-but-i-like-return-of-the-jedi/538257.md?page=4)