# "All-Out Civil War in Iraq: Could It Be a Good Thing?" (Fox News) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 24, 2006, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997 "2006-02-24T23:40:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/81 "2006-02-26T14:44:48Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > To me, it means Fox once again did “their usual thing” … Release crap and then chicken out and try to purge the records of it. Just like they did in the past. During the War On Christmas, Fox had “holiday this” and holiday that" on their site, and then quietly changed it. Stop with the self-inflicted lobotomy, this has already been explained to you. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/82 "2006-02-26T14:47:16Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > MMFA is two bit and hackneyed and would benefit from any publicity. Why would Fox rise to the bait to give them credibility? Nobody but rabidly partisan left-wing nutjobs gives a shit about MMFA. They’ve posted an alleged screen capture and neglected to provide it’s context. No such segment can be found at Fox though they are all archived chronologically. None are missing because there two “your world” segments that day and they are **both** accounted for. > > Nobody gives a shit about MMFA. They don’t rise to the level worthy of contempt or getting shouted down. > > Bullshit. FOX slamming MMFA would only do MMFA good as some people besides left-wing nutjobs might realize they exist. Nice theory, excepting that they routinely whine about MMFA already. Here’s a letter containing a sampling of Bill O’Reilly sniping at Media Matters: [http://mediamatters.org/items/200412160011](http://mediamatters.org/items/200412160011). Oops. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/83 "2006-02-26T14:52:17Z")
It seems incredibly unlikely to me that this a photoshop job. This is a fairly high-profile website, they would get caught quickly with something so easily disprovable. Plus, it would finish them; their whole reason for existing is pointing out inaccuracies in right-wing media, and the hypocracy of doing the same would destroy them. The gain is practically nothing compared to the risk. Sure, it’s possible, I guess, people do very stupid things sometimes, but if I were betting man I’d bet against it. And frankly, I’m not sure why anybody would think the view portrayed is so unlikely that they would even think “photoshop”. Obviously, the people who are for the war feel the human sacrifice is worth whatever they feel will be accomplished or was accomplished by the war. Why should the added deaths of a continuing civil war change that view? ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/84 "2006-02-26T14:59:06Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Do you know of any other single instance of Media Matters doing anything remotely dishonest or deceptive? You mean like rushing to make false and spurious accusations? [http://www.themediareport.com/aug2005/nommattersapology.htm](http://www.themediareport.com/aug2005/nommattersapology.htm) [http://newsbusters.org/node/547](http://newsbusters.org/node/547) ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/85 "2006-02-26T15:01:29Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > And frankly, I’m not sure why anybody would think the view portrayed is so unlikely that they would even think “photoshop”. Becuse the segments of “your World” that aired that day are accounted for and available at Foxnews. I linked to them. They do not agree with what Media Matters reports. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/86 "2006-02-26T15:03:18Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Stop with the self-inflicted lobotomy, this has already been explained to you. Has it? So why can’t you find anything about “ **Will there be a civil war in Iraq? YOUR WORLD W/ NEIL CAVUTO** ” in all your copious searching, like Google found. That text doesn’t appear on the cached page either, if that is part of your explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/87 "2006-02-26T15:06:43Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Has it? So why can’t you find anything about “ **Will there be a civil war in Iraq? YOUR WORLD W/ NEIL CAVUTO** ” in all your copious searching, like Google found. That text doesn’t appear on the cached page either, if that is part of your explanation. The cached page is to February 12’s Foxnews frontpage. On it, enough of your terms appear to make it show up. The **highlight** them for you. They list which ones show up and which don’t. Your search linked to a page that coincidently matched a number of your terms. Do you understand now? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/88 "2006-02-26T15:07:13Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Becuse the segments of “your World” that aired that day are accounted for and available at Foxnews. I linked to them. You did? Where was this? You linked to two snippets clearly labeled “partial transcripts.” If I recall correctly, the Bio for Asman says he covers the 12-1:30 portion of their programming. Are you actually suggesting that these two web pages of text took them an hour and a half to cover? Are you lying or just crazy? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/89 "2006-02-26T15:11:06Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > The cached page is to February 12’s Foxnews frontpage. On it, enough of your terms appear to make it show up. > > The **highlight** them for you. They list which ones show up and which don’t. > Your search linked to a page that coincidently matched a number of your terms. > > Do you understand now? No. I understand how Google took the words I entered and came up with the link. Now I’m asking you to explain where the Google preview got the specific phrases I bolded for you. You are saying that the text “Will there be a civil war in Iraq? YOUR WORLD W/ NEIL CAVUTO” appeared on that page on February 23, 2006, but has changed because the news evolved. Fine. But you are also claiming that the only topics covered on that show on February 23 were Wayne Gretzky and Las Vegas. How is that possible, if at one time the text on the page read “Will there be a civil war in Iraq? YOUR WORLD W/ NEIL CAVUTO”. This is what you haven’t explained, you pissy little bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/90 "2006-02-26T15:12:14Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Okay, what really was on Fox at 2:05 Mountain Time on February 23, 2006? If you feel these screen caps are fraudulent, it should be pretty easy to clear up by demonstrating that something else was presented at that time on that date. **As I’ve linked** it was a segment about Las Vegas and one about Anna Benson. The links give you the transcripts. You can watch the video. That’s what was on! Jesus Christ, guys! Help me out here. Give me a break. I’ve already given you links to what was actually on. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/91 "2006-02-26T15:21:25Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > No. I understand how Google took the words I entered and came up with the link. Now I’m asking you to explain where the Google preview got the specific phrases I bolded for you. It didn’t. It just got some of the words, and highlighted them > [@](#): > > You are saying that the text “Will there be a civil war in Iraq? YOUR WORLD W/ NEIL CAVUTO” appeared on that page on February 23, 2006, but has changed because the news evolved. Fine. No. Some of your search terms show up. If you put in the phrase you quoted you get this: [http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q="Will+there+be+a+civil+war+in+Iraq%3F+YOUR+WORLD+W%2F+NEIL+CAVUTO"&btnG=Google+Search](http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22Will+there+be+a+civil+war+in+Iraq%3F+YOUR+WORLD+W%2F+NEIL+CAVUTO%22&btnG=Google+Search) > [@](#): > > But you are also claiming that the only topics covered on that show on February 23 were Wayne Gretzky and Las Vegas. How is that possible, if at one time the text on the page read “Will there be a civil war in Iraq? YOUR WORLD W/ NEIL CAVUTO”. This is what you haven’t explained, you pissy little bitch. Because your looking at a huffington post cite linking to the mediamatters story. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/92 "2006-02-26T15:26:17Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Becuse the segments of “your World” that aired that day are accounted for and available at Foxnews. I linked to them. > > They do not agree with what Media Matters reports. I’m not familair with the show, does it normally have only 2 segments? Surely you can see at least the possibility that the web site does not have transcripts for every segment, if only to encourage the viewer to watch it on TV, since they won’t be able to catch what they missed on the transcript? I’ll give you that it’s possible they photoshopped it, although I feel it is unlikely for reasons I already mentioned. Can you admit the possibility the web site doesn’t have a transcript for every segment of every show? ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/93 "2006-02-26T15:27:22Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > More significantly, _Fox News_ could clear it up. And if it were false, they’d consider it an opportunity. > > **Scylla** : **Fox News knows about this.** You know how I know? Because along with the screenshot, MMfA provided phone numbers and email addresses for Fox News and Neil Cavuto, so that MMfA readers could call/email and holler at Fox for being crazy fucks. > > Chances that no one did? Approximately zero. > > Chance of no huge Fox News slam of MMfA if this screen shot was inaccurate? About the same. They’d _love_ to crucify MMfA. > > So where’s the big slam? > > If that’s the sound of crickets chirping, those screen shots are real. Your chain of logic is flimsier than the evidence of huge hidden caches of WMD remaining in Iraq. I don’t know what was said on that day, yet you post a screen cap w/o any collaborating evidence and Scylla has linked to transcripts from the shop in question. What evidence do you find more compelling? Christ, if you have any actual evidence, post it for God’s sake, stop building a house of cards. > [@RTFirefly](#): > > What alternate universe do they live in, where this is even an interesting ‘devil’s advocate’ position? We. Don’t. Know. What. Was. Said. During. That. Segment. On. Fox. I’m withholding judgment until I know what exactly was discussed. You may think that reading headlines is all that you need to do to stay informed, but I prefer some actual, you know, facts. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/94 "2006-02-26T15:27:28Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > It didn’t. It just got some of the words, and highlighted them I cut and pasted what Google gave me back to me in post #73. When you tell me “It didn’t”, are you now accusing me of fabricating that? > [@](#): > > Because your looking at a huffington post cite linking to the mediamatters story. Hey, Capt. IDon’tGetIt, I was looking at the Google results page. I cut and pasted the text. Jesus, you are thick. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/95 "2006-02-26T15:30:04Z")
Show. That last post should read “Show in question”, not “shop in question”. I haven’t taken the position that MM faked anything, just that we don’t know what exactly was said, and I’d like to before offering an opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/96 "2006-02-26T15:32:43Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > I cut and pasted what Google gave me back to me in post #73. When you tell me “It didn’t”, are you now accusing me of fabricating that?Hey, Capt. IDon’tGetIt, I was looking at the Google results page. I cut and pasted the text. Jesus, you are thick. No. I was trying to be nice. It appears you cut and pasted the one from the huffington post which is where your excerpt is from. The one from Fox which is the first one that shows up when you conduct the search says: > [@](#): > > (From google, first link with search terms “Fox news iraq civil war good”) > [FOXNews.com](http://FOXNews.com) - Politics News - Transcript: Bush Speech on Iraq. … They failed to incite an Iraqi civil war. They failed to prevent free elections. … > [www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160969,00.html](http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160969,00.html) - 68k You made a mistake and cut and pasted the wrong one. I had assumed it was an honest mistake. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/97 "2006-02-26T15:41:33Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > The cached page is to February 12’s Foxnews frontpage. On it, enough of your terms appear to make it show up. > > The **highlight** them for you. They list which ones show up and which don’t. > Your search linked to a page that coincidently matched a number of your terms. > > Do you understand now? Nope. That’s not the way Google works. It won’t link to pages that have some words, but not others (except for words like ‘a’, ‘and’, ‘to’, ‘the’) - it’ll tell you it couldn’t find any results. The only two ways google will find a page is if every term appeared on the page, or if pages pointing to that page contained the terms in their hyperlinks. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/98 "2006-02-26T15:45:05Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > No. I was trying to be nice. It appears you cut and pasted the one from the huffington post which is where your excerpt is from. > > The one from Fox which is the first one that shows up when you conduct the search says: > > You made a mistake and cut and pasted the wrong one. > > I had assumed it was an honest mistake. Fuck you, you deceitful cunt. In post [#76](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7142100&postcount=76), you imply that you clicked on the very link I was referring to at the time. In fact, you said: > [@](#): > > The link brings you to the front page of the news. It means some or all of the words showed up there at some time. The front page changes because the news changes. Now you are suggesting that I mistook the link for a Huffington Post link, and suggesting that I falsified my quote? What a pathetic, desperate lying little partisan cunt you are. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/99 "2006-02-26T15:53:08Z")
> [@bup](#): > > Nope. That’s not the way Google works. It won’t link to pages that have some words, but not others (except for words like ‘a’, ‘and’, ‘to’, ‘the’) - it’ll tell you it couldn’t find any results. > > The only two ways google will find a page is if every term appeared on the page, or if pages pointing to that page contained the terms in their hyperlinks. Not quite. If you list words it will show you by relevance posts with the terms you’ve put in, but not necessarily with **all** the terms. To make it behave as you say you can use advanced options or the “and” feature to make sure it only shows pages that have all the terms. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2006, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997/100 "2006-02-26T15:56:49Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Not quite. If you list words it will show you by relevance posts with the terms you’ve put in, but not necessarily with **all** the terms. > > To make it behave as you say you can use advanced options or the “and” feature to make sure it only shows pages that have all the terms. [You are incorrect.](http://www.google.com/help/basics.html) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-out-civil-war-in-iraq-could-it-be-a-good-thing-fox-news/345997.md?page=6)