# All right, I'll ask. Being a jerk via PM? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [March 17, 2010, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750 "2010-03-17T13:17:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Beadalin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@Beadalin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beadalin)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/61 "2010-03-17T17:04:47Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > trying to shut down discussion by making stuff up is not encouraged. Kinda seems like that’s exactly what you did, bub. Specifically, you made up a “threat” from Sleeps. At the very least, you’re the only one here who’s capable of the mental contortions it takes to twist “will be considered harrassment” into a threat. It’s actually rather impressive. ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/62 "2010-03-17T17:05:52Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I was going to do a partial quote, but since it’s all of two sentences: What the hell is wrong with you, dude? That’s not anywhere near a suspension worthy offense. Are you worried you might lose this pretigious position you have at some random internet message board? The _smart_ thing to do is realize you overreacted and rescind the suspension. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/63 "2010-03-17T17:10:29Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > She said further PMs would be construed as harrassment. I don’t think it meant she was simply going to be unhappy and not tell anyone. What kind of sense would that make? So there was no threat. Got it. > [@](#): > > And no, there is no way that answering a single question qualifies as harrassment. If you would answer the actual question I asked maybe I wouldn’t have to ask it over and over. I didn’t ask if it were harassment. I asked that if she said that she considers it harassment, is she telling the truth. Not the same thing at all, and you know it. You are the one who wrongly accused her of a falsehood. You are the one who wrongly accused her of a threat. And you are the one who suspended her because your hide got a little chapped. That is some chickenshit moderating, son. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/64 "2010-03-17T17:12:09Z")
> [@Arnold\_Winkelried](#): > > No, I don’t think that responding to a moderator explaining “here is why you got a warning” with a message saying “if you keep on replying to my PMs asking you about my warning, I’m going to consider this harassment” is an inappropriate use of moderation. Thanks for the cookie! Chocolate chip? Keep 'em coming! Sorry, my last sentence got mangled in editing. It was supposed to read: No, I don’t think that giving a **minor** suspension (the shortest I ever remember) to a poster who responds to a moderator explaining “here is why you got a warning” with a message saying “if you keep on replying to my PMs asking you about my warning, I’m going to consider this harassment” is an inappropriate use of moderation. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/65 "2010-03-17T17:12:48Z")
> [@tacoloco](#): > > Are you worried you might lose this pretigious position you have at some random internet message board? What would I be worried about? I’m a volunteer, she has no grounds for a complaint, and mods don’t get fired just because someone complains about a warning. No, I didn’t think my position was being threatened. I did think she was continuing to break the rules by making a frivolous complaint. (And in the context of a message board, you really have to work hard to make a complaint stand out for its pointlessness.) > [@](#): > > The _smart_ thing to do is realize you overreacted and rescind the suspension. And this is why the staff talks before doing stuff like this. I didn’t go off and handle this on my own. ---
**Author:** ![Beadalin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@Beadalin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beadalin)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/66 "2010-03-17T17:16:59Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > What would I be worried about? I’m a volunteer, she has no grounds for a complaint, and mods don’t get fired just because someone complains about a warning. No, I didn’t think my position was being threatened. I did think she was continuing to break the rules by making a frivolous complaint. (And in the context of a message board, you really have to work hard to make a complaint stand out for its pointlessness.) Doesn’t all of that completely undermine your stated reasons for the suspension? ---
**Author:** ![CircleofWillis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/54ee81/32.png) [@CircleofWillis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CircleofWillis)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/67 "2010-03-17T17:18:29Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > And this is why the staff talks before doing stuff like this. I didn’t go off and handle this on my own. So you _ **all** _ flew off the handle? Do they bake psilocybin into the coffee mugs when firing them in the kiln? ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/68 "2010-03-17T17:20:01Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > And this is why the staff talks before doing stuff like this. I didn’t go off and handle this on my own. Ah yes, the infallable round table of moderators? Dude, seriously, you and the rest of the mods are completely wrong on this. It’s a frivolous and capricious suspension. You got pissed because Sleeps sassed you and now you’re just digging your heels in. Be a man, stand up and do the right thing. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/69 "2010-03-17T17:26:02Z")
This board has a history of taking harassment complaints very seriously. That policy protects posters, and it also protects moderators. I have no problem with this. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/70 "2010-03-17T17:32:15Z")
Marley23, how many times did you PM her, and what exactly were in them? Quote them, please. ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/71 "2010-03-17T17:34:03Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > This board has a history of taking harassment complaints very seriously. That policy protects posters, and it also protects moderators. I have no problem with this. In other words, this board has a long history of overreacting to stuff. > [@needscoffee](#): > > Marley23, how many times did you PM her, and what exactly were in them? Quote them, please. I’m sorry, you don’t have the required clearance for the information. +++connection terminated+++ ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/72 "2010-03-17T17:35:13Z")
Yowsa. **Marley23** , I’m not one of the usual suspect complainers. I both appreciate your mod style and get a kick out of you as a poster. I don’t think I’ve had a problem with your decisions before. I’m further not a big fan of **Sleeps** , who sometimes seems like a shit-stirrer. And finally, I’m also a board administrator who can totally sympathize with the pain of dealing with obnoxious, petty-minded quibblers who loooove stepping toes over the line and then, when you tell ‘em to knock it off, bat their eyelashes and are all "who, li’l ol’ _me_?" All this said? I really can’t see “I’ll consider this harassment” as being worth a suspension, much less a week. Even if she’d said “I’ll consider this harassment and will take action accordingly,” she might just have meant putting you on Ignore. It might have been a better idea for another mod to PM her and ask her to clarify … giving her rope to hang herself with, for example, if she responded with “I’ll post on ATMB and complain to Ed!” (I still can’t see that as being against the rules or jerkish, but maybe I’m missing some nuance of the situation. Wouldn’t be the first time!) It’s just the scale here. **lissener** racked up SIX different warnings for outrageous putzitude, not to mention having a past of having been suspended once already, and earned himself a mere thirty-day suspension. And **Sleeps** gets 1/4 of that punishment for something so iffy and potentially misunderstood anyway? A week’s suspension isn’t that big a deal, that’s for sure. I’m not worried that **Sleeps with Butterflies** will languish in limbo or anything. More concerning is the overall impression that such a mod overreaction will create on the plebescite. This will undoubtedly cause more _tsuris_ to the community, at least those who notice it, than it will to **Sleeps** herself. I dunno, guys. I usually have your backs, but this feels wrong to me. I wonder if you might rethink this? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/73 "2010-03-17T17:44:31Z")
> [@Beadalin](#): > > Doesn’t all of that completely undermine your stated reasons for the suspension? No, I don’t think so. I’m aware it was an empty threat (or promise, or gesture, pick your word) and I realized that at the time. But like I said, I don’t believe we have to put up with this kind of stupid crap. If you disagree with a warning, go ahead and argue it. But don’t announce that you will make an insincere complaint just to get back at us if we don’t do what you want. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/74 "2010-03-17T17:51:02Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > If you disagree with a warning, go ahead and argue it. But don’t announce that you will make an insincere complaint just to get back at us if we don’t do what you want. Since she did not do that, your justification for suspending her is baseless, if for no other reason then that sending a _private message_ can in no way be considered an _announcement_ anywhere else but in MarleyWorld. The fact that only you have gleaned this threat of a complaint from her message, or that the point was retribution, and that you have provided absolutely no justification for your charge that she was insincere, is only the cherry on top of the bullshit sundae. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/75 "2010-03-17T17:52:00Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > Marley23, how many times did you PM her, and what exactly were in them? Quote them, please. I am not going to quote the whole conversation. \ ***Sleeps With Butterflies** received her warning notification at 11:21 a.m. \*She responded to me at 11:36. \*At 12:27 p.m. I gave her a second warning. \*At 12:34 p.m., she asked me why I’d ignored her question (about my mod note) in the Cafe Society thread, and gotten busy elsewhere on the board while that argument continued. \*At 12:42, I said I’d been offline all night and had not ignored her question or the thread. \*At 12:44 she said further contact from me would be considered harrassment. ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/76 "2010-03-17T17:52:35Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > No, I don’t think so. I’m aware it was an empty threat (or promise, or gesture, pick your word) and I realized that at the time. But like I said, I don’t believe we have to put up with this kind of stupid crap. If you disagree with a warning, go ahead and argue it. But don’t announce that you will make an insincere complaint just to get back at us if we don’t do what you want. Which is not worthing of a suspension of any sort. You guys screwed up and now you’re unwilling to correct it to save face, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/77 "2010-03-17T17:53:58Z")
\*12:45: You suspended her. Okay then! ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/78 "2010-03-17T17:57:02Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > \*12:45: You suspended her. > > Okay then! Around 3:45, actually. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/79 "2010-03-17T18:34:00Z")
> [@choie](#): > > All this said? I really can’t see “I’ll consider this harassment” as being worth a suspension, much less a week. Even if she’d said “I’ll consider this harassment and will take action accordingly,” she might just have meant putting you on Ignore. It might have been a better idea for another mod to PM her and ask her to clarify > > It’s just the scale here… And **Sleeps** gets 1/4 of that punishment for something so iffy and potentially misunderstood anyway? Yeah, **Marley** , I guess this is where I end up at as well. Like I said before, I can understand the frustration at being poked or sassed and sure I agree the moderator staff should have carte blanche to send PMs as part of their duties. So I understand the motivation. But this one just seems a little too heavy-handed for such a minor bit of ( private, rather than attention-seeking ) snark. Especially since **Sleeps** doesn’t seem to be a consistent rule-breaker, really. A little quietly contemptuous of some management/some board policies from time to time maybe, but that isn’t necessarily against the rules. End of the world? Hardly. A one week suspension isn’t really that big of a deal and I don’t think **Sleeps** is likely to lose much sleep over it. Still, it seemed and still seems just a little much from my end. I think an irritated shrug of the shoulders would have been a better way to go or at most do as **Choie** suggested and have someone else make a little intervention. Sorry about piling on a bit after we discussed this before, but I think this is a legitimate, if not terribly major complaint. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750/80 "2010-03-17T18:35:30Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > It sounds like you think I sent kept sending messages to her until I get a response. I didn’t. She sent me a PM in response to the automatic warning notification, and I responded to what she said. Most warning notifications don’t get answered and I don’t seek any further comment or acknowledgement on those. I don’t at all. I think that you sent PM’s in addition to the system sending PM’s. Once again, you’re inferring that which has not been implied. > [@Arnold\_Winkelried](#): > > Two PMs instead of one is a valid concern? Yes, I guess I am out of touch with the latest in the evil doings of the Powers That Be. I’l have to go dig out my latest copy of the _Illumaniti Conspiracy_ - I’ve been remiss in keeping up with that fine publication, what with all the time I’ve been spending flying my black helicopter over your neighbourhood. 🙂 YES! Right on time. Mis-characterizing what was obviously a joke in order to demean the poster and dismiss their points as invalid. Well done. You’re nothing if not consistent. > [@](#): > > No, I don’t think that responding to a moderator explaining “here is why you got a warning” with a message saying “if you keep on replying to my PMs asking you about my warning, I’m going to consider this harassment” is an inappropriate use of moderation. Thanks for the cookie! Chocolate chip? Keep 'em coming! Well at least you’re only taking one side of the argument into consideration in order to have a complete frame of reference. Certainly Marley has no history of using personal bias to infer intent that was n…oh, wait… > [@Arnold\_Winkelried](#): > > Sorry, my last sentence got mangled in editing. It was supposed to read: > No, I don’t think that giving a **minor** suspension (the shortest I ever remember) to a poster who responds to a moderator explaining “here is why you got a warning” with a message saying “if you keep on replying to my PMs asking you about my warning, I’m going to consider this harassment” is an inappropriate use of moderation. And, the length of the suspension has what to do with whether or not it was appropriate? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-right-ill-ask-being-a-jerk-via-pm/532750.md?page=5)