# All the Squid in the Sea? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 25, 2007, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240 "2007-12-25T23:43:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![xiix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/d6d6ee/32.png) [@xiix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xiix)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2007, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/1 "2007-12-25T23:43:12Z")
Can my fellow dopers help solve a scrabble debacle? The Hasbro scrabble dictionary says ‘squids’ is a legitimate word but google informs us that the plural of Squid is Squid. So what is the etymology/meaning of ‘squids’??? EDIT: Out of interest I checked [m-w.com](http://m-w.com) for ‘squids’ (which it listed as an alternate spelling of the plural of squid) and ‘mooses’ (which it did not list). So why is ‘squids’ acceptable and mooses unacceptable? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2007, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/2 "2007-12-25T23:47:02Z")
Similar to fish/fishes. A catch of all the same species can be several hundred fish, but the by-catch might have dozens of fishes. But I don’t believe “squids” is a legitimate would, unless you are referring to naval personnel. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2007, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/3 "2007-12-25T23:48:27Z")
Might be similar to “fish,” where you can refer to a collection of different species of fish as “fishes,” awkward though that sounds. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2007, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/4 "2007-12-25T23:54:29Z")
It may be informal, but I’ve never had anyone complain when I mutter about “a bunch of [del]drunk, idiot[/del] squids on liberty.” I don’t know if many dictionaries accept that use of squid to mean sailor, though. As for what is an isn’t an acceptable Scrabble word? Usually it seems to me that if the word is one that some highly educated member of the English upper classes might have known from schooling in the classics, or from their service in India, it’s usually good. Otherwise not so good. I get really annoyed with all the Indian import words that are allowed (and are now common Scrabble words) when other common import words are still unallowed. Like “gi,” for example. ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/5 "2007-12-26T00:37:18Z")
“Squids” just doesn’t look right to me. I’d question it too. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/6 "2007-12-26T00:45:03Z")
Webster’s unabridged, 1913: [http://machaut.uchicago.edu/?resource=Webster’s&word=squid&use1913=on&use1828=on](http://machaut.uchicago.edu/?resource=Webster%27s&word=squid&use1913=on&use1828=on) > [@](#): > > 1. (Zoöl.) Any one of numerous species of ten-armed cephalopods having a long, tapered body, and a caudal fin on each side; especially, any species of Loligo, Ommastrephes, and related genera. See Calamary, Decacerata, Dibranchiata. &hand; Some of these squids are very abundant on the Atlantic coast of North America, and are used in large quantities for bait, especially in the cod fishery. The most abundant of the American squids are the northern squid (Ommastrephes illecebrosus), ranging from Southern New England to Newfoundland, and the southern squid (Loligo Pealii), ranging from Virginia to Massachusetts. ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/7 "2007-12-26T00:53:30Z")
Seems to be the collective noun is squid, while the term for two or more kinds/species of squid is [squids.](http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=squid) Yep, you’d get by on it, but you’d need the dictionary within easy reach. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/8 "2007-12-26T01:00:15Z")
[QUOTE=OtakuLoki] As for what is an isn’t an acceptable Scrabble word? Usually it seems to me that if the word is one that some highly educated member of the English upper classes might have known from schooling in the classics, or from their service in India, it’s usually good. Otherwise not so good. I get really annoyed with all the Indian import words that are allowed (and are now common Scrabble words) when other common import words are still unallowed. Like “gi,” for example. [/QUOTE] Oh, stop quibbling. I got to play ‘cunt’ the other day, and it was honestly the best move I could make. Honest. In seriousness, there is perhaps the lack of the removal of obsolete words which regular dictionaries perform. ‘Qi’ would have surely gone long ago - haven’t we all standarised on ‘chi’? The former isn’t in the Cambridge online dictionary, for example. ---
**Author:** ![SharkB8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/977dab/32.png) [@SharkB8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SharkB8)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/9 "2007-12-26T02:10:05Z")
Back when I was a marine bio student…about a year ago, I had one professor who’s whole deal was to study the squid. My roomie and I found it quite amusing that he called more than one squid “squids.” So amusing, his nickname, behind his back, was Squids. And this dude knows his stuff. He and his team were the ones that found that female squid clutching her eggs (presumably encasing baby “squids”) close to her body in the depths a couple years ago. > **[From Seal Whiskers to Fish, CELS Graduate Student is Getting in Touch with...](https://web.uri.edu/cels/from-seal-whiskers-to-fish-cels-graduate-student-is-getting-in-touch-with-sensory-biology/)** > > If you’ve ever accidentally placed your hand on a hot stove, you know just how important our sense of touch is. But for other animals like fish, their survival depends on their ability to sense vibrations and currents underwater. As a College of... I’m sure he had a look over his bio before it was uploaded, if he didn’t write it himself, but the expert goes with “squids.” Personally, I can’t bring myself to say that. So I’ll go with squid. While we’re on the subject of plurals of marine life, and going off of a previous post, I had ANOTHER professor, this one a shark pro, who, too, said “fishes.” I guess, technically, yes, the plural can be either, but who the heck says “fishes?” There are plenty of fishes in the sea I suppose. Drove me nuts…and yes, her nickname became Fishes. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/10 "2007-12-26T02:13:17Z")
[QUOTE=SharkB8] I guess, technically, yes, the plural can be either, but who the heck says “fishes?” [/QUOTE] It can be a verb, as well, you know? ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/11 "2007-12-26T02:29:53Z")
Squids, and sometimes Sicilians, [sleep with the fishes](http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sleep+with+the+fishes). ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 4:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/12 "2007-12-26T04:46:36Z")
[QUOTE=GorillaMan] Oh, stop quibbling. I got to play ‘cunt’ the other day, and it was honestly the best move I could make. Honest. [/QUOTE] I’m sure, for someone of your known distaste for questionable humor, in all it’s myriad forms, would never choose a Scrabble word simple for shock or humor value, but only for the score you could make with it. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/13 "2007-12-26T11:06:10Z")
[QUOTE=xiix] EDIT: Out of interest I checked [m-w.com](http://m-w.com) for ‘squids’ (which it listed as an alternate spelling of the plural of squid) and ‘mooses’ (which it did not list). So why is ‘squids’ acceptable and mooses unacceptable? [/QUOTE] There’s only one species of moose (_Alces alces_)? Possibly, a vertebrate paleontologist could talk about extinct mooses and get away with it, but the rest of us have no excuse. ---
**Author:** ![Myglaren](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Myglaren](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myglaren)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/14 "2007-12-26T12:50:13Z")
So, no excuses when speaking of Mooses? ---
**Author:** ![robcaro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@robcaro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robcaro)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/15 "2007-12-26T13:15:04Z")
From American Heritage dictionary: squid n., pl. squids or squid. Any of various marine cephalopod mollusks of the genus Loligo and related genera, having a usually elongated body, ten arms surrounding the mouth, a vestigial internal shell, and a pair of triangular or rounded fins. [Origin unknown.] ---
**Author:** ![puppygod](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@puppygod](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puppygod)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/16 "2007-12-26T14:08:59Z")
My understanding was always that plural “squid” is used as a mass noun, ie. when there is uncountable bulk of squid, like all squid in the sea. When you have a specific, countable number of squids - say, those three squids swimming in aquarium, you use “squids”. The same rule for the fish/fishes. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/17 "2007-12-26T15:28:56Z")
Squids is a perfectly legitimate word on several levels. The following is from OED. First, in its normal sense, look at the cites and note the plurals with s among them. > [@](#): > > 1613 PURCHAS Pilgrimage (1614) 747 Smelts and Squids..come on shore in great abundance, fleeing from the deuouring cod. 1620 MASON Newfoundland 5 What should I speake of..Squides a rare kind of fish at his mouth squirting mattere forth like Inke. 1791 Phil. Trans. LXXXI. 44, I send you..some of the bills of the fish called Squids (which are supposed to be the food of spermaceti whales). 1809 Naval Chron. XXI. 22 Squids, a squalid kind of fish. 1863 COUCH Brit. Fishes II. 46 From one example I took two Gobies and a Launce: from another a Squid, (Loligo media), five inches in length. 1888 GOODE Amer. Fishes 27 Hunting for crabs, shrimps, squids, and other invertebrate animals. Secondly, in this sense: > [@](#): > > squid, 5 > > 1. A lead disc used as a puck in the game of octopush. Thirdly, this one: > [@](#): > > SQUID A device consisting essentially of a superconducting ring containing one or more Josephson junctions, made the basis of a very sensitive magnetometer by utilizing the fact that a change in the magnetic flux linkage of the ring by one flux quantum produces a sharp change in the ring’s impedance. Fourthly, there a verb, to squid, which would add s in the third person singular. > [@](#): > > squid, v. > > 1. intr. To fish with squid-bait. U.S. > > 2. Of a parachute: to achieve a stable configuration when only partially extended. In other words, use squids in full confidence and let them go argue with OED if they object. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/18 "2007-12-26T15:32:26Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] Webster’s unabridged, 1913: [http://machaut.uchicago.edu/?resource=Webster’s&word=squid&use1913=on&use1828=on](http://machaut.uchicago.edu/?resource=Webster%27s&word=squid&use1913=on&use1828=on) [/QUOTE] I suggest we take up a collection to get **Squink** a new dictionary. 1913? Talk about your saving ways! Tris ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/19 "2007-12-26T19:43:16Z")
If I wrote a book about being attacked by a number of squid, I think I would go with a name such as “Attack of the Squids”, which is more specific than “Attack of the Squid”… …'cause, you know if you read the second title you would picture one squid attacking a boat or something, whereas the first title clearly indicates this book is about more than one squid. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2007, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/all-the-squid-in-the-sea/431240/20 "2007-12-26T20:53:59Z")
[QUOTE=Triskadecamus] I suggest we take up a collection to get **Squink** a new dictionary. 1913? [/QUOTE] No thanks. Fighting the Kaiser changed our native tongue forever, to say _nothing_ of Hitler. The only way to avoid those corrupting influences is to harken back to a time _before_ they appeared. You wouldn’t want to **not** call them squids just because Wilhelm II _did_, would you? 😉