# Alligator drags away 2-year-old boy in Florida **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 15, 2016, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403 "2016-06-15T06:15:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/201 "2016-06-17T17:22:27Z")
I don’t get the idea that people need to be completely fenced off from the beach. Here in California, we have great whites in the ocean. And yet people are allowed to go to the beach all the time! And there are movie screenings right by the water! And that lake may be manmade, but just from looking at it you can see that: 1. it’s HUGE 2. it’s connected to other bodies of water 3. it’s got shores on the other side that are clearly out of the park, and from how overgrown they are could clearly be home to anything, even alligators. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/202 "2016-06-17T17:45:32Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > I don’t think I’ve seen it addressed plainly, the crocodilians in the Jungle Cruise are animatronic, right? :eek: Yes, everything in the Jungle Cruise is fake. Now Animal Kingdom - all those animals are real. Including the crocodiles. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/203 "2016-06-17T18:01:14Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Crocs tend to be way more aggressive than gators. It isn’t unknown that a gator will lunge like that six feet up the beach, but it isn’t likely that it would have, nor is it likely that without the splashing, the attention would have been drawn. Which crocs? That’s true of Nile and Saltwater Crocs, but American Crocodiles (the ones in Florida and Panama) are not particularly aggressive. They are mostly fish eaters. Alligators frequently attack dogs on land. Here’s a few cases: > **[Gator snatches Yorkie in Port Charlotte](https://www.fox4now.com/news/gator-snatches-yorkie-whole-next-to-port-charlotte-lake)** > > PORT CHARLOTTE, Fla. - A woman living at Lakes of Tuscana in Port Charlotte witnessed an alligator come out of the water and snatch her friends two-year-old Yorkie before swimming off. [http://www.abc-7.com/story/13375793/2010/10/23/copy-alligator-attacks-kills-sarasota-familys-dog](http://www.abc-7.com/story/13375793/2010/10/23/copy-alligator-attacks-kills-sarasota-familys-dog) This one apparently came into someone’s yard: [http://www.nbc-2.com/story/24911038/gator-attacks-two-dogs-in-cape-coral#.V2Q5ULsrLAU](http://www.nbc-2.com/story/24911038/gator-attacks-two-dogs-in-cape-coral#.V2Q5ULsrLAU) Here an elderly man was killed when an alligator attacked the dog he was walking: > **[Florida Man Walking His Dog Dies After Alligator Attack](https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2001-sep-13-mn-45335-story.html)** > > An 11-foot alligator killed an elderly man walking his dog by a canal, biting off part of his leg in the third deadly alligator incident in Florida this year. Alligators can and will come on to land to attack prey, regardless of whether it was splashing in the water. If there are alligators about, it’s best to avoid the water’s edge. The toddler would have been at risk even if he hadn’t been splashing around. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/204 "2016-06-17T18:13:20Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I don’t get the idea that people need to be completely fenced off from the beach. I wasn’t suggesting fencing people off of the beach - instead, just fencing them out of the water. The sort of thing you often see around fountains. Just seems like a reasonable precaution if you wish to attract people with kids to the location but keep them out of the water, and if you know there can be gators in the water but want to keep them off the beach. Sure a person _could_ climb over it, but it would discourage accidents. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/205 "2016-06-17T19:15:57Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I don’t get the idea that people need to be completely fenced off from the beach. Here in California, we have great whites in the ocean. And yet people are allowed to go to the beach all the time! And there are movie screenings right by the water! > > And that lake may be manmade, but just from looking at it you can see that: > > 1. it’s HUGE > 2. it’s connected to other bodies of water > 3. it’s got shores on the other side that are clearly out of the park, and from how overgrown they are could clearly be home to anything, even alligators. There are regular reports of tourists in the Monterey Bay Area ignoring “Dangerous Waves” warnings and getting swept out by a single rogue wave, their backs to the ocean, posing out on the rocks for pictures. In this case I am simply horrified and heartbroken for the family. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/206 "2016-06-17T20:31:57Z")
The actual situation is rather bizarrely bipolar. Alligators are present in virtually every fresh water situation throughout Florida. They live in springs, lakes, rivers, cattle ponds, catchment basins, canals, and water hazards at the golf course. In most of those places the alligators remain discretely out of sight, at least during the day. Water is their shelter and their camouflage, and they remain hidden because they perceive humans to be a threat. But come back at night with a powerful flashlight, and see how many pairs of bright red eyes you will find! So they are present almost everywhere, in numbers, but only occasionally noticeable. Nile crocodiles evolved in a place where little food may be available for months and months, but then suddenly and for a brief time huge furry meat-things come along and literally jump into their mouths. So these crocs are used to seeing animals on the riverbank as potential food, and even today eat some considerable number of humans per annum. Alligators have no wildebeest migration to influence their feeding behavior. Mostly they eat small, slow moving things like garfish, catfish, turtles, and snails. They even use their broad shovel-like snout to scoop up and ingest mud from the bottom, digesting the insects, worms, crawdads, and other goodies in the mud. They _rarely_ give chase even to the birds and raccoons that are frequently observed literally climbing over and around them, apparently having drawn the evolutionary conclusion that the calories expended in unsuccessful pursuits are greater than the calories gained by rare successful captures. _Rarely_, I said – not _never_. This poor child, and the other human fatalities recorded, represent those rare instances. While most remain hidden, numbers of alligators are commonly viewed daytimes at many of the springs and clear lakes in central Florida. Here and in a few other places they become inured to the presence of people and will commonly lie basking “on the far bank” while crowds of men, women, and children swim and splash nearby. I’ve never heard of a human fatality in a Florida spring, where crowds of people are exposed to numbers of visible alligators. So how should one properly assess the risk due to alligators in this instance? Did Disney deliberately downplay the danger, to maintain the “Magic” of the Kingdom? Did they assess the danger and decide it was slight, taking instruction from the numerous public springs in the general vicinity? Perhaps the No Swimming injunction was indeed offered more because of brain eating amoeba, or deep water without lifeguards, or boat traffic, or other totally unrelated matters, and they gave no thought to alligator danger at all, being as much inside the “Disney Bubble” as their patrons. Should Disney have had signs and a fence? Do our springs need squads of alligator hunters? Should Floridians all move to Utah? I live in Florida, I work here – and I work professionally with alligators (among other creatures). I’ve been called to do interviews numerous times in the past several days, and I’m always asked for a simple, straightforward “take-away lesson” the public and officialdom can use to protect residents and visitors from harm caused by alligators. And I ruefully reply that there just isn’t a simple answer. ---
**Author:** ![dzeiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@dzeiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzeiger)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/207 "2016-06-17T21:06:29Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > I don’t think I’ve seen it addressed plainly, the crocodilians in the Jungle Cruise are animatronic, right? :eek: The large ones, yes. But some of the discussions on other forums have mentioned that gators have been spotted and removed on several occasions from the water area around Tom Sawyer’s Island. I presume that most “ride” water is chemically treated in some way, though I’m unsure how much of a deterrent that might be. Something to think about if you’re on the Small World ride and thinking about letting your hand dip into the water… ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/208 "2016-06-17T22:16:47Z")
> [@dzeiger](#): > > The large ones, yes. But some of the discussions on other forums have mentioned that gators have been spotted and removed on several occasions from the water area around Tom Sawyer’s Island. > > I presume that most “ride” water is chemically treated in some way, though I’m unsure how much of a deterrent that might be. Something to think about if you’re on the Small World ride and thinking about letting your hand dip into the water… Small World isn’t connected to the canals - its an isolated boat ride. Jungle Cruise and the Rivers of the Americas (or whatever the hell they call it) which is home to Tom Sawyer Island are. I’ve seen gators on the Rivers of America. My favorite gators in Orlando are the ones that hang out in the water between runways at the Orlando airport. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/209 "2016-06-17T22:34:35Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > I live in Florida, I work here – and I work professionally with alligators (among other creatures). I’ve been called to do interviews numerous times in the past several days, and I’m always asked for a simple, straightforward “take-away lesson” the public and officialdom can use to protect residents and visitors from harm caused by alligators. And I ruefully reply that there just isn’t a simple answer. I agree with you completely. Alligators are an outstanding success story of a once endangered species that bounced back really well once conservation measures when enacted. The fact that there is so many of them today is more of a blessing than a curse. Some people may disagree with that due to this one tragic death but let’s look at the numbers to see what animals kill the most people in the U.S. The answers aren’t what most people assume and alligators barely made the list at all. Average Number of Deaths per Year in the U.S Bee/Wasp 53 Dogs 31 Spider 6.5 Rattlesnake 5.5 Mountain lion 1 Shark 1 Alligator 0.3 Bear 0.5 Scorpion 0.5 Centipede 0.5 Elephant 0.25 Wolf 0.1 Horse 20 Bull 3 > **[Human deaths in the U.S. caused by Animals](https://historylist.wordpress.com/2008/05/29/human-deaths-in-the-us-caused-by-animals/)** > > If you try to pet a grizzly bear, of pick up a rattle snake, you are not only likely to be attacked, but you are very stupid. Animals are defensive of their homes, and are much more likely to attac… However, there is one animal not on the list above that blows away all the rest when it comes to human deaths in the U.S. It is deer. They cause about 130 human deaths per year mainly through collisions with vehicles and well over $1 billion in vehicle damage. That isn’t all though because they are multi-strategy menaces. They also vectors for Lyme disease which can also debilitate people for life or just plain kill them. They also offer the potential for massive losses through crop destruction as well. In other words, if you want to actually save lives, leave the alligators alone and focus on Bambi’s father and then Bambi himself when he gets big enough. Thank a deer hunter this Fall. They are the ones combating the true enemy. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/210 "2016-06-19T01:02:37Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > As I said, I lived in Florida for five years so I know how invasive alligators can be in residential areas. But when I am staying at a prestigious resort, that has put beach chairs and cabanas near the water to make it look like an ocean, I admit that I wouldn’t have thought of alligators. If I am renting a cabin on Lake Okeechobee, then I believe that it IS up to the renters to know the area and look out for wildlife. As another poster said, at a resort hotel, I am not on guard for wildlife. I mean, if there is a python in my room, should the response be: “Hey, you knew it was Florida. There are pythons there, dumbass!”? In the Houston, Texas, area, they have warning signs in parks and recreation areas and even golf courses and decorative ponds on, say, the University of Houston Clear Lake campus, warning of alligators and snakes (and bobcats and coyotes in some areas). Some of those are more likely for people to preconceive as dangerous, some less so. None of those are a friggin’ Disney resort creating a “Magical” child-catering environment with man-made beach at a resort hotel, or anywhere near that level of disconnect from the natural world. I grew up in Arkansas. Once in Junior High my family went on a trip to Florida for a vacation. It was very eye-opening to see the fairly large alligators lined up on the banks along the drainage ditches along the highway out to the Kennedy Space Center. We were alerted to the possibility of gators in any natural water area. There was an indoor pool where we were staying. (I’ve seen reports of gators getting into indoor pools. :eek: ) You can’t keep them out of the lagoon even if it were isolated from any natural waterways, without some very large concrete barricades encircling the lagoon. We found a ~6 ft gator on JSC property by one of the buildings. This was a good 100 yards from the nearest ditch, let alone waterway of any significant size. It was sitting in a parking lot next to a building. > [@levdrakon](#): > > According to this [CNN report](http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/16/us/alligator-attacks-child-disney-florida/), Disney does employ full time staff to patrol and kill any alligators that “pose a threat.” I’m not sure what that means but it sounds like they don’t automatically kill them on sight. It’s perfectly normal for there to be alligators in that lake. Gators under [4 feet in length](Smaller gators, four feet or less in length, pose little threat to people; but they can deliver a nasty bite that should immediately be seen by a physician.) are not hazardous to humans, except through people deliberately handling them. They won’t attack humans because they prey on animals [smaller than themselves](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_alligator#Hunting_and_diet). However, gators larger than 4 ft that get into human areas are considered nuisance gators and can be trapped and killed. Larger gators will prey on raccoons, muskrats, and [coypu (nutria)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coypu). A toddler is in this size range, especially if sitting in “ankle deep” water (3 to 4 inches). A 6 ft gator is certainly large enough to see a toddler as dinner whereas it wouldn’t be likely to attack an adult or even older child. > [@Dangerosa](#): > > Small World isn’t connected to the canals - its an isolated boat ride. Was watching video on the news showing a Disney employee trying to scare off a small gator that was trying to get up on land next to the log ride flume. The log ride is in the blue treated “toilet bowl” water, but there was a low barrier separating it from a natural spot of water. This was feet from the riders in the log ride, who were likely unable to see the gator behind the wall, but the employee was smacking at it with a long pool skimmer handle. So how isolated is isolated? ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/211 "2016-06-19T01:17:55Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > I even knew people that had them as pets and they can learn simple commands like coming when called and healing. [nitpick]He_e_ling. Following someone is “heeling”, i.e. walking at one’s heels.[/nitpick] ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/212 "2016-06-19T03:45:20Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > [nitpick]He_e_ling. Following someone is “heeling”, i.e. walking at one’s heels.[/nitpick] Good catch. You are right. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/213 "2016-06-19T03:47:08Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > [nitpick]He_e_ling. Following someone is “heeling”, i.e. walking at one’s heels.[/nitpick] > [@Shagnasty](#): > > Good catch. You are right. Healing might apply if the gator has been nipping at your heels. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/214 "2016-06-19T03:52:48Z")
On the other hand, it _would_ be awesome if you could teach an alligator to heal. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/215 "2016-06-19T04:40:20Z")
You don’t have to teach them, they heal extremely well on their own, even after grievous injuries. And they’re rarely victims of infection. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/216 "2016-06-19T06:15:06Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > You don’t have to teach them, they heal extremely well on their own, even after grievous injuries. And they’re rarely victims of infection. 😃 Any wonder. If they’re anything like crocs in their dietary choices, their entire BODIES are filled with bacteria from the pre-rotted carcasses they devour. Would make a staph or other infectious agent look positively tame in comparison. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/217 "2016-06-19T23:18:03Z")
Disney is now apparently [putting up fences](http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/disney-world-resort-fences-alligator-panic-article-1.2678075) at their lakefront beaches. ---
**Author:** ![sinjin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@sinjin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinjin)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/218 "2016-06-20T00:38:13Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I don’t think anyone, Disney included, thought that an alligator attack was something that was likely to happen. I know alligators are roaming about Walt Disney World, and I would not have thought there was a danger at being at the water’s edge. My husband said, there’s no way he’d touch that water, but it has nothing to do with alligators. That lagoon is filthy. I don’t blame the parents at all for letting their kid near the water, but getting in the water was unwise (for non-alligator reasons). > > Similarly, I don’t really blame Disney either. Alligator attacks on humans are very rare. _Prior to this event_, there wasn’t any reason to think the beach was a problem. All the blaming is relying on hindsight. This. I feel really bad for the parents and sibs, but this event is on order of a lightening strike. I think it just feels more horrible because it happened at Disney World where you go to feel the magic. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/219 "2016-06-20T18:52:21Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > I saw one Tweet from some blonde white bitch showing a photo of the parents saying “This is what criminals look like.” What a bitch. I hope you told this blonde white bitch what a bitch she is. Stupid blonde white bitch being a bitch. Gawd blonde white bitches are the worst bitches. Ugh, this blonde white bitch was such a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2016, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403/220 "2016-06-21T20:25:22Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > …And that lake may be manmade, but just from looking at it you can see that: > > 1. it’s HUGE > 2. it’s connected to other bodies of water > 3. it’s got shores on the other side that are clearly out of the park, and from how overgrown they are could clearly be home to anything, even alligators. With regard to your third point, note that both the man-made Seven Seas Lagoon as well as the natural Bay Lake that it connects to (via a water bridge) are well within the property boundaries of Walt Disney World (WDW). People tend not to realize how big WDW is. The property currently covers 27,258 acres (43 square miles), which for comparison is about twice as large as the island of Manhattan, or about the same size as the City of San Francisco. (The entire Disneyland resort in California only covers 510 acres.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alligator-drags-away-2-year-old-boy-in-florida/757403.md?page=12)