# Alternative facts **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 23, 2017, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937 "2017-01-23T16:15:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/101 "2017-01-24T18:33:59Z")
I’m wondering if Trump can actually go a day without lying? “I have recieved awards on the environment” is pretty clearly a lie by any reasonable interpretation of that statement. If a log were actually kept, day by day, would there ever be a day when Trump didn’t lie? Let’s just restrict it to business days or days he’s on vacation. I’d be awfully surprised if he could have many lie-free days, and I’d be shocked if he had two or more in a row. I don’t remember anything he said yesterday, though, so I don’t know if he lied or not. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/102 "2017-01-24T18:57:35Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I’m wondering if Trump can actually go a day without lying? “I have recieved awards on the environment” is pretty clearly a lie by any reasonable interpretation of that statement. > > If a log were actually kept, day by day, would there ever be a day when Trump didn’t lie? Let’s just restrict it to business days or days he’s on vacation. I’d be awfully surprised if he could have many lie-free days, and I’d be shocked if he had two or more in a row. > > I don’t remember anything he said yesterday, though, so I don’t know if he lied or not. Maybe he’ll follow through on his promise to take weekends off. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/103 "2017-01-24T18:59:46Z")
I recall reading somewhere that lawyers working with Trump on business deals would always make sure there were at least two other people present who could vouch for what was actually said. Sad. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/104 "2017-01-24T19:00:14Z")
War is peace. Hate is love. Up is down. Down is up. We have always been friends with Russia. Donald Trump will be a great President. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/105 "2017-01-24T19:24:41Z")
Dumb Donald was so dumb [that the photo of the inauguration hung in the White House bears the wrong date.](http://www.politicususa.com/2017/01/24/trump-finally-photo-inauguration-likes-dated-21st.html) Not only does he live in an alternate reality, he also lives in an alternate time zone. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/106 "2017-01-24T19:34:01Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Dumb Donald was so dumb [that the photo of the inauguration hung in the White House bears the wrong date.](http://www.politicususa.com/2017/01/24/trump-finally-photo-inauguration-likes-dated-21st.html) Not only does he live in an alternate reality, he also lives in an alternate time zone. I am so so hoping, probably unrealistically, that the photographer, [Abbas Shirmohammadi of Panoramic Visions Photography](http://www.panoramicvisions.com/about_us.htm), deliberately got the date wrong to make Trump look stupid(er) for bragging about his huge crowds in a picture mis-dated to the day when the crowds were far **more** huge. If it were deliberate, this could launch a marvelous trend of independent contractors subtly trolling Trump with carefully placed minor mistakes that he doesn’t notice when he flaunts his trophies but that embarrass him when the public spots them. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/107 "2017-01-24T20:05:54Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I’m wondering if Trump can actually go a day without lying? “I have recieved awards on the environment” is pretty clearly a lie by any reasonable interpretation of that statement. > > If a log were actually kept, day by day, would there ever be a day when Trump didn’t lie? Let’s just restrict it to business days or days he’s on vacation. I’d be awfully surprised if he could have many lie-free days, and I’d be shocked if he had two or more in a row. > > I don’t remember anything he said yesterday, though, so I don’t know if he lied or not. Picture a remake of the Jim Carey movie _Liar Liar_, only substitute Carey’s lying lawyer for the mendacious Trump, as played by Alec Baldwin. It’s comedy gold. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/108 "2017-01-24T21:38:34Z")
Except to be consistent with Liar Liar, he has to compulsively _tell the truth_. INT. THE WHITE HOUSE BRIEFING ROOM - The press is packed into the room awaiting the President to address them. SEAN SPICER is at the podium, sweat beading from his brow. He appears to have had a rough go. He glances off at the side. A SECRET SERVICE AGENT nods. SEAN SPICER Okay… Ladies and Gentleman, the President of the United States. Shuffling, coughing as the press stands. DONALD TRUMP walks from the wings and takes Spicer’s place at the podium. DONALD TRUMP Thank you, thank you, it’s bad to be here, I hate the press so much. TRUMP looks shocked and alarmed; he clearly did not mean to say that. His mouth opens, shuts. The press also look shocked, but no one says anything. DONALD TRUMP Any… any questions? JOURNALIST #1 Mister President, there remain a lot of questions about your tax returns not being released. Can you say whether or not this will happen, and if so, when? DONALD TRUMP It will never happen if I can help it. (He again appears surprised.) JOURNALIST #1 Oh, why is that, sir? DONALD TRUMP I have negative net income. I haven’t made any legitimate money in twelve years. (He is now visibly panicked.) JOURNALIST #1 Um… thank you. JOURNALIST #2 Mister President, if you’ve been broke all these years, how do you afford all your houses and such? DONALD TRUMP I’ve been taking loans from the Russian mafia. JOURNALIST #2 Oh. Uh. How are you paying that back? DONALD TRUMP It’s really very simple, Jim, I have an excellent plan, the best plan. Just an hour ago I sent Vladimir Putin the plans for our new missile submarine. Next question. There is a maddened wave of hands and shouting. Trump points randomly. JOURNALIST #3 Just, uh, just to clarify, you just sent plans for - I’m assuming it’s the Columbia class ballistic missile submarine, sir, because you said new - you sent those plans to Russia? DONALD TRUMP Now, Julia, I did not say that, I never said that. That’s not what I said at all. I specifically said I sent them to _Vladimir Putin_. He’s in Russia, I assume, but I was more specific than just saying Russia. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/109 "2017-01-24T21:44:16Z")
> [@OldOlds](#): > > I recall reading somewhere that lawyers working with Trump on business deals would always make sure there were at least two other people present who could vouch for what was actually said. > > Sad. I believe that was \*his own \*lawyers who said that. I don’t have any evidence or cites, but I believe it is so, therefore it actually happened that way. ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/110 "2017-01-24T22:01:39Z")
Heh. Brilliant, **RickJay**! ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/111 "2017-01-24T22:04:17Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Except to be consistent with Liar Liar, he has to compulsively _tell the truth_. > > INT. THE WHITE HOUSE BRIEFING ROOM - The press is packed into the room awaiting the President to address them. SEAN SPICER is at the podium, sweat beading from his brow. He appears to have had a rough go. He glances off at the side. A SECRET SERVICE AGENT nods. > > SEAN SPICER > Okay… Ladies and Gentleman, the President of the United States. > > Shuffling, coughing as the press stands. DONALD TRUMP walks from the wings and takes Spicer’s place at the podium. > > DONALD TRUMP > Thank you, thank you, it’s bad to be here, I hate the press so much. > > TRUMP looks shocked and alarmed; he clearly did not mean to say that. His mouth opens, shuts. The press also look shocked, but no one says anything. > > DONALD TRUMP > Any… any questions? > > JOURNALIST #1 > Mister President, there remain a lot of questions about your tax returns not being released. Can you say whether or not this will happen, and if so, when? > > DONALD TRUMP > It will never happen if I can help it. > (He again appears surprised.) > > JOURNALIST #1 > Oh, why is that, sir? > > DONALD TRUMP > I have negative net income. I haven’t made any legitimate money in twelve years. > (He is now visibly panicked.) > > JOURNALIST #1 > Um… thank you. > > JOURNALIST #2 > Mister President, if you’ve been broke all these years, how do you afford all your houses and such? > > DONALD TRUMP > I’ve been taking loans from the Russian mafia. > > JOURNALIST #2 > Oh. Uh. How are you paying that back? > > DONALD TRUMP > It’s really very simple, Jim, I have an excellent plan, the best plan. Just an hour ago I sent Vladimir Putin the plans for our new missile submarine. Next question. > > There is a maddened wave of hands and shouting. Trump points randomly. > > JOURNALIST #3 > Just, uh, just to clarify, you just sent plans for - I’m assuming it’s the Columbia class ballistic missile submarine, sir, because you said new - you sent those plans to Russia? > > DONALD TRUMP > Now, Julia, I did not say that, I never said that. That’s not what I said at all. I specifically said I sent them to _Vladimir Putin_. He’s in Russia, I assume, but I was more specific than just saying Russia. Don’t give him any ideas. This’ll just clinch the election in 2020. ---
**Author:** ![KatTP](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@KatTP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KatTP)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/112 "2017-01-24T22:18:25Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > War is peace. > Hate is love. > Up is down. > Down is up. > We have always been friends with Russia. > Donald Trump will be a great President. We have always been friends with Russia. That made me laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2017, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/113 "2017-01-24T23:25:00Z")
Even Orwellian dystopia wasn’t [this blatant](https://www.yahoo.com/news/white-house-press-secretary-sean-212337677.html): > [@](#): > > White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer: ‘Our Intention Is Never to Lie’ But ‘Sometimes We Can Disagree with the Facts’ Yet again I find myself asking how can anyone support this administration? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/114 "2017-01-25T00:45:09Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I believe that was \*his own \*lawyers who said that. I don’t have any evidence or cites, but I believe it is so, therefore it actually happened that way. _I_ have evidence and cites. 🆒 [Quoted from a deposition by a lawyer working on Trump bankruptcy cases in early 1990s] ([Trump's lawyers testified they met with him in pairs to ensure he wouldn't lie about their meetings](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/10/6/1578559/-Trump-s-lawyers-testified-they-met-with-him-in-pairs-to-ensure-he-wouldn-t-lie-about-their-meetings)): > [@](#): > > Q: Did Mr. Miller always do everything together with you when he was active in this case? > > A: Not everything, but we—it’s always been our practice to make sure two people are present, and we don’t have a problem of people lying. > > Q: You are meeting with your client? > > A: That’s right. Our client. Hey, Trump is a leader in the field of expert—he’s an expert at interpreting things. Let’s put it that way. > > Q: That’s interestingly put. As I recall in your letter to Mr. Descantis, which we marked yesterday, you indicated the policy of your office was to have two attorneys present for meeting with public officials? > > A: Correct. > > Q: Here you are meeting with your client? > > A: That’s right. > > Q: Was it necessary for both you and Mr. Miller to always attend the meeting — > > A: We always do that. > > Q: Always? > > A: We tried to do it with Donald always if we could because Donald says certain things and then has a lack of memory. “Alternative facts”. “Disagree with the facts”. “Says certain things and then has a lack of memory”. This administration has brought us a whole bunch of interesting new euphemisms for lying. And it’s only, Og help us, Day 5. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/115 "2017-01-25T00:52:56Z")
> [@MindsEye\_Watering](#): > > Heh. Brilliant, **RickJay**! Bravo! More, more! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/116 "2017-01-25T01:29:39Z")
I can’t get enough of laughing at and mocking this man. I am well aware that this is just a form of mental masturbation, but hey, I spent my teens (and then some) doing the physical kind, and I never once regretted that. He’s such a fucking moron. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/117 "2017-01-25T02:40:10Z")
My dad told me that the best lie is the one that resembles the truth as closely as possible. These people are just starting out. Give them time, I’m sure they’ll be credibly spinning whoppers is six months, eight tops. ---
**Author:** ![Emily\_Litella](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/emily_litella/32/3370_2.png) [@Emily\_Litella](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emily_Litella)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/118 "2017-01-25T02:44:10Z")
I saw a Frontline documentary a few weeks ago called “President Trump”. This is a quote from a review of it from Daily Kos that sheds light on Trump’s lying. "Roy Cohn also told Trump that no matter whether it was a loss in business or a loss in court to always declare himself (over and over again) the winner; and repeat this many times publicly and people will eventually come to believe that lie. (Sound familiar?) He also told him to never admit an error or a mistake. (Also sound familiar?) In this vein, Trump coined a term “truthful hyperbole,” which meant that so long as there was at least a smidgeon of truth in what he said in any statement he might make, he could lie about anything else contained in that statement - and doing that has clearly become an indispensable and integral part of his lifelong modus operandi. Of course, there is no such thing as “truthful hyperbole.” Link to reiew: [http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/7/1617979/-PBS-S-FRONTLINE-DOCUMENTS-THE-REAL-DONALD-J-TRUMP](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/7/1617979/-PBS-S-FRONTLINE-DOCUMENTS-THE-REAL-DONALD-J-TRUMP) Link to the Frontline documentary: [http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/president-trump/](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/president-trump/) If you have a chance to watch it, please do, it gives a lot of insight into Trump and his way of thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/119 "2017-01-25T02:58:22Z")
> [@E-DUB](#): > > My dad told me that the best lie is the one that resembles the truth as closely as possible. These people are just starting out. Give them time, I’m sure they’ll be credibly spinning whoppers is six months, eight tops. [They don’t even have to try to make it close to the truth](https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-congress-grapples-alternative-facts-trump-185525141--politics.html). ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2017, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937/120 "2017-01-25T02:58:46Z")
> [@KatTP](#): > > We have always been friends with Russia. > > That made me laugh. We have. It’s the USSR we’ve had trouble with. Man I write doublespeak for Trump. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/alternative-facts/777937.md?page=7)