# Am I mean? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 8, 2014, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208 "2014-03-08T17:48:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2014, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/21 "2014-03-09T01:42:45Z")
When I’m responding in such a situation, I try to ask myself first if my response is necessary. If so, then is it true? If it’s necessary and true, can I make it kind, or at least not cruel? If it meets those 3 checks, I go for it. Of course, that’s in my ideal situation. I’ve responded in anger before. And of course, sometimes one needs to be cruel to be kind. But that’s a tricky area. ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2014, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/22 "2014-03-09T02:52:23Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’d apologize not for what you said, but how you said it. Something like “I’m sorry I got so upset and blew up like that, but I’ve been getting really frustrated with you guys telling me how I should raise my kids. I never tell you how to raise yours. I know you’re just trying to help, but I’m obviously doing something right since my kids are coming out fine. If I find I need advice, I’ll be sure to ask.” I agree with a lot of what’s in BitT’s post here, but I disagree with his recommendation here. Never include “but” in an apology. Either apologize, sincerely, or don’t apologize at all. Don’t use an apology as a springboard for another point. You goofed: you shouldn’t have said what you said, regardless of how true it is. If someone is ugly, it doesn’t help to point out that they’re ugly, even if it’s in the context of them giving you beauty advice. Just apologize for what you said and eat some humblepie. It’ll do you some good, and just maybe it’ll help your relationship with your relatives. However, later, if you get criticism about how you raise your son, be very clear and firm and point out that their criticism is not appreciated, and they should stop it unless they want it reciprocated. You may have to repeat this message a few times; habits are hard to break. If anyone calls you mean for that, well, I’d consider that their problem and they’ll just have to deal with it. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2014, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/23 "2014-03-09T03:09:28Z")
I’m with **Learjeff** here. Make a simple apology, “I’m sorry for what I said. I was very angry,” and just leave it at that. It will stop you stewing over it regardless of whether it heals the wounds or not. You can’t control that. And if you want to evaluate your parenting skills: [How To Raise Happy Kids – 10 Steps Backed By Science](http://www.bakadesuyo.com/2014/02/happy-kids/) ---
**Author:** ![babygoat666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2acd7d/32.png) [@babygoat666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/babygoat666)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2014, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/24 "2014-03-09T03:51:54Z")
> [@HoneyBadgerDC](#): > > I don’t know if you are mean or not but you are my Hero!! I went through the same stuff, my son is the only one to finish college and is working on his doctorate, more importantly he is a responsible adult who is genuinely a good person aside from being a liberal. I have never thrown that in their faces but certainly wanted to on many occasions, I wish I was mean like you. 1. Most educated people are liberals. 2. You’re not as nice as you think you are. Shame on you. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2014, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/25 "2014-03-09T22:47:34Z")
Yes, you’re mean. Saying things to deliberately upset people is mean. Saying those sort of things in retaliation for someone else’s meanness doesn’t make your own responses non-mean. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/26 "2014-03-10T00:16:45Z")
If you do decide to be the bigger person and apologize, you could certainly ask whenever given unsolicited advice, “Is that what you did?” Who knows? You might get a response like, “No, and I wish I had.” ---
**Author:** ![Sterling\_Archer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Sterling\_Archer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterling_Archer)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/27 "2014-03-10T01:06:50Z")
Sometimes the ends justify the mean. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/28 "2014-03-10T06:14:50Z")
So be honest, as one mean person to another – did you really want to know if you were being mean or is this a “I told some annoying people to fuck off” post? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/29 "2014-03-10T06:24:07Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Again, I understand completely what you did, but I also understand why they think they deserve an apology. You ultimately did to them what they did to you, but only worse. If it’s wrong for them to do it to you, it is wrong for you to do it to them. I clipped your post and went right to the heart of the matter just to point out that the whole reason they needed to be insulted and yelled at was so that they would realize it was wrong and not a good thing to do. Until they were on the receiving end of it, I doubt they would have ever understood **Sahirrnee** ’s viewpoint from a calm, reasonable verbal explanation. Mind you, I’m not saying I disagree with what you wrote, I’m just pointing out that little detail because I do think it impacts the dynamic at play here. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/30 "2014-03-10T06:29:37Z")
You **were** mean. But it’s okay. They pushed you to your limit with their backseat parenting and you pretty much laser targeted their shortcomings and buttons to shut them up. There were probably more diplomatic approaches you could have taken. And yes, targeting those weaknesses is kind of mean, but I don’t think that kind of burn, mean or not, necessarily makes you a bad person, or at fault. Not to get all schoolyard or anything, but they started it. It’s still violence if a bully hits you and you hit back. It’s just that you kind of had a justification. Edit: To be clear, there are limits to this sort of thinking. If they kill your firstborn I’m not going to excuse you for reciprocating, but I’m not exactly going to condemn you for it in this case when it was that petty and obnoxious and you merely responded in kind. Even with words it’s offlimits sometimes, if they were bugging you to have a child and you went “well, gee, Cathy, I’ve been trying and it hasn’t happened yet. By the way, have another miscarriage yet?” that would be over the line. In this specific case, though? Eh… ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/31 "2014-03-10T12:53:25Z")
The people in question are bullies. They’ve been chucking rocks at you for years. When you finally chucked one back, they went running for Mommy. Now you’re in trouble because you made them cry. How you proceed is your business but I would suggest you avoid buying into any part of their story, including publicly apologizing or even wondering if you’re “mean”. Personally, I would respond to inquires with a simple, “If they don’t want to exchange parenting tips any more, that’s fine with me, too.” ---
**Author:** ![Sahirrnee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sahirrnee/32/13937_2.png) [@Sahirrnee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sahirrnee)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/32 "2014-03-10T16:21:28Z")
Thank y’all for all the replies. I have given this much thought and well, I’m still working through it. I’m looking at the family dynamics, it’s brought back some not so nice memories. I’m started to reply so many times but all I’d do is end up venting and that is not the point. There is way more to it then them just giving me parenting advice. One example is telling me I need psychiatric help because I never remarried after my divorce and they think unmarried people are defective in some way. Another is referring to my (now ex) bf as a nigger who beats me and if I don’t admit that he beats me (he never laid a hand on me in anger) either I am lying or in denial. According to them, if only I would lose weight, change my hair, wear different clothes I could get me a real (white) man and I wouldn’t be such a loser. I think what I said to them is mild compared to the disrespectful things they have said to me. The only difference is I spoke the truth and the truth hurts. I’m not sure why they think I need to live up to their expectations or why they think I need to justify my life choices to them. Its their disrespectful attitude that has pissed me off more than the things they say. Quite simply, adults don’t tell other adults how to live and to do so is rude. I feel like I don’t own them anything and that includes an apology. The family members who think I was mean need to get over it. I think they are more worried that some of the things I said were supposed to be a secret and now they are being accused of telling me things I wasn’t supposed to know. I heard about the arrests and jail time from multiple people, why would anybody in this family think that secrets won’t get out? Anyway, their attitude towards me is ‘but you are always the good one who keeps her mouth shut’, ‘you are better than that’, ‘learn to ignore them and don’t stoop to their level’. I’m just not buying it anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Krouget](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b38774/32.png) [@Krouget](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Krouget)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/33 "2014-03-10T16:42:40Z")
If it’s not within your usual character to behave like this, then no, you’re not mean. If this was an impulsive reaction that we’re all given to, then it’s just that. Sometimes when bitten, you bite back. The fact that you are reflecting on it says all that it needs to. I don’t think it needs an apology, either. Most people like that won’t take an apology as intended, and use it as a platform to continue their behavior. They should apologize to you for forcing you to shift out of character, and that should lead to a real discussion between all those involved (in theory, anyway). ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/34 "2014-03-10T18:27:11Z")
> [@JerrySTL](#): > > If you are lucky, you were so mean that they will never speak to you again. Well then, Sahirrnee, it sounds like you need to embrace the wisdom of Post #8. You’ll probably want to get on that before your son is old enough to be affected by them. ---
**Author:** ![CrazyCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CrazyCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrazyCatLady)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/35 "2014-03-10T20:37:48Z")
> [@Sahirrnee](#): > > Anyway, their attitude towards me is ‘but you are always the good one who keeps her mouth shut’, ‘you are better than that’, ‘learn to ignore them and don’t stoop to their level’. > I’m just not buying it anymore. Good for you. “Eat whatever shit sandwich this asshole serves up and pretend it’s tasty so I can have a peaceful life” is far more than anyone has a right to expect from someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/36 "2014-03-10T21:28:26Z")
They opened the can of worms by criticizing you. If they think it’s ok to criticize you then it is ok to criticize them right back. Fuck them. EDIT: Also +1 to what CrazyCatLady said. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2014, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/37 "2014-03-10T22:57:03Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > You **were** mean. But it’s okay. They pushed you to your limit with their backseat parenting and you pretty much laser targeted their shortcomings and buttons to shut them up. There were probably more diplomatic approaches you could have taken. And yes, targeting those weaknesses is kind of mean, but I don’t think that kind of burn, mean or not, necessarily makes you a bad person, or at fault. > > Not to get all schoolyard or anything, but they started it. It’s still violence if a bully hits you and you hit back. It’s just that you kind of had a justification. I agree with this more than any other post, including my own. > [@Sahirrnee](#): > > According to them, if only I would lose weight, change my hair, wear different clothes I could get me a real (white) man and I wouldn’t be such a loser. Well, fuck, that’s not right. What are you doing here? Pit them and let it all out. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2014, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/38 "2014-03-11T00:31:18Z")
Just to play Devil’s advocate a little - and I suspect this probably doesn’t actually apply in **Sahirrnee’s** case but I think it’s still relevant to the thread - there are some things you only really get one, maybe one-and-a-half, shots at. The fact that you got them wrong doesn’t necessarily mean that you don’t know anything about it. Someone who has a kid in prison has probably had a long time to think about where they went wrong and what they could have done better. Don’t you ever wish you could go back in time and tell your younger self how to not fuck something up? Unfortunately, the best we can do is try to tell someone else how to not fuck up their own shot. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2014, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/39 "2014-03-11T01:47:53Z")
But there is a way do to that, **Bozuit**. One starts with, “Little sister, you know I have been in your shoes and I have made my mistakes …” One ends with, “… and I know you will do just fine, but I want to make it a little easier on you.” One speaks with humor and affection. One leaves out race. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2014, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208/40 "2014-03-11T07:06:45Z")
> [@Sahirrnee](#): > > Honestly if these two never speak to me again it wouldn’t bother me in the least. Well there you are, end of story. There are people whose existence pulls you up, and others who drag you down. Relatives or not, you don’t need them in your life. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/am-i-mean/683208.md?page=3)