That, minus the Australia part. It’s pretty damn hard for a person to renounce their heritage completely.
I know this as a big deal in sitcoms, but is this a real issue?
At least in the USA for quite a while now marriage to an American has not been quite the “easy ticket” that the stereotypical romantic comedy makes it out to be. It moves the spouse to a better relative (ha) position in the immigration queue but does NOT take him/her out of it altogether. Cites from an immigration-law firm.
IIUIC, for a US citizen to sponsor the immigration and/or naturalization of a spouse or relative, the US citizen has to be resident in the USA (or at least be applying to bring back the other person upon returning to the USA). Seems the dual status gives him/her no advantage save perhaps for ease of mobility for him/herself while running around doing the paperwork, but that’s just my layman’s perception.
Her choice may be made and she may choose Japan, but Japan can’t force Canada to revoke her Canadian citizenship. So the Japanese officials can tell themselves “She chose Japan and renounced her Canadian citizenship. She is a Japanese citizen only!” Meanwhile, back in Canada the government has paperwork that says she’s still Canadian.
Japan does have by which you can present paperwork from a foreign government that verifies that you have officially relinquished your citizenship. So one COULD get Canadian paperwork that says “Moon’s friend is no longer Canadian” (which I understand is not easy to do because so few do it) but Japan, like the U.S. allows you to just swear an oath to be a Japanese national only. Even if that is 100% your intention, you’re still in the Canadian books as a Canadian.
FTR, I’m an American who was born in Canada. My parents never recorded my birth with the U.S. government, so I was Canadian-only for my entire childhood. In my late teens or early twenties, we got my American passport by presenting all my parents’ citizenship information to the consulate. I now have my U.S. citizenship and I did not have to take an oath or anything, nor did I have to give up my Canadian citizenship.
Off the top of my head, I know three couples who have done this. One of them is involved in a sort of chain, whereby the original person married, got a green card, got citizenship, and is now about to marry another person so that person can get a green card (meanwhile being romantically involved with someone else).
This isn’t quite true. For many categories of family based immigration sponsorship there are annual quotas, with far more applicants then spaces available. Your case gets allocated a priority date (based on when you filed) and you can only expect forward movement on your case when the date is newer than the published date for your category. For example, looking at the February status a Mexican brother of a US Citizen would only expect them to start processing his green card case if he had filed before 01 January 1996. Typically when people talk about immigration queues this is what they are talking about: these quotas exist for certain family and employment based categories.
Marriage to a US citizen, as well as being the parent of a US citizen, is a family category that has no quota, so there is no waiting in such a queue. Of course, this “no waiting” is theoretical, since in practice the administration, background checks, paperwork, etc takes time, and this obviously does depend on how many other cases they are processing, but in theory you are eligible for the green card benefit and can apply for it as soon as you are married. My case took about 4 months. It looks like my current citizenship application is heading for 4-6 months as well. Of course I was already in the US on a work permit so that may have made things easier: the processing may be more complex if you’re doing this abroad through consulates, etc. Thankfully I don’t have any experience with that.
:rolleyes: Not too surprised to see xenophobic attitudes among Americans. Fortunately, not all people are scared of 'da for’ners.
I live in Japan with my Taiwanese wife and my children are dual citizens of Taiwan and America.
This isn’t the 1600s anymore. People move around the world.
And the plural of anecdotes is?
That issue, if it really is an issue, is one of fake marriages and not dual citizenship.
Renouncing allegiance and citizenship isn’t, or shouldn’t be thought of as, the same as renouncing heritage and nationality. The former is a political relationship, subject to change, perhaps more than once. The latter is what you were born into or grew up with.
That sounds exactly appropriate to me, actually. Divest yourself of the old relationship before taking up the new one.
Um. Considering that the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights includes the right to a nation, and that statelessness is an awful deal that precludes (among other things) an inability to travel, have photo ID (no alcohol or cigarettes for you! and forget driving!), I’m not sure this “mandatory statelessness before taking up any new citizenship” scheme has legs. There was a Convention on the Reduction of Statelessness for a reason.
Considering that England canes NZ in soccer and the reverse is true for Rugby (unless that cheating scumbag Wilkinson is playing:D) its not likely to be much of a conflict.
My daughter currently has dual citizenship, I understand from the NZ point of view she’s supposed to choose one at age 16 or so. But I also understand its not enforced or checked upon so it doesn’t really matter. For her second citizenship though I am pretty sure they only allow one - so they would try to “force” her to renounce NZ citizenship.
I think if I were ever to take up citizenship her, I would be required to prove that I have renounced my “other” citizenship.
Please. We’re talking about people who are voluntarily giving up one citizenship in order to obtain another. The transactions might be done the same hour. For that matter, the first might only be activated upon the finalization of the second. The point is that the new state could mandate renunciation of prior citizenships if they wanted to.
Indeed, why should you be? Xenophobic attitudes can be found amongst any nationality if you meet the right (wrong?) people. :rolleyes:
Data! No wait, that’s not the right answer, is it?
As an interesting note, when I got orders for Korea, amongst the impressive stack of paperwork I had to burrow through, there was a form for canceling orders based on being a Korean citizen (typically due to parentage). Since the Republic of Korea has a mandatory service requirement for its citizens, American servicemembers who meet the requirements for Korean citizenship are subject to basically being drafted into the Republic of Korea armed forces to serve their country (no, the OTHER one). This is kind of a curious thing given that the only reason said servicemember would find themselves going to Korea in the first place in this instance would be to defend the country against its neighbor.
I’m guessing the option to simply cancel the assignment on that basis was considered the most diplomatic way to deal with the issue. For those who are curious, I’m not a Korean by any measure, so I simply filed said paperwork in the “Mechanical File”.
That might sound reasonable but how would you do it in practice?
You obviously can’t fly to the old country, renounce and fly back because what passport would you use to get back?
You might be able to do it at an embassy within the new country but not all countries have embassies in every other country.
It sounds like the UK at least won’t allow someone to renounce their citizenship if that would make them stateless. I wouldn’t be surprised if there is some sort of international agreement about that.
Dual citizen ship is an enhancement to personal freedom. It is one freedom that a state cannot grant on its own.
New Zealand allows dual citizenship; according to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade, “There are no restrictions on New Zealand citizens also holding the citizenship of another country(ie. to be dual nationals or citizens)”.
I agree with Martini. That doesn’t sound right. NZ has requirements for citizenship but whether or not you’re a citizen of another country isn’t one of them.
I’m guessing you’ve never been through an immigration process. Or within 10 miles of one for that matter. The transactions might be done in the same hour? What a joke.
While the citizenship application seems to be faster these days then it has in the past, it is still at least a 4 month process in the US. Renunciation of citizenship with the previous country is not likely to be faster, if even an option.
It is inconceivable that any country would implement an immensely costly infrastructure to coordinate with every single other country on the Earth a mechanism to revoke an old citizenship on acquiring a new one.
The result of a state mandating an actual renunciation of an old citizenship is that many people simply won’t be able to become citizens because their old government either by choice or by incompetence has no practical mechanism for renunciation. In addition the renunciation would have to occur after citizenship was granted, otherwise the person would be stateless for a period of time.
It is possible for a country to state that if its own citizen takes on a foreign citizenship it loses theirs. Many countries do this. My own, South Africa, does this unless you specifically notify them you’re taking on new citizenship. However it is impractical for a country to state that you have to specifically renounce your citizenship before becoming their citizen. The best they can do is ask you to declare allegiance only to them, but the old country is in no way obligated to acknowledge that and will most likely still consider you a citizen.
I agree with this. I understand that in a world of varying economic conditions completely open borders is impractical, but I welcome any movement towards a society with more freedom of movement around the world. Dual citizenship is a useful tool for that, and one that does not require states to sacrifice their rights to decide who does and does not get to enter their jurisdiction.
Indeed. In fact, there are so many New Zealanders with dual citizenship out there (like me) that one of the “Nationality” options on the Arrival Card when you fly into New Zealand is “I am a New Zealand Citizen travelling on a foreign passport”.