# Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito are innocent victims of a rush to judgment **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 12, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474 "2009-10-12T01:39:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/281 "2015-09-08T16:10:15Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Any decent person will want nothing to do with any Judicial system if they can help it. Given a choice, I’d pick a judicial system that wasn’t a) prone to bizarre and pseudoscientific verdicts (i.e. blaming vaccines for autism, cellphones for cancer and reaching criminal verdicts against scientists for failing to predict an earthquake), b) tolerates a chief prosecutor who sees Satanists under every bed, and c) appears riddled with corruption. In other words, the Italian one. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/282 "2015-09-08T17:52:29Z")
There is conflicting evidence regarding cellphones and cancer. Its hardly psuedoscientific. [http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/adult-health/expert-answers/cell-phones-and-cancer/faq-20057798](http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-lifestyle/adult-health/expert-answers/cell-phones-and-cancer/faq-20057798) ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/283 "2015-09-08T18:14:07Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Can we be sure that they are factually innocent rather than legally innocent? Considering that there’s really no evidence Amanda Knox had anything to do with any of this, and it honestly looks like the prosecution targeted her because she’s American, I’d say we can be as sure of factual innocense as any real-life case ever gets. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/284 "2015-09-08T18:24:18Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > Considering that there’s really no evidence Amanda Knox had anything to do with any of this, and it honestly looks like the prosecution targeted her because she’s American, I’d say we can be as sure of factual innocense as any real-life case ever gets. Here is an article that says she is free because she is an American…and rich > **[Amanda Knox is free because she's rich and American, says Patrick Lumumba](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/mar/28/amanda-knox-free-rich-american-patrick-lumumba-meredith-kercher-murder)** > > Bar owner falsely implicated in Meredith Kercher murder says decision to quash convictions of Knox and Sollecito was motivated by politics rather than justice ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/285 "2015-09-08T18:33:43Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Here is an article that says she is free because she is an American…and rich > > [Amanda Knox is free because she's rich and American, says Patrick Lumumba | Amanda Knox | The Guardian](http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/mar/28/amanda-knox-free-rich-american-patrick-lumumba-meredith-kercher-murder) No, the article doesn’t say that. It quotes a guy who says that. The guy who says that is not an legal expert, or an expert on the case, or an impartial observer. It’s a guy who spent two weeks in jail after being falsely accused of the murder says it. And he doesn’t even say that she’s the killer, just that he’s of the opinion that she probably knows more than she said in court. He doesn’t know any more than any other person who’s followed the trial on the internet ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/286 "2015-09-08T18:47:47Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Here is an article that says she is free because she is an American…and rich > > [Amanda Knox is free because she's rich and American, says Patrick Lumumba | Amanda Knox | The Guardian](http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/mar/28/amanda-knox-free-rich-american-patrick-lumumba-meredith-kercher-murder) It’s over. The Court says that there is no evidence, no reason to go on, and no case. They are innocent. There will be no more trial. Understand? ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/287 "2015-09-08T18:55:45Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Any decent person will want nothing to do with any Judicial system if they can help it. No torts for you! ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/288 "2015-09-08T21:32:33Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > No, the article doesn’t say that. It quotes a guy who says that. The guy who says that is not an legal expert, or an expert on the case, or an impartial observer. It’s a guy who spent two weeks in jail after being falsely accused of the murder says it. And he doesn’t even say that she’s the killer, just that he’s of the opinion that she probably knows more than she said in court. He doesn’t know any more than any other person who’s followed the trial on the internet > [@Czarcasm](#): > > It’s over. The Court says that there is no evidence, no reason to go on, and no case. They are innocent. There will be no more trial. > > Understand? So you are saying she is legally not guilty. I see nothing to prove her factual innocence. She lied to the police and tried to falsely accuse another person. If this had happened in the USA she would have been a suspect. I really dont understand the larger support for thisw woman. Yes, she was railroaded by a corrupt legal system. I sympathize with that. But where is the evidence that she wasnt involved in this crime? She admits to falsely accusing another person: > [@](#): > > Knox’s claim – which Italian prosecutors alleged was intended to direct suspicion away from herself – was later proved to be false and Knox was given a three-year sentence for it. She has since admitted to struggling with guilt over the false accusation. Until and if this case ever really gets solved she still has to be a suspect. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/289 "2015-09-08T22:24:34Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Yes, she was railroaded by a corrupt legal system. I sympathize with that. No, you don’t. If you did, you would not be pretending that being railroaded by a corrupt legal system is evidence that she’s a murderer. Why do you think we have laws against what those police did, if not to stop fucking idiots browbeating suspects into telling them what they want to hear? ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/290 "2015-09-08T22:38:24Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > So you are saying she is legally not guilty. I see nothing to prove her factual innocence. She lied to the police and tried to falsely accuse another person. If this had happened in the USA she would have been a suspect. I really dont understand the larger support for thisw woman. Yes, she was railroaded by a corrupt legal system. I sympathize with that. But where is the evidence that she wasnt involved in this crime? \ In the US she would be innocent until proven to be guilty. Where is the evidence that YOU weren’t involved in this crime. You know that it is impossible to prove a negative, right? There is no evidence that she was involved in this crime, isn’t that enough? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/291 "2015-09-08T23:05:26Z")
With respect to the computers, I wonder if they were Knox’s, which she brought over from the US, and the prosecutors tried to charge them at 220 instead of 110? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2015, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/292 "2015-09-08T23:15:42Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > There is conflicting evidence regarding cellphones and cancer. Its hardly psuedoscientific. Even if it was true that evidence was “conflicting”, the existence of considerable doubt would mean there was no excuse for an Italian court to issue a ruling that cellphone use causes brain cancer. The fact of the matter is that there’s a strong scientific consensus that such a cancer link is highly unlikely, and there is [considerable](http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/can-you-hear-me-now/?page=2) [research](http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/warning-labels-on-cell-phones/) [evidence](http://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/radiation/cell-phones-fact-sheet) that a link does not exist. The scaremongerers have yet to explain why there has been no increase in brain cancer over the last 20 years or so, during which cellphone use has skyrocketed. But hey, an Italian kangaroo court says there’s a link, so it’s gotta be true. Maybe the Satanists are behind it! ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/293 "2015-09-09T00:32:27Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > No, the article doesn’t say that. It quotes a guy who says that. The guy who says that is not an legal expert, or an expert on the case, or an impartial observer. It’s a guy who spent two weeks in jail after being falsely accused of the murder says it. And he doesn’t even say that she’s the killer, just that he’s of the opinion that she probably knows more than she said in court. He doesn’t know any more than any other person who’s followed the trial on the internet Booyah! ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/294 "2015-09-09T01:01:20Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > No, you don’t. If you did, you would not be pretending that being railroaded by a corrupt legal system is evidence that she’s a murderer. Why do you think we have laws against what those police did, if not to stop fucking idiots browbeating suspects into telling them what they want to hear? Just because she was railroaded doesnt mean that she is factually innocent. Im not saying that she is a murederer but a suspect in the murder. Why did she lie to the police and try to implicate someone else? Im only saying that we should all have an open mind about this case till it is solved. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/295 "2015-09-09T01:06:14Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > In the US she would be innocent until proven to be guilty. Where is the evidence that YOU weren’t involved in this crime. You know that it is impossible to prove a negative, right? There is no evidence that she was involved in this crime, isn’t that enough? Italy and France justice system is based on the Napoleonic code. Its supporters could make some powerful arguments that it is better than ours, not that Id agree. Corruption is seperate from the system. For example, look at the McMartin case. There is some circumstantial evidence. Why did she lie? Just because they truly bungled the case doesnt reflect on her true guilt or innocence. It just means the case has been so tainted that she is legally free. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/296 "2015-09-09T01:17:58Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Just because she was railroaded doesnt mean that she is factually innocent. Im not saying that she is a murederer but a suspect in the murder. Why did she lie to the police and try to implicate someone else? Im only saying that we should all have an open mind about this case till it is solved. It is solved. The guilty party is in jail. The end. ---
**Author:** ![dzeiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@dzeiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzeiger)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/297 "2015-09-09T02:43:56Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > There is some circumstantial evidence. Why did she lie? Because she was interrogated for something like 12 hours straight, possibly including some physical assault as part of it. If you got yanked into interrogation by the cops for a crime you don’t know anything about, but the cops don’t believe you don’t know anything, and it becomes clear after several hours that the only answers they will accept from you is that either you did it, or you know who did it, how long do you think you’d actually ask before you break and tell them something they want to hear? Torture is not just bad because of moral issues, it’s bad because way too often the victim just tells you something to make the ordeal stop. That really sucks, but the blame falls far more on the cops using these tactics than Knox. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/298 "2015-09-09T03:09:48Z")
Right. And when Knox complained that the Italian cops coerced her into implicating Lumumba, the Italian courts wanted to prosecute her for slander, for saying such mean things about the cops. The cops interrogated her for 12 hours straight, saying that she either had to admit to the murder or finger someone else for the murder. She eventually named another person. It sucks for the guy who got falsely accused, but the blame for that falls on the Italian cops. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/299 "2015-09-09T09:03:31Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Why did she lie to the police and try to implicate someone else? Because the police were doing something both stupid and illegal, which is stupid and illegal precisely because it browbeats the victim into producing false positives like this. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2015, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474/300 "2015-09-09T09:42:33Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > Because the police were doing something both stupid and illegal, which is stupid and illegal precisely because it browbeats the victim into producing false positives like this. Police here in the USA browbeat people everyday. Its not illegal as long as the suspects arent lawyered up. How do we know its a false positive? Just because the police were just about as incompetent as could be doesnt mean she couldnt have been part of a conspiracy to commit murder. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amanda-knox-and-raffaele-sollecito-are-innocent-victims-of-a-rush-to-judgment/513474.md?page=16)