# Amazing Story-- Apple, Spielberg to screw the little guy **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 11, 2017, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576 "2017-10-11T15:34:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/21 "2017-10-12T14:28:51Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Sorry, I guess I’m too much of a cynic to believe the Op is accurate in the portrayal of this fight. You are free to feel whatever about it you want. Suffice it to say that any honest, heartfelt reply to you on that would get me a mod warning if not an instaban, so I’ll settle for this–[a Facebook post about it from May 19th](https://www.facebook.com/SteveAmazingDavidson/posts/10212948795776311). Note the comment from Steve and Karen Davidson’s friend [David Gerrold](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Gerrold). Also, [a link](https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/u/unknown109276.html). ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/22 "2017-10-12T16:29:31Z")
[Latest update](http://file770.com/?p=38227&cpage=1#comment-730312). ---
**Author:** ![Marvin\_the\_Martian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/marvin_the_martian/32/2898_2.png) [@Marvin\_the\_Martian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marvin_the_Martian)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/23 "2017-10-12T16:37:13Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Cut and Dried; but it looks less like a little guy fighting Goliath and more like a scam to me. He’s owned it for a less than 2 years, is trying to get others to help pay for his \*Trademark Troll \*shake down. I do not understand this at all. What difference does it make how long he has owned it, or if he has used it? He purchased a piece of intellectual property, it is properly registered with the authorities as his, he has the right to license the IP to anyone who wants to use it. If I purchase the rights to a song, am I a copyright troll for demanding royalties even though I didn’t write the song? ---
**Author:** ![edwards\_beard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@edwards\_beard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edwards_beard)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/24 "2017-10-12T18:25:55Z")
> [@Marvin\_the\_Martian](#): > > I do not understand this at all. What difference does it make how long he has owned it, or if he has used it? He purchased a piece of intellectual property, it is properly registered with the authorities as his, he has the right to license the IP to anyone who wants to use it. If I purchase the rights to a song, am I a copyright troll for demanding royalties even though I didn’t write the song? I guess what I’m confused about is, he owns the trademark to the name “Amazing Stories”, (and from the original linked article in 2011 it seemed to indicate it was for magazine type stuff only) but as far as I can tell, he doesn’t own the rights to the older TV series. Meaning, he can’t start releasing DVD of the show, or he can’t reprint the original magazines. Is this correct? So if the people that actually worked on the show decide to start it up again, what’s the big deal? They can just call it “Steven Spielberg presents Amazing Stories”, or “Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories” So the fact that he seems to be asking for people to donate to his fight seems odd. The dates thing is a little weird to me because all the articles and the OP say he bought them in 2011, but the link given shows 2016. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/25 "2017-10-12T18:44:07Z")
> [@edwards\_beard](#): > > The dates thing is a little weird to me because all the articles and the OP say he bought them in 2011, but the link given shows 2016. I don’t know the reason for the difference in dates, but he was [already](https://www.blackgate.com/2016/05/31/new-treasures-the-best-of-amazing-stories-the-1926-and-1927-anthologies-edited-by-steve-davidson-and-jean-marie-stine/) [publishing](https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=dp_byline_sr_book_5?ie=UTF8&text=Steve+Davidson&search-alias=books&field-author=Steve+Davidson&sort=relevancerank) anthologies of classic stories from _Amazing Stories_ in 2014. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/26 "2017-10-12T18:44:38Z")
I wonder if they could get away with calling it _Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories_. This whole thing reminds me of the story involving “Ken Hill’s _Phantom of the Opera_.” ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/27 "2017-10-12T18:50:13Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > I don’t know the reason for the difference in dates, but he was [already](https://www.blackgate.com/2016/05/31/new-treasures-the-best-of-amazing-stories-the-1926-and-1927-anthologies-edited-by-steve-davidson-and-jean-marie-stine/) [publishing](https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=dp_byline_sr_book_5?ie=UTF8&text=Steve+Davidson&search-alias=books&field-author=Steve+Davidson&sort=relevancerank) anthologies of classic stories from _Amazing Stories_ in 2014. Not the reincarnation of Sol Cohen, I hope. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/28 "2017-10-12T18:53:32Z")
> [@edwards\_beard](#): > > I guess what I’m confused about is, he owns the trademark to the name “Amazing Stories”, (and from the original linked article in 2011 it seemed to indicate it was for magazine type stuff only) but as far as I can tell, he doesn’t own the rights to the older TV series. Meaning, he can’t start releasing DVD of the show, or he can’t reprint the original magazines. Is this correct? > > So if the people that actually worked on the show decide to start it up again, what’s the big deal? They can just call it “Steven Spielberg presents Amazing Stories”, or “Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories” > > So the fact that he seems to be asking for people to donate to his fight seems odd. > > The dates thing is a little weird to me because all the articles and the OP say he bought them in 2011, but the link given shows 2016. I’m fairly certain that the TV series Amazing Stories licensed the trademark from the publisher - certainly given that the magazine was not quiet about the tie-in, and not negative about it either. IANA Trademark L but I’d think that a science fiction TV series would be considered close enough to a science fiction magazine to be covered. And I don’t think that coming out with a TV series called Voyager’s Star Wars would fly. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/29 "2017-10-12T18:55:21Z")
> [@Marvin\_the\_Martian](#): > > I do not understand this at all. What difference does it make how long he has owned it, or if he has used it? He purchased a piece of intellectual property, it is properly registered with the authorities as his, he has the right to license the IP to anyone who wants to use it. If I purchase the rights to a song, am I a copyright troll for demanding royalties even though I didn’t write the song? Plus when he got the trademark he’d have no way of knowing that anyone would be interested in reviving the TV series. If you told me that someone would back a few years ago, I would have laughed. I watched the series, but it wasn’t that good or that successful. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/30 "2017-10-12T19:18:48Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > I’m fairly certain that the TV series Amazing Stories licensed the trademark from the publisher Yes, it wasn’t just a coincidence that the series had the same name–it was an explicit reference to the legacy of the magazine, and licensed from the publisher. And I just dug up [this](http://collider.com/amazing-stories-bryan-fuller-patton-oswalt-kumail-nanjiani/) article where Bryan Filler (back when he was connected with the possible remake in 2015) made an explicit reference to the magazine: > [@Bryan Filler](#): > > We are working on a variety of scripts from a variety of sources, and we’ve got a lot of really great writers involved. So it feels like I’m curating the \*Amazing Stories \*magazine and I get to work with Patton Oswalt and Kumail Nanjiani and Emily Gordon and Jane Goldman Funny, then, that they try to brush off the guy who is _really_ curating the _Amazing Stories_ magazine. (As an aside, if Davidson hadn’t bought the trademark, neither NBC nor Spielberg was in line to snatch it up–it was going to go to a Canadian travel magazine.) ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/31 "2017-10-12T19:19:27Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Well, here’s the [trademark database entry](http://tmsearch.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4807:6eypvh.2.1): > That’s cut and dried – he owns the trademark and has since 2016. Correction: He has held a _trademark **registration** _ since 2016. A registration is pretty good proof of trademark rights, but it can be rebutted. > [@edwards\_beard](#): > > …as far as I can tell, he doesn’t own the rights to the older TV series. Meaning, he can’t start releasing DVD of the show, or he can’t reprint the original magazines. His current trademark rights are not dependent on the past rights of someone who no longer holds the trademark rights. If Hasbro truly abandoned the “Amazing Stories” mark (three continuous years of no use in commerce is presumed to constitute abandonment), then anyone can start using it. > [@](#): > > So if the people that actually worked on the show decide to start it up again, what’s the big deal? They can just call it “Steven Spielberg presents Amazing Stories”, or “Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories” No, that’s not how trademark rights first. If Hasbro abandoned the mark, then the person who establishes use in commerce first gets the rights. And he has a pretty good argument that Steven Spielberg presents Amazing Stories", or “Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories” creates a likelihood of confusion with “Amazing Stories.” > [@](#): > > The dates thing is a little weird to me because all the articles and the OP say he bought them in 2011, but the link given shows 2016. The link shows _ **registration** _ in 2016. Trademark rights are created by _use in commerce_ not by registration. The relevant date is _first use in commerce_, which is 2013. There’s nothing shady about this timeline— 2011 — purchased rights from previous owner (this is merely an agreement between old owner and new owner, not what definitively establishes ownership rights) 2013 — first use in commerce—\>_this is what establishes ownership rights_ 2016 — registration If he has been using the trademark since 2013, then he’s the owner of the trademark, and Spielberg’s use creates a likelihood of confusion, then Spielberg would lose this fight in court. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/32 "2017-10-12T19:26:21Z")
I just looked it up. Davidson has _two_ federal registrations. The first one was issued in 2012: > [@](#): > > Word Mark AMAZING STORIES > Goods and Services IC 009. US 021 023 026 036 038. G & S: Electronic publications, namely, periodical magazines featuring fictional pieces, articles, interviews, illustrations, photographs, imagery, animation, digital video, digital audio and other information in the fields of science fiction, fantasy and horror in popular culture recorded on computer media. FIRST USE: 20110928. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 20120701 > IC 016. US 002 005 022 023 029 037 038 050. G & S: Publications, namely, periodical magazines featuring fictional pieces, articles, interviews, illustrations, photographs, imagery and other information in the fields of science fiction, fantasy and horror in popular culture. FIRST USE: 20110928. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 20120701 > > Standard Characters Claimed > Mark Drawing Code (4) STANDARD CHARACTER MARK > Serial Number 77422636 > Filing Date March 14, 2008 > Current Basis 1A > Original Filing Basis 1B > Published for Opposition August 2, 2011 > Registration Number 4237952 > Registration Date November 6, 2012 He might have jumped the gun in 2011 by misunderstanding the publication for opposition to mean the same thing as registration. This registration’s priority date is 2012 (first use in commerce). ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/33 "2017-10-12T20:23:00Z")
He’s now reporting that NBC is negotiating with him: > [@Steve Davidson on Facebook](#): > > ets tone down the criticism of NBC for the nonce. They responded and we’re negotiating. Now we are in the “let’s be friends” phase, and I do honestly believe that contention can be relieved and parties to a disagreement can resolve their issues, and we ought to give NBC every opportunity to do just that. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/34 "2017-10-12T20:25:53Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > He’s now reporting that NBC is negotiating with him: See his longer file770 comment I linked in post #22. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2017, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/35 "2017-10-21T21:43:44Z")
[Looks like NBC has blinked](http://amazingstoriesmag.com/2017/10/plans/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+amazingstoriesmag%2FNhSh+%28Amazing+Stories%29). ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/36 "2017-10-22T00:37:21Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Not the reincarnation of Sol Cohen, I hope. Heh. That’s a blast from the past. For the half dozen of us old enough to remember. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/37 "2017-10-22T02:06:27Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **edwards\_beard** : > > I guess what I’m confused about is, he owns the trademark to the name “Amazing Stories”, (and from the original linked article in 2011 it seemed to indicate it was for magazine type stuff only) but as far as I can tell, he doesn’t own the rights to the older TV series. Meaning, he can’t start releasing DVD of the show, or he can’t reprint the original magazines. Is this correct? What you’re talking about is copyright, which is almost completely different from trademarks. There’s more than one kind of “rights”. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/38 "2017-10-22T02:37:46Z")
He just owns the rights to the trademark, which was at one point licensed to Spielberg for the TV show. The actual videos are copyrighted by Amblin’ (I assume), so he has no claim to them (and they had the right to use the trademark back then). He pretty much just has the rights to use _Amazing Stories_ as a magazine (web or print – it doesn’t matter). It’s not likely he has the rights to any of the stories still under copyright (though he could reprint anything that isn’t\*). Spielberg, OTOH, can’t use\* Amazing Stories\* because he doesn’t have the trademark. Calling it _Stephen Spielberg’s Amazing Stories_ is not a way around the trademark. Davidson would be able to rightfully claim that that causes confusion. (It’s like Walter Taylor not being able to use his own name on his wine, since his family sold the trademark to Coca-Cola). Last I looked on Facebook, Davidson said they were 99% in agreement on a licensing agreement and he feels that they’ll iron out the differences soon. I think Hanlon’s razor applies here: NBC set up a licensing agreement with Davidson but neglected to pay him (probably more a bureaucratic glitch – someone not sending the right form to finance). There was likely some turnover of the people involved and the belief at NBC was that they had bought the trademark, so they went ahead. \*If the copyright lapsed prior to 1978, it would be public domain. Many of the copyrights of the early years of the magazine were probably not renewed, and thus lapsed, but it would be difficult to pin them down. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2017, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/39 "2017-10-22T02:42:47Z")
Just a point here, if you lose your trademark rights through abandonment or some other means, your “residual reputation” means nothing against someone who has subsequently established use in commerce and the other requirements for trademark rights. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2017, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576/40 "2017-11-01T14:04:59Z")
Update: Steve Davidson has announced that he and NBC have a deal. It’s just a matter of the usual working out of minor wording in the contract. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazing-story-apple-spielberg-to-screw-the-little-guy/798576.md?page=1)