# Amazon Lord of the Rings series; The Rings of Power **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** middle-earth, amazon-prime, tv-shows-scripted\ **Created:** [March 3, 2019, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497 "2019-03-03T20:01:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/262 "2022-09-03T14:43:03Z")
In the timeline so far, Celebrimbor is working with Elrond to build the forge to make the rings of power. Elrond is trying to enlist the Dwarves of Khazad Dûm to help build it. So no rings yet. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/263 "2022-09-03T14:49:29Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Absolutely not Bombadil, Bombadil was short and was pretty much already in Western Middle Earth as the trees first grew. Yeah, I think we can trust that Bombadil was not full of crap and he really was the oldest thing left in Middle-Earth, unless it was Treebeard(who I think was simply wrong and it really is Tom). I’m happy to have a mystery to think about and I don’t mind canon-breaking a bit. I think it will either be: - Blue Wizard ← I kind of hope so, actually. I’m interested. - Something new \<–I don’t mind this either, to be honest. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/264 "2022-09-03T15:00:22Z")
Just FYI regarding female dwarves: Tolkien said that female dwarves were not as numerous as males, and did not travel so they were seldom seen. And as a result, few dwarves married. The wisecrack about beards was Aragorn‘s joke in the film — Tolkien didn’t mention beards. When they showed various things reacting to the meteor falling, I thought we saw ents? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/265 "2022-09-03T15:03:48Z")
Tolkien did mention beards. In one place he talked about the women having beards. In another he specifically said, “All male **Dwarves** have beards.” which leaves open the option of beards, lightly bearded or even no beards for the women. There is almost nothing about women Dwarves, so the beardless women shouldn’t be a huge problem, it is just that it is the expectation very many of us had. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/266 "2022-09-03T15:06:55Z")
And that expectation is from the books. In the 80s, I played a bearded female dwarf in D&D, based on that being canon. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/267 "2022-09-03T15:22:11Z")
The meteor pit The Stranger landed in looked like the eye of Sauron from the movies, another misdirection I would expect. [![](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic1.srcdn.com%2Fwordpress%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2022%2F09%2FMeteor-Man-in-Rings-of-Power.jpg&f=1&nofb=1) ](https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic1.srcdn.com%2Fwordpress%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2022%2F09%2FMeteor-Man-in-Rings-of-Power.jpg&f=1&nofb=1) ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/268 "2022-09-03T18:54:02Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > BTW: someone above thought Galadriel was 10000 years older than Elrond; no. It is suppose to be around 1600 Second Age I believe in the show. If Galadriel was a little girl when the trees were destroyed (which is basically wrong) then she was around 600 when the 1st Age ended. (590). Canonically Galadriel was born in YT 1368, 132 Valian years before the first sunrise, which is about 2,000 solar years in the past as of this setting. Tolkien defined Valian years as 10 solar years at one point and 144 at another, so she’s somewhere between 3300 and 21,000 years old. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/269 "2022-09-03T18:56:01Z")
Just watched half of the first and my wife begged off, so I’ll watch the rest myself. I FAR preferred what I saw to any of the movies (yeah - I’m THAT guy!). The movies were travesties - horrible bastardizations of the books which I loved. Whereas this is simply Hobbit-adjacent, via the Silmarrilion, which I never made it through. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/270 "2022-09-03T18:58:38Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Whereas this is simply Hobbit-adjacent, via the Silmarrilion, which I never made it through. I dont thinn Amazon actually has the rights to the Silmarillion - the opening credits say the show is “Based on The Lord of the Rings and its Appendices”. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/271 "2022-09-03T19:20:00Z")
I told my wife that this has passed one of my little tests. “Would I watch this if I had no idea of the existence of Lord of the Rings?” Yes, I would. I like fantasy and this is good enough to watch. I did not read Wheel of Time and I am apparently in the thin minority that loved it. My wife and I thought Wheel of Time season 1 was one of the best new shows of the last couple years. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/272 "2022-09-03T19:23:33Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > I did not read Wheel of Time and I am apparently in the thin minority that loved it. My wife and I thought Wheel of Time season 1 was one of the best new shows of the last couple years. Agreed completely (never read it, loved the show). Shadow & Bone is another one that I went into fresh and loved. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/273 "2022-09-03T19:30:57Z")
> [@Zakalwe](#): > > Agreed completely (never read it, loved the show). Shadow & Bone is another one that I went into fresh and loved. Me too, but I thought Wheel of Time was better. It took a couple episodes to improve, but it did big time. ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/274 "2022-09-03T21:51:14Z")
Racists are pissed that black and Hispanic people can be in the new Lord of the Rings series as anything other than mindless, rampaging orcs: > **[When 'wokeness' comes to Middle-earth: Why some say diverse casting ruins the...](https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/03/entertainment/lord-of-the-rings-amazon-controversy-blake-cec/index.html)** > > The new "Lord of the Rings" Amazon series has cast non-White actors in pivotal roles, ruffling some fans who say it betrays J.R.R. Tolkien's original vision. Others say a more diverse cast of heroes is overdue in a fantasy franchise that has been... ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/275 "2022-09-03T22:23:27Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Was Galadriel some sort of Xena Warrior Elf Princess in her younger days in Tolkien’s canon? Well, maybe. > [@Smapti](#): > > IIRC, she was always more of a politician than a general or a warrior. Eowyn notwithstanding, women warriors just aren’t a thing in Tolkien’s legendarium. Well, mostly. Apparently Tolkien was quite taken with his creation of Galadriel - he retconned her into the earlier Silmarillion after creating her for the Lord of the Rings and revised her background a couple of times. So she comes off slightly inconsistently in canon. However from a Tolkien letter: In her youth, she was of amazon disposition, and bound up her hair as a crown when taking part in athletic feats. And in one of his last writings he indicated she actually fought Fëanor at Alqualondë. Tolkien towards the end definitely seems to have leaned towards envisioning her as having been a headstrong and ambitious warrior princess in her youth. In the recent comic series [Die](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_(comics)) it is at one point used as a meme of sorts as one protagonist considers taking a powerful artifact with a potentially dire cost and remembers an old conversation with gamer friends. Galadriel in LotR was wise enough not to take the One Ring after having lived for thousands of years and learned perspective. But the protagonist is young and young Galadriel totally would have taken the ring 😉. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/276 "2022-09-03T22:36:48Z")
Galadrial as warrior feels fine to me. I haven’t read enough of the assorted letters to know that Tolkien may have supported that himself, but that just feels like a perfectly plausible youth for the ancient Galadrial i know from LOTR. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/277 "2022-09-03T22:40:48Z")
Racists gonna racist. They are all made up people of made up races in a made up world. I think Tolkien may even have described some groups of hobbits as brown. I suppose you could argue for pale dwarves since they spend so much of their time underground, but it seems silly to care about the race of the actors playing them. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/278 "2022-09-03T23:16:12Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > it seems silly to care about the race of the actors playing them. Well, it takes them out of the story, dontcha know, because it doesn’t match what they had in their wee little pointy heads. A few thoughts after watching both episodes: I think they might string out the mystery, for a while, of who meteor man is, it’s one of the few things that really kept my interest during episode 2. He doesn’t seem intrinsically evil enough to be Sauron, at least not yet. If it is him, this is seriously contra canon. The contents of the chest the king and prince were looking at seemed to generate its own silvery light. I don’t remember mithril doing that, it’s reflective but not generative. Are all the Silmarils accounted for at this stage? Otherwise, I fear it is the Arkenstone, contra canon, or else something new. Gil-galad and Celebrimbor look too old. They are elves, after all, and immortal, they should have wisdom and maturity without such obvious aging. Like Elrond in the movies. The scene on the raft where Galadriel tells Galbrand(?) that she feels his pain was not well acted. She needed more depth of feeling. A small point, but kind of telling for me. So the valley where the elves were watching over humans was being prepared for Sauron’s return, and the digging was to keep it secret from the elves I guess. The digger orcs didn’t get the memo that the elves had packed up and left. As far as canon is concerned, for me it’s just a consideration of “could it have happened this way?” They are partly filling in a sketchy background. If they are changing some things that we think we know, I hope they can at least do some hand-waving to make it fit. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/279 "2022-09-03T23:36:19Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > Are all the Silmarils accounted for at this stage? The one that Beren took from Morgoth wound up in Earendil’s possession when he sailed off into the sky. After Morgoth was defeated, Feanor’s last surviving sons stole the two remaining ones, but they burned their flesh just as they’d burned Morgoth’s - one of them, refusing to give his up, cast himself into a fiery pit with his, and the other threw his into the sea. They’re supposed to be beyond the reach of elves and men, at least until Dagor Dagorath. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/280 "2022-09-03T23:40:37Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > Gil-galad and Celebrimbor look too old. They are elves, after all, and immortal, they should have wisdom and maturity without such obvious aging. Like Elrond in the movies. Cirdan the Shipwright, who’s one of the oldest living elves, is described in the books as having grey hair and a beard, so elves do eventually age, even if it takes a long time. He appears briefly in the intro to FOTR alongside Galadriel and Gil-Galad, and I assume he’s the fellow Galadriel saw at the very end of the episode. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497/281 "2022-09-03T23:55:03Z")
And now, as a humorous aside, enjoy these alternate opening credits; > [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amazon-lord-of-the-rings-series-the-rings-of-power/830497.md?page=15)