Ambiguous warning about "white people" post

[CarnalK]

This is real ridiculous,iiandyiiii. You are confused about why a post that uses deliberately dehumanizing language and cheers the day white people are out bred might get a warning? Oh dear, will this effect my ability to criticize "whiteness? :rolleyes:

[iiandyiiii]

@CarnalK

This is real ridiculous,iiandyiiii. You are confused about why a post that uses deliberately dehumanizing language and cheers the day white people are out bred might get a warning? Oh dear, will this effect my ability to criticize "whiteness? :rolleyes:

I ask some specific questions in the OP and later on, and I don’t think you’re really understanding them. Hard as it may be to accept, some people really do approach these things and think about them quite differently than you do, and it might take some real effort to try and understand the point of view of such folks. Dismissing out of hand points of view that seem ridiculous to you at first is easy, but it might be more rewarding to express a more open mind and consider that maybe these are just honest and substantive disagreements and different approaches.

[Riemann]

@asahi

Times have changed, I reckon. White people, the ones who perpetrate racism, are the victims, and black people who voice frustration at living with racism are the racists.

This is a pathetically weak straw man. Are you incapable of discussing an issue without blatantly misrepresenting and smearing anyone who disagrees with you? Are you not capable of grasping that others can agree with you about the fundamental reality of social injustice, yet disagree with your dogmatic view of the problem?

If you are only willing to listen to the opinion of POC on issues of race and racism, and only women on gender bigotry and oppression, try this:

Can blacks be racist? The answer, of course, will depend on how you define racism. If you define it as “prejudice against or hatred toward another race,” then the answer is yes. If you define racism as “the belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race,” the answer is yes. And if you define racism as “prejudice and discrimination rooted in race-based loathing,” then the answer is, again, yes. However, if you define racism as “a system of group privilege by those who have a disproportionate share of society’s power, prestige, property, and privilege,” then the answer is no. In the end, it is my opinion that individual blacks can be and sometimes are racists. However, collectively, blacks are neither the primary creators nor beneficiaries of the racism that permeates society today.

…[the redefinition of racism to mean only prejudice+power or institutional racism] divests black people of being the agents of their own destiny and reduces them yet again to the status of perennial victims needing special treatment…“special dispensation status” feeds into a notion of passivity, of being solely acted upon and of not being positive agents of change in one’s own destiny, thus contributing to the notion that we are not masters of our own fate. Hence we persist in acting out the role of mere victims and pawns. That is something I will never advocate to the young people I mentor.

Carlos Hoyt, Jr. argues that the revised definition [racism to mean only prejudice+power] “charges white people with being de facto racists … while providing an exemption to black people from being held accountable for racist beliefs”. He advises that teachers use more specific, nuanced terms, such as “Race-based Oppression” or “Institutional Race-based Oppression”

[Prejudice+Power] has legitimized overt race- and gender-based hate speech; if it’s okay to say hateful things about white men, the claim that it’s not okay to say them about other groups becomes tenuous. It has lent credibility to claims that whites, especially straight white men, are under attack. It has subverted the moral authority of anti-racism—and of liberalism (in the classic sense), dismissed in current progressive discourse as “a philosophy of white male domination.” And it has so trivialized the concepts of bigotry and racism that they have lost much of their stigma.

My bold. All sources here:

Prejudice plus power

[CarnalK]

Nm

[engineer_comp_geek]

Moderator Action

This has moved pretty well outside of the bounds of ATMB. Anyone who wishes to debate what is or is not racism is free to start a new thread in GD. This is closed.