Oh, I didn’t get your point apparently, but I agree 100%. It’s something that’s not at all important. Back on the first page of this thread, I said:
And I still agree with myself. But to be intellectually honest, I did have to retract the “I won’t notice” part because I would have been noticed. That fact that it’s miniscule and unimportant doesn’t negate the fact that there would have been an effect to me.
So I have to concur, that there’d be SOME notice, however miniscule.
Okay. I was really responding to the myriad posts (didn’t keep track of each individual) that picayune things would be really be big problems in their estimation. I wouldn’t notice a passport problem, since I already have mine. (And when I first got it, there was a months-long backlog, so a shutdown for a week or a month still wouldn’t have been noticed by me.) Or the tax refund thing. Sorry, but I just don’t get providing a yearlong interest-free loan to Uncle Sam, and then getting excited when I get my own money back. My refunds are typically under $100 because I watch my estimated payments very carefully. Sure, there are those who lack discipline to save, so that’s their method but, then, if it’s savings, what does it matter if they wait a few more weeks to cash it out?
Mostly, whether or not I did notice a shutdown, it would be primarily due to the media harping on it. Had it not been for that, I wouldn’t have known a thing about it in 1996.
:rolleyes:
It’d be just as accurate to say that the Democrats wanted to shut down the government because they would not vote for the bill for ideological reasons.
And there’s one (of many) of the issues, funding for Planned Parenthood, just as an example. If there is money, I’m all for it. But PP doesn’t rely solely, or even mainly upon federal funding for their revenue. Sure, it helps; it helps a lot, but if funding dried up, PP wouldn’t go away. So ALL of the posturing over Planned Parenthood, from BOTH sides, is nothing more than ideological sparring.
As I said, that’s one example. There are many, many more. But really, don’t blame your Congressmen. They really are responding to their constituents. Because, in talking with people, I’ve found that YOUR pet federal projects are just wasteful, unjustified spending, but MY pet federal projects are well-documented necessities that must <u>never</u> be sacrificed for just the almighty dollar.
Most of them really are conveniences, not necessities, including the ones which benefit me.
One of the things I find surprising is the number of Americans who don’t consider the passport office being shutdown as an issue. Yes, those who have no international travel plans would be functionally unaffacted. But how many Americans have a current passport in their possession at any given time? 10% maybe? (not sure how to look this up.)
If you heard an international news report that country “X” had closed it’s borders, and was preventing any new International travel for 90% of it’s citizens, wouldn’t you consider that to be a sign of instability in it’s Government? Woudl be in a hurry to invest in a business there? I’ve heard that report a few times in the past and always considered it a sign that the feces were about to hit the fan there.
The last time, when Gingrich headed up a similar shut-down, I had friends and co-workers who shrugged their shoulders about it. When I pointed out that the borders of the USA had been closed to them - they had lost their right to travel internationally - they shifted a bit.
Closing the passport office isn’t quite the same as closing the borders.
Prior planning prevents piss poor performance.
A few years ago Canada decided to suddenly require visas the next day for Slovak and Mexican passport holders. Yes, one day to the next. That was a regrettable problem.
And closing the passport office doesn’t prevent you from visiting other countries. Passports are issued by resident country as identification. Visas are required as permission for non-residents to enter those countries. Passports are good for 10 years. And you don’t have to wait until the day they expire to renew them. You actually have nearly a year, so there’s no emergency.
And then,more importantly, passports are issued by the Dept of State, while the borders are maintained by the Dept of Homeland Security. So, closing the passport offices does not close the borders.
And the question brought up about only 10% (as a guess?) of the population holding passports, 90% (also a guess) of the country will never need them as they’ll never have occasion to leave the country. With the 10% that do have passports, and with a 10 year validity, theoretically, only 1% for an entire year would need renewal. Over 12 months, statistically, that’s 0.08% that would need renewal in any given month.
Which brings us back to item #2, that you can renew them in a previous month if you anticipate any problem (or even if you don’t). And if you suddenly find you need a passport tomorrow, you’re SOL even with all the offices open. It don’t work that way.
If you suddenly find you need a passport renewal tomorrow, you CAN get one at a passport office, with proof of imminent travel. As long as the office is open.
It happens more often than you think. My boss travels internationally for work at least monthly. Sometimes several times a month. She can’t go without a valid passport for any length of time. So she always renews at the passport office in person, where the passport is not out of her possession for more than a few hours.
During the Gingrich shutdown a friend missed her sister’s funeral in England because she was too elderly and frail to travel alone. She needed a passport renewal, and the office was willing to process it for her, but they wouldn’t process one for the only friend she could find with the time and willingness to go with her.
I never said the two scenarios were exactly the same. What I said was that to those Americans without a current passport, it was functionally the same.
I suppose it is true that one could leave the country without a passport. But it’s unlikely that you would be either allowed to enter a new country, or accepted back into this one without it. You’d be effectively stuck in airport limbo until the passport office opened again, or somebody made an exception for you. A seriously stupid risk to take.