# American Idol 1/16 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 16, 2007, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228 "2007-01-16T19:02:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/201 "2007-01-18T20:06:47Z")
[QUOTE=Sapo] ok, here is my final answer. I am ok with the judges ridiculing bad performances. I have a problem with them ridiculing physical appearance, mental handicaps or any other deviation from the Hollywood norm. With the buggy-eyed guy, even Paula and Randy were actually ashamed of Simon’s comments. No need for that. [/QUOTE] Ditto. There’s no excuse for humiliating people for their physical defects on national television. But the talent is just so rock-bottom this year…I don’t know how they made it through the auditions day in and day out. Total suckfest. ---
**Author:** ![Smitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Smitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smitty)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/202 "2007-01-18T20:46:12Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Ditto. There’s no excuse for humiliating people for their physical defects on national television. [/QUOTE] I disagree. These people aren’t interviewing to be accountants, they are auditioning to be a pop star. Like it or not, looks matter in the entertainment industry. Yeah, there are plenty of singers that wouldn’t make the cover of Vogue, but they have EXCEPTIONAL talent. And, as other posters have pointed out, these people know good and well what they are getting in for. There is no way in hell that somebody who is fat, googly-eyed, and has hair like a rusty Brillo pad can possibly think he can walk in front of Simon and not get talked about; and pretty roughly, at that. I’ll feel sorry for someone who gets hit by a car while walking on the curb, but not for the guy who thinks it’s a good idea to joust with oncoming traffic. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/203 "2007-01-18T20:59:00Z")
[QUOTE=Biggirl] Why should the auditioners on AI expect to be treated with respect or even nicely? [/QUOTE] Oh, I dunno…common human decency? The Golden Rule? If the objective of humiliating the pathetic is to cut down on the wackos for next season…it ain’t working. If the objective is to get their audience to point & laugh at the geeks…that’s kinda ewwww. AI could reach their larger goals (finding the best-qualified 100-odd singers) without humiliating anyone. They could even put the Truly Awful on TV, for our amusement. There’s just nothing gained by laughing at them and making them cry. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/204 "2007-01-18T21:15:26Z")
[QUOTE=Smitty] I disagree. These people aren’t interviewing to be accountants, they are auditioning to be a pop star. [/QUOTE] Ruben Stoddard, Clay Aiken, Elliott Yamin…they didn’t seem to fare too poorly in this “pop star” competition despite their less than idyllic appearance. I don’t think the judges should make fun of anyone, be it their crappy singing or their size. It’s far simpler to just say, “I don’t think this show is right for you.” and moooove on. I read that Simon made fun of Mandisa last season until she personally confronted him. That might explain why he’s been so uncharacteristically subdued this round. And I must say, I like him a lot better without the assholish behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/205 "2007-01-18T22:33:54Z")
[QUOTE=Smitty] I disagree. These people aren’t interviewing to be accountants, they are auditioning to be a pop star. Like it or not, looks matter in the entertainment industry. Yeah, there are plenty of singers that wouldn’t make the cover of Vogue, but they have EXCEPTIONAL talent. And, as other posters have pointed out, these people know good and well what they are getting in for. There is no way in hell that somebody who is fat, googly-eyed, and has hair like a rusty Brillo pad can possibly think he can walk in front of Simon and not get talked about; and pretty roughly, at that. I’ll feel sorry for someone who gets hit by a car while walking on the curb, but not for the guy who thinks it’s a good idea to joust with oncoming traffic. [/QUOTE] Again, I understand what you’re saying. But the way I see it, someone who looks like the guy with the eyes\* or the guy in the Hawai’ian shirt has to have thick skin just to get through the day. They probably spend years convincing themselves that it doesn’t matter, and in some cases, that’s effective enough for them to think they can audition for a talent show. As such, “You don’t have the right look” is not mean, but truthful. But “You look like a monkey” is not cruel to be kind; it’s just plain cruel. Whether or not the eye guy should be at the audition, there’s nothing he can do about the eyes themselves, and making a specific insult is out of line. The first remark is an ego check. The second is an ego hit. They’re not equal. \*In that first shot they had of him, outside the audition, it looked to me as if they’d asked him to make his eyes even wider, for effect. He probably gets a lot of that, too, and figures it’s something he just has to deal with: be in on the joke and get it over with. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/206 "2007-01-18T22:42:37Z")
I don’t think the judges run up to people on the subway, pointing and giggling at their big ears or obese frames. These people are coming into a studio, with cameras, auditioning for a chance to break into a tough business via a show that is all about image, voice, and popularity. This has been known worldwide for five years. Mama Cass can be a star, but she has to go a different route. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2007, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/207 "2007-01-18T23:06:52Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] We’ve seen that for many of them, a simple “no” does _not_ suffice. Some of them are just incapable of processing the message that they aren’t talented. I get the feeling that a lot of the times when Simon is saying “one of the worst I’ve ever heard…ghastly…absolutely terrible” and the like, he’s really just trying to avoid the auditioner seeing any ambiguity in his rejection. He wants them to know it’s not borderline. It’s not close. Coaching isn’t going to help them. Another song isn’t going to help them. They just can’t do it and will never be able to do it. Like he says, he’s not killing puppies. He’s just telling people who can’t sing that they can’t sing. It’s not a blanket indictment of them as human beings. snip. [/QUOTE] The word “no” does not register at all for those who are determined not to hear it, even when they need to. I’ve said it to students clamoring to get into my already-maxed-out classes, and all they say is “oh, please? Come on, why not? Just one more? Really?” and so on…much like some of these contestants. That’s just one of many examples. They never realize how irritating it is to the person saying “no” to hear their continued pleas and begging. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2007, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/208 "2007-01-19T00:11:57Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] I don’t think the judges run up to people on the subway, pointing and giggling at their big ears or obese frames. These people are coming into a studio, with cameras, auditioning for a chance to break into a tough business via a show that is all about image, voice, and popularity. This has been known worldwide for five years. Mama Cass can be a star, but she has to go a different route. [/QUOTE] That’s how you see it. The way I see it, personal insults are never okay, in any situation. FTR, just so’s we’re clear, I do **not** think that the judges are always, or even usually, out of line in their criticism. I am **only** talking about personal insults. I’m not singling out Simon, either. “You don’t have the right look” is reasonable because it’s true. “Worst audition I’ve ever heard” is understandable, because it’s unambiguous. “You look like a monkey” is another category entirely. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2007, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/209 "2007-01-19T01:06:54Z")
[QUOTE=PunditLisa] Ruben Stoddard, Clay Aiken, Elliott Yamin…they didn’t seem to fare too poorly in this “pop star” competition despite their less than idyllic appearance. I don’t think the judges should make fun of anyone, be it their crappy singing or their size. It’s far simpler to just say, “I don’t think this show is right for you.” and **moooove** on. [/QUOTE] (Bolding mine - **kd99** ) “Cow” jokes, **PunditLisa**? :rolleyes: Just kidding. I thought it was funny, whether it was intentional or not. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/210 "2007-01-20T15:36:11Z")
[QUOTE=Smitty] I disagree. These people aren’t interviewing to be accountants, they are auditioning to be a pop star. Like it or not, looks matter in the entertainment industry. Yeah, there are plenty of singers that wouldn’t make the cover of Vogue, but they have EXCEPTIONAL talent. And, as other posters have pointed out, these people know good and well what they are getting in for. There is no way in hell that somebody who is fat, googly-eyed, and has hair like a rusty Brillo pad can possibly think he can walk in front of Simon and not get talked about; and pretty roughly, at that. I’ll feel sorry for someone who gets hit by a car while walking on the curb, but not for the guy who thinks it’s a good idea to joust with oncoming traffic. [/QUOTE] There’s a difference between saying “I don’t think you have the right look for show business” and “you look like a bush baby.” ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/211 "2007-01-20T18:26:04Z")
I wonder how many times it goes more like this… ======================================= Simon: I’m afraid it’s a no. Dingbat: […incredulous stare…] Huh? Why? Simon: I don’t think you have the right look for show business. Dingbat: Why not? What’s wrong with the way I look? Simon: Quite frankly, everything. Dingbat: Tell me. I can take it. Simon: Your hair is uncombed. Your clothes are filthy. Your teeth are yellow. Your fingernails are chewed to the cuticle. I can smell your feet from here. And your posture is worse than Stephen Hawking’s. Dingbat: You’re saying there’s something wrong with how I look? Simon: You look like a bush baby. ======================================= …and all that’s aired is the last line. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/212 "2007-01-20T18:31:19Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] I wonder how many times it goes more like this… ======================================= Simon: I’m afraid it’s a no. Dingbat: […incredulous stare…] Huh? Why? Simon: I don’t think you have the right look for show business. Dingbat: Why not? What’s wrong with the way I look? Simon: Quite frankly, everything. Dingbat: Tell me. I can take it. Simon: Your hair is uncombed. Your clothes are filthy. Your teeth are yellow. Your fingernails are chewed to the cuticle. I can smell your feet from here. And your posture is worse than Stephen Hawking’s. Dingbat: You’re saying there’s something wrong with how I look? Simon: You look like a bush baby. ======================================= …and all that’s aired is the last line. [/QUOTE] I agree it’s highly likely that it came down this way. But we all know that the audience thrives on Simon’s Dark Side. The editors prefer the mean-spirited stuff to constructive criticism because that’s what sells the show. I’d guess that this first few weeks of audition footage is what locks in the view base for the rest of the season. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2007, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/213 "2007-01-20T21:28:15Z")
AI really could have it both ways. They could market the first 2 weeks as “The AI Gong Show”, with nothing but wackos. No touching background material on the contestant, no constructive (or otherwise) criticism; no tears in the hallway. Just loony performances, and stunned looks from the judges. Then they get to the real show, once we go to Hollywood. Or they could stay with the current format, and show nothing but good, or marginally not-good-enough, performances, with a montage of the Truly Awful at the end (which they do, already). Tsk. I should be a producer and make millions. ---
**Author:** ![want2know](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/50afbb/32.png) [@want2know](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/want2know)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2007, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228/214 "2007-01-21T02:32:18Z")
* * * > [@](#): > > And the chick with the red arms? Were her legs red too, or was she wearing tights? That’s another bad sign: when people are so unaware of how they come off that they choose an outfit that emphasizes their worst feature. Anyone else see a resemblance between her and “God Warrior” from _Wife Swap_ ? :eek: As one of the “car-wreck-watchers” who only watches the bad auditions and couldn’t care less about the rest of the series, I feel that Simon isn’t cruel _enough_ ! I mean, do these mutants actually _watch_ the show? They have to know that the “freak acts” are going to be featured on the show, and if they’re so delusional that they think they have a snowball’s chance in hell of “getting to Hollywood”, they deserve everything Simon can dish out at them! And we, the viewing public, reap the benefits. And Seattle was particularly appalling! This had to be the worst audition show ever! And I LOVED every minute of it! If you’re dumb enough to stick your head in a lion’s mouth, don’t blame the lion if he bites it off! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-idol-1-16/388228.md?page=10)