# American smokers making 30K a year or less spend 1/7 to 1/4 of their income on... cigarettes?! **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 23, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298 "2014-10-23T23:28:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/1 "2014-10-23T23:28:41Z")
I was reading [this Vice article](http://www.vice.com/read/i-spent-a-day-with-a-guy-selling-illegal-cigarettes-on-the-streets-of-nyc-1023)which referenced [this study](http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0043838#s4) showing that even in these days of declining smoking a huge chunk of underclass income goes toward cigarettes. Of US smokers making less than $ 30,000 per year the percentage of their income that goes toward cigarette purchases is 14.2% nationally and 23.4% in NYC! Those numbers are mind blowing. > [@](#): > > This difference varies markedly by income level, especially in New York. New York smokers in the lowest income category spent roughly one-fifth (23.6%) of their household income on cigarettes, compared to 14.2% nationally for smokers with comparable income. The middle-income group spent 5.4% of their income on cigarettes in New York and 4.3% nationally. Smokers in the highest income group spent 2.2% of their income on cigarettes in New York and 2.0% nationally. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/2 "2014-10-24T00:33:20Z")
There is a reason why all of the personal finance experts that I read and follow recommend quitting smoking as part of their budget plans. ---
**Author:** ![JerrySTL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e274bd/32.png) [@JerrySTL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerrySTL)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/3 "2014-10-24T00:50:20Z")
Many people making less than $30K a year probably have made a number of bad decisions in their lifetime with smoking just being one of them. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/4 "2014-10-24T02:46:28Z")
You don’t really budget for cigarettes or anything. You just buy them. It’s an addiction. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/5 "2014-10-24T02:50:26Z")
I thought poor people didn’t have IDs. How can they buy cigarettes? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/6 "2014-10-24T02:51:26Z")
I know alcoholics who buy alcohol rather than pay rent. Tobacco is the same thing. An addiction. They will lie, cheat and steal to support their habit. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/7 "2014-10-24T02:58:37Z")
It is not that bad. They just buy them with their lottery profits. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/8 "2014-10-24T02:59:21Z")
> [@elfkin477](#): > > I thought poor people didn’t have IDs. How can they buy cigarettes? By looking old enough? ---
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/9 "2014-10-24T03:06:06Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > By looking old enough? Bingo. Most places don’t card unless the customer looks reasonably close to the cutoff age. “We verify the age of all customers who appear to be under the age of 30” or whatever their store’s policy is. None of the states in which I’ve lived have required vendors to check everybody’s age. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 8:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/10 "2014-10-24T08:33:46Z")
Well, it’s not like the prices go down with income. Of course the percentage is going to be higher for those with lower incomes. The change has been the reduction of the number of smokers, not decreasing how much they spend on it. Heck, cigarette prices have intentionally gone up to encourage people to stop smoking. People who are still smoking pay a higher percentage than they used to. The whole problem with an addiction is that you can’t easily moderate your usage. It’s very often all-or-nothing. Those who put the expense above the addiction choose the nothing. Others choose the all. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/11 "2014-10-24T08:36:12Z")
Why do you think vaping has been blowing up in popularity? Because it is outrageously cheaper than buying cigarettes. High tobacco taxes just hurt the poor, it is a disgrace. ---
**Author:** ![SeaDragonTattoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@SeaDragonTattoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeaDragonTattoo)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/12 "2014-10-24T09:23:11Z")
High tobacco taxes only hurt those who buy tobacco. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/13 "2014-10-24T09:38:17Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > By looking old enough? Or by looking republican enough. ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 10:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/14 "2014-10-24T10:20:40Z")
> [@SeaDragonTattoo](#): > > High tobacco taxes only hurt those who buy tobacco. True, but that population includes the poor. And if you say well they can just stop buying tobacco, addiction is not going to let that happen. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/15 "2014-10-24T10:55:27Z")
I’m embarrassed to admit that my biggest motivator to quit smoking was price. And this is coming from someone who _makes_ a good living. $250 a month is a ridiculous price to pay no matter what you make. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/16 "2014-10-24T11:00:58Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m embarrassed to admit that my biggest motivator to quit smoking was price. Don’t be embarrassed. If it worked, it worked. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/17 "2014-10-24T11:32:55Z")
New York has the highest state tobacco tax rates (and revenue), and of course it’s as regressive as taxes get. The OP’s figures are simply the unsurprising result of that math. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/18 "2014-10-24T11:34:06Z")
Such irrationality is hard to grok, and yet I think I understand it in social terms. If everyone you know smokes, including your SO, then your social life is going to be impacted if you drop the habit. And when you’re poor, all you really have is the people in your life. Being the “different one” can be costly too. ---
**Author:** ![kiz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7feea3/32.png) [@kiz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kiz)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/19 "2014-10-24T12:09:06Z")
There’s a fair amount of smokers in my line of work. Here’s how they get around the price (ours isn’t as bad as NY’s but it’s close): ~ Give somebody money to go to a neighboring state with no sales tax to buy them. This is very common where I am because the next state over has no sales tax. ~ Smoke off brands ~ Force yourself to cut down. My husband, for example, was a 2-pack a day smoker until his doctor got on his case. He no longer smokes in the house – goes out to the deck rain or shine (this will be interesting come winter, btw). He’s starting to stub out cigarettes midway through so he doesn’t smoke it entirely in one sitting. It also helps that one of our housemates is asthmatic. I’ve tried to quit here and there over the years too. Before the housemates I was probably smoking close to a pack a day. I’m now down to less than half a pack. As my doctor says, any improvement IS an improvement. BTW, smokers may bitch about the tax, but they’re going to buy anyway. Nicotine is up there with heroin as one of the most addictive substances in the world. ---
**Author:** ![kiz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/7feea3/32.png) [@kiz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kiz)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2014, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-smokers-making-30k-a-year-or-less-spend-1-7-to-1-4-of-their-income-on-cigarettes/702298/20 "2014-10-24T12:20:16Z")
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