# American soldier crosses into North Korea **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 18, 2023, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221 "2023-07-18T16:43:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/1 "2023-07-18T16:43:12Z")
Apparently he’d been facing some sort of disciplinary action, but how can ANYONE think this is a good solution to your problems? > **[US soldier believed to be detained by North Korea after 'willfully' crossing...](https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/18/asia/us-national-north-korea/index.html)** > > A US soldier who crossed the demarcation line into North Korea had been facing disciplinary action by the US military and was set to be sent back to the United States, according to a US defense official. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/2 "2023-07-18T17:07:45Z")
Lucky to be repatriated, considering. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/3 "2023-07-18T17:09:58Z")
Ha! He must be a real POS, if the Norks _sent him back_. I’d say his career is over, but this is the clownworld timeline, so stay tuned… ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/4 "2023-07-18T17:15:38Z")
Where are you seeing that N. Korea gave him back? ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/5 "2023-07-18T18:07:10Z")
They didn’t, he’s being “detained” by the North. I can’t imagine then returning him without something in return. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/6 "2023-07-18T18:14:01Z")
They are going to debrief the fuck out of him for quite a while. He may never come back. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/7 "2023-07-18T18:29:07Z")
I don’t know who the ‘deserter’ is, and I really don’t care. I’m prepared to trade him for Donald J. Trump, sight unseen. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/8 "2023-07-18T18:33:42Z")
He better hope he doesn’t end up like Jenkins, the American defector who ended up having to spend 40 years in NK. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/9 "2023-07-18T21:42:32Z")
If he joined in 2021 and is a private then he’s a shitbag. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/10 "2023-07-18T21:56:14Z")
This in the CNN story is funny: > [@](#): > > There was no indication that King was trying to defect, a separate US official said. Um, when a U.S. soldier walks into North Korea, that’s a very strong indication. And the apparent fact that he walked away from his unit at the airport, only defecting hours later, shows it wasn’t just done on a momentary impulse. NK will use this to try to humiliate an administration it wants to lose in next year’s election. Biden had better not fall for it by acting like the soldier is still an American. (I know he is officially an American because he didn’t pay our ridiculous $2,350 citizenship renunciation fee — that needs to be eliminated.) ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/11 "2023-07-18T22:10:11Z")
> The soldier, who was identified as Pvt. Travis T. King, had recently been released from a South Korean prison after being arrested on assault charges, according to a U.S. official familiar with the situation who was not authorized to speak publicly. U.S. military officials had planned to send him to Fort Bliss, Texas, to face additional disciplinary actions. From NYT. Any problem with letting North Korea keep him? ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/12 "2023-07-18T22:11:31Z")
EDITED: susan beat me to it on most of this: > [@Loach](#): > > If he joined in 2021 and is a private then he’s a shitbag. And what about this:. [King was detained on assault charges in a South Korean prison](https://www.npr.org/2023/07/18/1188251228/north-korea-man-detained-border-us) For what it is worth, I checked the criminal Justice rankings at [worldjusticeproject.org](http://worldjusticeproject.org). South Korea is ranked 19 (while the U.S. is down at 30). I think that being imprisoned in South Korea is not a good look. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/13 "2023-07-18T22:49:15Z")
> [@Dorjan](#): > > Where are you seeing that N. Korea gave him back? Perhaps it was a bit of confusion in the article. The United States Army was returning him to the United States to kick his butt out of the service. That type of separation from the military can only be processed in the US, not overseas. Another thing: the articled referred to him as a Private Second Class. That’s not a rank in our Army. He’s a Private (E-2). Yet another inaccuracy in the article: it says he was on the tour “as a civilian”. Nope. He has not been seprated from the military yet; therefore, he is not a civilian. > [@PhillyGuy](#): > > I think that being imprisoned in South Korea is not a good look. Cullen Thomas wrote about [his experience in South Korea’s prisons](https://www.amazon.com/Brother-One-Cell-American-Prisons/dp/0143113119/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2TF7L3XQDUX42&keywords=Brother+One+Cell&qid=1689720318&s=books&sprefix=brother+one+cel%2Cstripbooks-intl-ship%2C391&sr=1-1). King’s experience in South Korea’s prison was better, though, because the Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA) requires the US military to provide him certain “health and welfare” items, and to have regular visits with him while he was incarcerated. Thomas, being an actual civilian, was not privy to such things. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/14 "2023-07-18T23:02:23Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Cullen Thomas wrote about [his experience in South Korea’s prisons](https://www.amazon.com/Brother-One-Cell-American-Prisons/dp/0143113119/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2TF7L3XQDUX42&keywords=Brother+One+Cell&qid=1689720318&s=books&sprefix=brother+one+cel%2Cstripbooks-intl-ship%2C391&sr=1-1). Sounds interesting. He was convicted in 1994 — a bit early in the process of transition to democracy. And it seems they didn’t lock him up for something he didn’t do. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/15 "2023-07-18T23:11:04Z")
> [@susan](#): > > Any problem with letting North Korea keep him? The U.S. has a history of looking out for the interests of its citizens abroad even when they do stupid things like this guy. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/16 "2023-07-18T23:17:46Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > The U.S. has a history of looking out for the interests of its citizens abroad even when they do stupid things like this guy. I know. The Secretary of Defense is quoted today as saying “I’m absolutely foremost concerned about the welfare of our troop.” Secretary, he is no longer your troop. Considering him such makes the U.S. government look pitiful. The only way to get him back is to trade something for him, and when the trade is done, Republicans will use it against the administration. That’s my concern here. As for should-be-regarded-as-former Private 2nd class King, I hope the North Koreans decide to treat him well. Unlikely, but possible. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/17 "2023-07-18T23:34:17Z")
When Robert Jenkins defected to the North decades ago, the North promptly forced him to act as “the white Yankee villain guy” in many of their subsequent movies (for the domestic North Korean audience.) Jenkins became something of a celebrity in Pyongyang afterwards as a result. I’m guessing North Korean filmmakers are now sizing up this Travis King guy, hmmm-ing, wondering which roles he can play and how he can be cast. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/18 "2023-07-19T01:09:47Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Another thing: the articled referred to him as a Private Second Class. That’s not a rank in our Army. He’s a Private (E-2). Not saying you are wrong, but this is from [military.com](http://military.com), a web site where I would have thought they knew about such: [His rank of private second class after more than two years of Army service suggests King may have been held back for disciplinary issues or for failing to meet standards](https://www.military.com/daily-news/2023/07/18/army-identifies-private-captured-north-korea-after-he-ran-across-border.html) > [@Monty](#): > > Yet another inaccuracy in the article: it says he was on the tour “as a civilian”. Could be wrong again, but I interpreted it as that he was dressed as a civilian on a tour that was only for civilians. I don’t like to jump on people when they are (probably) down, but I also think American government employees have a responsibility to be on their best behavior when on allied soil. The problem is not just with this guy: [Two Secret Service agents sent home after off-duty incident in Seoul](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/two-secret-service-agents-seoul-incident/) ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/19 "2023-07-19T01:29:43Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > > [@Monty](#): > > > > Another thing: the articled referred to him as a Private Second Class. That’s not a rank in our Army. He’s a Private (E-2). > > Not saying you are wrong, but this is from [military.com](http://military.com), a web site where I would have thought they knew about such: > > [His rank of private second class after more than two years of Army service suggests King may have been held back for disciplinary issues or for failing to meet standards](https://www.military.com/daily-news/2023/07/18/army-identifies-private-captured-north-korea-after-he-ran-across-border.html) From the US Army’s official website, it goes: E-1: Private E-1 (PV1) E-2: Private E-2 (PV2) E-3: Private First Class (PFC) … > **[ranks.pdf](https://www.army.mil/e2/downloads/rv7/symbols/ranks.pdf)** > > 4.98 MB The list of ranks used by the United States Army on Wikipedia has Private Second Class existing until 1920: > [@](#): > > Private: June 14, 1775 - > Private First Class: May 15, 1846 - > … > Private Second Class: May 15, 1846 - July 1, 1920\* > > \* General Order 36, June 19, 1920, Privates Second Class are not listed in the order but it probably made them into Privates. > **[List of ranks used by the United States Army | P](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ranks_used_by_the_United_States_Army#P)** > > 1.Paymaster: April 24, 1816 - March 3, 1847 | > 2.Paymaster General: June 16, 1775 - August 1, 1788, May 8, 1792 - March 3, 1847 | > 3.Physician and Surgeon General: April 7, 1777 - January 1, 1781, March 3, 1813 - June 15, 1815 | > 4.Physician General: May 28, 1798 - May 14, 1800 | > 5.Physician General of Hospitals: April 7, 1777 - July 21, 1780 | > 6.Post Chaplain: July 28, 1866 - February 2, 1901 | > 7.Post Commissary Se ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221/20 "2023-07-19T02:09:30Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Not saying you are wrong, but this is from [military.com](http://military.com), a web site where I would have thought they knew about such: You might think that, but [military.com](http://military.com) has no affiliation with the Department of Defense or any of the individual service Departments, like the Department of the Army. They’re a military-oriented organ of the [Monster.com](http://Monster.com) headhunting organization. As such, if their “journalism” department is running a little short of subject matter expertise, it wouldn’t make any real difference to them. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/american-soldier-crosses-into-north-korea/987221.md?page=2)