# Americans Condone Rape of Iraqi Children **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 17, 2004, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630 "2004-07-17T22:34:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Equipoise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/equipoise/32/151_2.png) [@Equipoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Equipoise)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2004, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/141 "2004-07-23T01:45:13Z")
Thanks for the title change Lynn! ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/142 "2004-07-24T06:24:38Z")
I said I was taking a break and I did. I was hoping for an apology. There isn’t. So: When a poster is pissed because threads are made - over and over again - about non-confirmed rapes and then gets accused of condoning goddam _child_-rape, the lovely posters around here just let the thread die, right? Those children in Iraq haven’t got a _childhood_ anymore. They’ve grown up hating people. No malls, math-tests and hanging out with friends for them. And now they’re getting dragged in this stinking thread because someone likes to post sex-threads. And the rest of you are all too eager to hop on this wreck because you don’t CARE how these children grow up, huh. Shame on you. Shame on you using ‘children’ to get your kicks. I’m reasonably sure most of the posters are mere highschool kids themselves. Feeling pretty important they’ve found something on the internet about _SEX_! But I thought **Diogenes the Cynic** is a father himself? Double shame on you. How can you use kids like this? You make me nauseous. **Equipoise** is right about this: I curse and swear when I’m angry. I’m still angry. So: Stifle yourselves, you sanctimonious shitheads and don’t ever jerk off over the heads of kids again. _[nota bene: There still isn’t anything in the news about this. You’d think the BBC news would be the first to publish this - considering their thoughts about anything American. But there isn’t. All the more reason for me to think this thread was merely made for sensation. No matter if kids are used for that, right?]_ ---
**Author:** ![Equipoise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/equipoise/32/151_2.png) [@Equipoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Equipoise)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/143 "2004-07-24T06:54:14Z")
> [@gum](#): > > I said I was taking a break and I did. > I was hoping for an apology. There isn’t. > > So: When a poster is pissed because threads are made - over and over again - > about non-confirmed rapes and then gets accused of condoning goddam _child_-rape, the lovely posters around here just let the thread die, right? > > Those children in Iraq haven’t got a _childhood_ anymore. > They’ve grown up hating people. No malls, math-tests and hanging out with friends for them. > And now they’re getting dragged in this stinking thread because someone likes > to post sex-threads. > And the rest of you are all too eager to hop on this wreck because you don’t CARE > how these children grow up, huh. > > Shame on you. > Shame on you using ‘children’ to get your kicks. > > I’m reasonably sure most of the posters are mere highschool kids themselves. > Feeling pretty important they’ve found something on the internet about _SEX_! > But I thought **Diogenes the Cynic** is a father himself? > Double shame on you. How can you use kids like this? You make me nauseous. What the FUCK are you going on about??? We were talking about this because we CARE ABOUT THE CHILDREN OF IRAQ you idiot! People (ok, some people, me included) tried to give you the benefit of the doubt, but you’re just being weird to be weird. > [@gum](#): > > **Equipoise** is right about this: I curse and swear when I’m angry. > I’m still angry. So: Stifle yourselves, you sanctimonious shitheads and don’t ever > jerk off over the heads of kids again. So, when the story comes out, we’re not supposed to talk about it any more otherwise we’re sexually abusing the kids ourselves?? That makes no sense. > [@gum](#): > > _[nota bene: There still isn’t anything in the news about this. You’d think the BBC news would be the first to publish this - considering their thoughts about anything American. > But there isn’t. > All the more reason for me to think this thread was merely made for sensation. > No matter if kids are used for that, right?]_ Jesus, investigations are still underway. WHEN this starts getting actual news coverage, I assume you’ll come back in and apologise for insulting everyone who cares about this issue? ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/144 "2004-07-24T07:31:37Z")
> [@gum](#): > > Those children in Iraq haven’t got a _childhood_ anymore. > They’ve grown up hating people. No malls, math-tests and hanging out with friends for them. > And now they’re getting dragged in this stinking thread because someone likes > to post sex-threads. > And the rest of you are all too eager to hop on this wreck because you don’t CARE > how these children grow up, huh. > > Shame on you. > Shame on you using ‘children’ to get your kicks. > > I’m reasonably sure most of the posters are mere highschool kids themselves. > Feeling pretty important they’ve found something on the internet about _SEX_! > But I thought **Diogenes the Cynic** is a father himself? > Double shame on you. How can you use kids like this? You make me nauseous. > > - Let me get this straight. You are upset that the posters to this thread have ‘used’ those ‘children’ to get their kicks? You’re upset because those kids got dragged into this thread? Is that what you meant by the quoted remarks? ---
**Author:** ![Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f04885/32.png) [@Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ninja_Pizza_Guy)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/145 "2004-07-24T08:05:59Z")
Well, this went longer than I’d anticipated. > [@gum](#): > > I said I was taking a break and I did. > I was hoping for an apology. There isn’t. So what exactly do you want an apology for? For people not understanding this gem of yours? > [@gum](#): > > [\*Sadly, ‘children’ in a different form than kids in war-free countries , imho. Not kids who listen to the latest rap, buying new Nikes at the mall and worry how their math test went. > But ‘children’ who are raised in a war and are capable of blowing up tanks, the enemy and themselves] Hell, **I** still don’t understand what you’re trying to say here. What does it matter if they’re in a wor-torn country or not, or if they can blow up tanks or not? **They still should not be getting raped. _No one_ should be getting raped.** I don’t care if they’re living in the Fairy Land of Eternal Peace or in the main Al-Queda command bunker, no one should be raped. I’ll repeat that, because it might be meaningful: **no one should be raped.** Of course, that’s just **my** opinion, but one I feel I share with many people. Now, no one has said that anyone **should** be raped, at least not that I’ve seen. Your little non-sequitor is certainly confusing. Was there a point to it? The way you’d written it, it implied that **these** kids, the ones who knew how to blow up tanks and stuff, were being separated from the **other** kids, the “should not be raped” kids. Not what you meant? Then you should write better. > [@gum](#): > > So: When a poster is pissed because threads are made - over and over again - about non-confirmed rapes and then gets accused of condoning goddam _child_-rape, the lovely posters around here just let the thread die, right? A poster who was interested in something like, say, fighting ignorance, might have actually tried to explain what the fuck they meant instead of getting pissy because people don’t understand what the fuck they’re saying. > [@gum](#): > > Those children in Iraq haven’t got a _childhood_ anymore. Does this mean that they’re not children anymore? If so, what are they, then? If not, what’s the point of repeatedly dragging it in/bringing it up? > [@gum](#): > > They’ve grown up hating people. No malls, math-tests and hanging out with friends for them. > And now they’re getting dragged in this stinking thread because someone likes > to post sex-threads. > And the rest of you are all too eager to hop on this wreck because you don’t CARE > how these children grow up, huh. Oh, yeah, blaming the current administration about not making sure children (or whatever you think they are) don’t get raped is “posting sex-threads”. And we care so little about them that we’re pissed off that **any** of them have been raped. > [@gum](#): > > Shame on you. > Shame on you using ‘children’ to get your kicks. How about _shame on **you** _ for trying to use the “think about the children” on us? Just who do you think is getting kicks from kids being raped? If you accused me of this to my face, the only thing that’d save you from getting your face beat in is the fact that I’m a grownup, with control of my temper. A state you may wish to emulate someday. > [@gum](#): > > I’m reasonably sure most of the posters are mere highschool kids themselves. Oh, of course, because only a child would dare disagree with you. :wally > [@gum](#): > > Feeling pretty important they’ve found something on the internet about _SEX_! > But I thought **Diogenes the Cynic** is a father himself? > Double shame on you. How can you use kids like this? You make me nauseous. Besides the rapists (for the obvious) and you (in your attempt to gain some sort of moral higher ground), just who else is using these kids? Nauseous? At people who disagree with you? Tell you what, I’m feeling nauseous at **you** , for having the gall to tell us that since we don’t agree with you, we’re getting off on kids being raped. > [@gum](#): > > **Equipoise** is right about this: I curse and swear when I’m angry. > I’m still angry. So: Stifle yourselves, you sanctimonious shitheads and don’t ever > jerk off over the heads of kids again. Or what? You’ll curse some more? Color me scared. I don’t think I’ll stifle myself just because you’re a piss-poor communicator with an over-sized ego. > [@](#): > > _[nota bene: There still isn’t anything in the news about this. You’d think the BBC news would be the first to publish this - considering their thoughts about anything American. > But there isn’t. > All the more reason for me to think this thread was merely made for sensation. > No matter if kids are used for that, right?]_ Of course. None of us would **ever** be upset at the thought that a child was being raped. You fucking :wally ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/146 "2004-07-24T15:02:21Z")
Jesus Christ, **Gum** , do you really think any one is getting off on this story? Are you fucking kidding me? Yes, I’m a father, you asshole, and that’s why it enrages to me to find out that US soldiers made kiddy rape videos for their own amusement in the tax payer dime. That’s something that needs to be talked about, not ignored. The story HAS been directly and indirectly confirmed from a number of credible sources. It is legitimately outrageous and disheartening to Americans. If you are honestly accusing me or or anyone else of deriving any prurient kicks from this story then you’re either engaging in a vicious _ad homonem_ to squelch a discussion you don’t like or you’re projecting like a fucking IMAX. If you brought up the “war children” thing to illustrate their victimhhod- that these kids have already had their childhoods stolen from them (thanks to GWB, I might add) and that their sexual abuse is only one more thing- something akin to “those poor kids have it bad enough without adding rape to their biographies,” then I would agree with you, but you were very unclear in how you phrased it and virtually everyone who has posted subsequent to those comments thought you were trying to mitigate the rapes somehow. You had many opportunities and direct requests to exlain your comments (well, not from me, I admit. I jumped your shit pretty fast) so act like such a martyr if you’re not willing to clearly explain what you mean. ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/147 "2004-07-24T16:29:51Z")
**Spooje** said it best, though more polite than I would: Originally posted by **Spooje** > [@](#): > > \*Let me get this straight. You are upset that the posters to this thread have ‘used’ those ‘children’ to get their kicks? You’re upset because those kids got dragged into this thread? > > Is that what you meant by the quoted remarks?\* Yes. Upset is an understatement, though. I’m disgusted and furious. Originally posted by **Diogenes the Cynic** > [@](#): > > _those poor kids have it bad enough without adding rape to their biographies_ Indeed. You finally got it. And I don’t know what the _fuck_ you’re all doing in this thread. _Unless_ you get some sick satisfaction reading about kids being abused. I’m not a martyr. I don’t give a flying fuck what you think of me. Just be sure of one thing: \*I’m \* not the one posting shit like this. We have some magazines here, in the Netherlands, that publish rancid stories like this. I won’t read them. Nor am I particulary amused to read them here. But that isn’t what get’s my gall. To be called a condoner of child-abuse is the final drop. I suggest you all have fun, using kids for your amusement. I’m out of here. Yes, I know: I won’t let the door hit my ass. ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/148 "2004-07-24T16:36:03Z")
See no evil Hear no evil Speak no evil Then maybe evil will go away, **Gum**? I don´t think so. ---
**Author:** ![Equipoise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/equipoise/32/151_2.png) [@Equipoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Equipoise)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/149 "2004-07-24T16:43:24Z")
Ok, nobody’s that stupid. Are they? If gum were in America I’d think he was a tighty-righty, looking to stir up trouble or laying the base for future charges (“those lefties were into CHILD RAPE!!”). Since he’s not, I’m confused all to hell. I guess we’re not supposed to care about the children. I guess that in gum’s world, to even _talk_ about sexual abuse, even while condeming it, is as bad as abusing someone ourselves. That it should never be talked about, that such dirty secrets should always be kept buried and never ever ever ever talked about, even to try to stop it and/or bring the perps to justice. Or…something. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/150 "2004-07-24T16:54:23Z")
Wow. People who condemn rape do it for personal gratification and titillation. I wonder why _I_ never thought of that? Oh, right-- it’s because I’m not a hysteric with a ridiculously misplaced sense of righteous indignation. Anyway, bye-bye, ya loon. What were we talking about, again? ---
**Author:** ![erislover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71e660/32.png) [@erislover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erislover)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/151 "2004-07-24T17:03:38Z")
That core almost went critical. :wally ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/152 "2004-07-24T18:23:01Z")
Well, wrong again. Thought **Gum** ’s problem derived from an inadequate understanding of the American English idiom. “Idiom” was close, just one letter off. ---
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2004, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/153 "2004-07-24T18:27:07Z")
why would anyone be suprised? Rape and abuse are very common throughout the history of war. Why are hired killers supposed to be a moral standard? I expect a lower threshold from mercenaries. I for one never believed the romantic bullshit about “our men and women in uniform, fighting for our freedom” and all the dewey eyed rhetoric that was supposed to make this into a “good” war instead of a flat-out invasion. Frankly, I’m so cynical, I wasn’t a bit surprised by anything that’s come to light except I was pleasantly surprised that people were mad about it. I don’t have anything against specific soldiers… but I don’t believe the “few bad apples” myth either. ---
**Author:** ![Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f04885/32.png) [@Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ninja_Pizza_Guy)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2004, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/154 "2004-07-25T04:27:39Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > What were we talking about, again? Well, I **thought** we were talking about how rape is bad and all that, and how rape of children is even worse, but I guess I was wrong. We were, apparently, talking about how great raping children is. I must be incredibly stupid not to have realized that “rape is bad” actually means “rape more children for our tittilation!” ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2004, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/155 "2004-07-25T04:51:28Z")
> [@gum](#): > > **Spooje** said it best, though more polite than I would: Originally posted by **Spooje** Yes. Upset is an understatement, though. I’m disgusted and furious. I hope you take this in the spirit in which it is intended. I believe you misjudged the motivations of the posters. They are not posting for fun or other prurient interests. They believe that these atrocities happen due to the apathy of the populace. That it is only through a very _demonstrable_ outrage that we can ensure violaters are brought to justice and the culture that allowed these mosters to operate is destroyed. The demonstration of this outrage requires that there be much discussion on this topic, because there are people unwilling to believe that this kind of thing can happen. And it is that very unwillingness to belive, in the face of evidence, that the monsters are counting on. Yes, it is disgusting. But it is necessary if we want the atrocities to stop. ---
**Author:** ![LilShieste](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9f8e36/32.png) [@LilShieste](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LilShieste)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630/156 "2004-07-26T03:29:02Z")
> [@gum](#): > > Indeed. You finally got it. Whew, thank God that mess finally cleared up. > [@gum](#): > > And I don’t know what the fuck you’re all doing in this thread. Unless you get some sick satisfaction reading about kids being abused. Well damn. I forgot there was more to clean up… **gum** , I don’t understand how you can accuse the posters in this thread of “getting off” on this topic simply because they are posting to it, when you yourself are posting to it (and thus had to have read it to begin with… that would be like some other poster saying to you “You sicko! Why the hell did you even look at this thread if you knew it was about raping children?!”) I don’t think anyone in this thread gets _any_ kind of satisfaction from even the _thought_ of this kind of thing happening. I don’t see why you are trying to alienate the rest of us from you. We do agree that rape=bad, so I don’t see where the problem is coming from. > [@skutir](#): > > Why are hired killers supposed to be a moral standard? I expect a lower threshold from mercenaries. I for one never believed the romantic bullshit about “our men and women in uniform, fighting for our freedom” and all the dewey eyed rhetoric that was supposed to make this into a “good” war instead of a flat-out invasion. I think I see what you’re saying, **skutir** , but I _do_ think that there are (or at least should be) moral standards even for “hired killers”/soldiers/whatever. I also kind of look at war with a “do what you gotta do” perspective, and raping doesn’t really strike me as something that needs to be done (not that I’m all for killing, but you know what I mean… and I’m not insinuating that you believe that rape is necessary, I am just making a point). LilShieste [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-condone-rape-of-iraqi-children/255630.md?page=7)