# Americans Spend $34 Billion on "Alternative Medicines" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 2, 2009, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101 "2009-08-02T23:53:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2009, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/1 "2009-08-02T23:53:04Z")
…what does this say about the average American’s intelligence? Was P.T. Barnum right? I was wondering…since people blow all of this money on homeopathic “medicines”, herbal remedies, and eveb more bizarre therapies (like coffee enemas for cancer), and each of these quack cures carries a disclaimer “not intended to diagnose or treat any disease”, why do people accept these totally unproven remedies? Is it because most people didn’t take HS science? What is going on here?:smack: ---
**Author:** ![Rolken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df788c/32.png) [@Rolken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rolken)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/2 "2009-08-03T00:00:52Z")
Hope springs eternal. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/3 "2009-08-03T00:16:55Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > ..what does this say about the average American’s intelligence? Was P.T. Barnum right? I was wondering..since people blow all of this money on homeopathic “medicines”, herbal remedies, and eveb more bizarre therapies (like coffee enemas for cancer), and each of these quack cures carries a disclaimer “not intended to diagnose or treat any disease”, why do people accept these totally unproven remedies? > Is it because most people didn’t take HS science? > What is going on here?:smack: It bespeaks the unaffordability of modern medicine in America. And, of course, their suffering & desperation. Next question. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/4 "2009-08-03T00:17:19Z")
I wonder how much it was before the industry got Orrin Hatch in their pocket. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/5 "2009-08-03T00:21:30Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > It bespeaks the unaffordability of modern medicine in America. > And, of course, their suffering & desperation. > Next question. It’s just as bad in Eurpope and Asia, probably worse. The drugstores in Europe are full of homeopathic remedies. In Asia there are all sorts of traditional cures. Some of them probably work, but many are not only nonsense but lead to the slaughter of bears, tigers, and rhinos for their body parts. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/6 "2009-08-03T00:31:33Z")
This embrace of “alternative medicine” is due to a lot of things. One is magical thinking, of the kind that wants to embrace a single fundamental cause of all illness (the one(s) that THEY don’t want you to know) and leads to the belief that eliminating “toxins” or taking glyconutrients or eliminating parasites will make them well and happy. Many suffer from chronic conditions that mainstream medicine can alleviate, but not yet prevent or cure. Alt med promises cures. Some people have had bad experiences with the health care system, see alt med as a cheaper way to treat themselves, want to “take control”, or have bought into philosophies and religions that are at odds with mainstream medicine. And yes, many people are unaware of or wilfully disbelieve in the scientific method and lack critical thinking skills, thus are easy prey for quacks and scam artists. Most of that $34 billion spent on alternative remedies is straight down the rathole of wasted time and money. The dream of the practitioners and many patients is for all those billions to come out of the pockets of all Americans through universal health care. If the supplement industry and practitioner lobbyists together with facilitators like Senators Orrin Hatch and Tom Harkin have their way, that’s what will happen. ---
**Author:** ![AdmiralCrunch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6f9a4e/32.png) [@AdmiralCrunch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AdmiralCrunch)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/7 "2009-08-03T00:40:56Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > It bespeaks the unaffordability of modern medicine in America. > And, of course, their suffering & desperation. > Next question. Yeah, last year when copper prices were so high a lot of people started wiring up their houses with kudzu and snakeskin. Price is certainly a factor, but people wouldn’t be buying this crap if they knew it didn’t work. Doctors and the medical community, like most experts, aren’t really effective at convincing the general public that their expertise is better than folk wisdom and gut feelings. Plus it’s _natural_ to shoot coffee up your ass. ---
**Author:** ![Chief\_Pedant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@Chief\_Pedant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chief_Pedant)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/8 "2009-08-03T00:41:34Z")
Consider the market for bottled water over ordinary potable water…we are curious beings when it comes to deciding what is good for our health. We not only grasp at alternative straws; in the case of bottled water we pay for straws which are probably harmful for us and definitely harmful for the earth. The alternative medicine market will only grow, driven in part by the fact that mainline medicine–while increasingly effective–is also increasingly dangerous. And I have long since given up on addressing public gullibility. ---
**Author:** ![Markxxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5daacb/32.png) [@Markxxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Markxxx)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/9 "2009-08-03T01:03:31Z")
They are especially attractive if you don’t have health insurance. For instance, I used to take albuterol for my asthma, not much one inhaler lasted me a year over even more. But then the US banned CFC and now there is no more generic albuterol. So instead of paying $9.00 for an inahler I would have to pay $54.00 because the new inhalers don’t use CFC and are patented. Now there are a lot of ways of getting around this but if you’re not savvy you might turn to natural meds. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/10 "2009-08-03T01:05:27Z")
Besides other reasons, I think it’s because the government refuses to crack down on it. Since the FDA isn’t squashing these people, I think that a lot of people assume that “alternative medicine” must be more than the fraud that it is. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/11 "2009-08-03T01:10:35Z")
Fold into the mix Big Pharmaceutical and its total lack of good PR, the alarmist news media, and the odd “miracle” and people will try something other than what the Government wants. ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/12 "2009-08-03T01:39:14Z")
A society that loses its original religion will try to fill the gap with a faith in something else. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/13 "2009-08-03T01:43:21Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Besides other reasons, I think it’s because the government refuses to crack down on it. Since the FDA isn’t squashing these people, I think that a lot of people assume that “alternative medicine” must be more than the fraud that it is. One of the problems with cracking down on alternative medicine is it feeds into the part of the fantasy that “they” don’t want you to know about A.M. What would help if more people learned to think critically and see through the BS. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/14 "2009-08-03T01:47:19Z")
> [@athelas](#): > > A society that loses its original religion will try to fill the gap with a faith in something else. Except that America _ **hasn’t** _ lost it’s “original religion”, unfortunately. > [@runner pat](#): > > One of the problems with cracking down on alternative medicine is it feeds into the part of the fantasy that “they” don’t want you to know about A.M. True. But at least it would warn off the people who don’t buy that theory. Or even if it’s considered unwise/illegal to actually forbid it, a media campaign could help. It’s helped cut back on smoking, after all. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/15 "2009-08-03T01:56:46Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > True. But at least it would warn off the people who don’t buy that theory. Or even if it’s considered unwise/illegal to actually forbid it, a media campaign could help. It’s helped cut back on smoking, after all. The media is just too stupid. They believe this kind of crap themselves. Not only that, but they always want to give “both sides”. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/16 "2009-08-03T02:04:49Z")
Um…you guys do know that there’s a capsule that can make a man larger, don’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/17 "2009-08-03T02:18:34Z")
Another factor in the alt med circus is a general rejection of “experts” in favor of the salt-of-the-earth man/woman of the people who knows more than all those fancy-pants snooty types with education and degrees and such. Who needs a dentist to help make your teeth whiter? Just follow the banner ad link and learn how a “mom” discovered the white teeth secret. Immunologists and pediatric infectious disease specialists, bah. Jenny McCarthy puts them in their place. And we don’t need no steenkin’ foreign policy experts to deal with other nations. Sarah Palin can see Russia from her back door. When it comes to medicine, the Internet has made it easier to pick up lots of information. The problem is discriminating between reliable sources and those that are invalid/flaky/malicious. The educational system doesn’t prepare us to know the difference, and too many will happily settle for whoever shouts the loudest or is slickest at confirming our prejudices. > [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Um…you guys do know that there’s a capsule that can make a man larger, don’t you? If you check the fine print, the part that gets bigger is your butt. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/18 "2009-08-03T03:44:58Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > ..what does this say about the average American’s intelligence? Was P.T. Barnum right? I was wondering..since people blow all of this money on homeopathic “medicines”, herbal remedies, and eveb more bizarre therapies (like coffee enemas for cancer), and each of these quack cures carries a disclaimer “not intended to diagnose or treat any disease”, why do people accept these totally unproven remedies? > Is it because most people didn’t take HS science? Here’s another question. Why do people assume that drugs which _are_ approved by the FDA somehow _are_ backed by legitimate science? Or put another way, how much do you actually know about the process by which the FDA studies drugs? Do you know that the actual clinical trials are conducted not by the FDA, but rather by doctors who often have a financial interest in the outcome? Do you know that companies can do multiple trials on a drug and report only the positive outcomes while ignoring the negative outcomes, even if most of the trials have negative outcomes? > [@](#): > > Many drugs that are assumed to be effective are probably little better than placebos, but there is no way to know because negative results are hidden. One clue was provided six years ago by four researchers who, using the Freedom of Information Act, obtained FDA reviews of every placebo-controlled clinical trial submitted for initial approval of the six most widely used antidepressant drugs approved between 1987 and 1999—Prozac, Paxil, Zoloft, Celexa, Serzone, and Effexor.[10] They found that on average, placebos were 80 percent as effective as the drugs. The difference between drug and placebo was so small that it was unlikely to be of any clinical significance. The results were much the same for all six drugs: all were equally ineffective. But because favorable results were published and unfavorable results buried (in this case, within the FDA), the public and the medical profession believed these drugs were potent antidepressants. > > Clinical trials are also biased through designs for research that are chosen to yield favorable results for sponsors. For example, the sponsor’s drug may be compared with another drug administered at a dose so low that the sponsor’s drug looks more powerful. Or a drug that is likely to be used by older people will be tested in young people, so that side effects are less likely to emerge. A common form of bias stems from the standard practice of comparing a new drug with a placebo, when the relevant question is how it compares with an existing drug. In short, it is often possible to make clinical trials come out pretty much any way you want, which is why it’s so important that investigators be truly disinterested in the outcome of their work. > > Conflicts of interest affect more than research. They also directly shape the way medicine is practiced, through their influence on practice guidelines issued by professional and governmental bodies, and through their effects on FDA decisions. A few examples: in a survey of two hundred expert panels that issued practice guidelines, one third of the panel members acknowledged that they had some financial interest in the drugs they considered.[11] In 2004, after the National Cholesterol Education Program called for sharply lowering the desired levels of “bad” cholesterol, it was revealed that eight of nine members of the panel writing the recommendations had financial ties to the makers of cholesterol-lowering drugs.[12] Of the 170 contributors to the most recent edition of the American Psychiatric Association’s Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), ninety-five had financial ties to drug companies, including all of the contributors to the sections on mood disorders and schizophrenia.[13] Perhaps most important, many members of the standing committees of experts that advise the FDA on drug approvals also have financial ties to the pharmaceutical industry.[14] > … > Melody Petersen, who was a reporter for The New York Times, has written a broad, convincing indictment of the pharmaceutical industry.[16] She lays out in detail the many ways, both legal and illegal, that drug companies can create “blockbusters” (drugs with yearly sales of over a billion dollars) and the essential role that KOLs play. Her main example is Neurontin, which was initially approved only for a very narrow use—to treat epilepsy when other drugs failed to control seizures. By paying academic experts to put their names on articles extolling Neurontin for other uses—bipolar disease, post-traumatic stress disorder, insomnia, restless legs syndrome, hot flashes, migraines, tension headaches, and more—and by funding conferences at which these uses were promoted, the manufacturer was able to parlay the drug into a blockbuster, with sales of $2.7 billion in 2003. The following year, in a case covered extensively by Petersen for the Times, Pfizer pleaded guilty to illegal marketing and agreed to pay $430 million to resolve the criminal and civil charges against it. A lot of money, but for Pfizer, it was just the cost of doing business, and well worth it because Neurontin continued to be used like an all-purpose tonic, generating billions of dollars in annual sales. [(From here.)](http://www.nybooks.com/articles/22237) ---
**Author:** ![sleeping](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/839c29/32.png) [@sleeping](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleeping)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/19 "2009-08-03T03:52:30Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > Why do people assume that drugs which _are_ approved by the FDA somehow _are_ backed by legitimate science? … Great point, **ITR**. Also, how are we defining “alternative medicine”? If you’re talking about stuff like homeopathy, I’m with you. But there are also many substances that are not part of the formulary of any health insurance plan, yet have been found to be effective in clinical trials. And, drugs that are not being promoted by Big Pharma are less likely to undergo clinical testing, and therefore less likely to have such certificates of legitimacy. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2009, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101/20 "2009-08-03T04:11:53Z")
But medicines pushed by big Phrauda are what is costing Americans $34B a year, not someone using cinnamon to control blood sugar. (Which, BTW, is dangerous if you use cassia cinammon because it contains the natural blood thninner coumarin.) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americans-spend-34-billion-on-alternative-medicines/505101.md?page=2)