# America's fear of terrorism is mostly irrational xenophobia **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 18, 2016, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499 "2016-01-18T14:30:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2016, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/141 "2016-01-22T19:01:49Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > You must never have taken drivers ed, since when I did we watched Signal 30, showing horrible flaming deaths in cars. Which I’d expect are far more frequent than horrible flaming deaths in airplanes. > Not to mention that the guy controlling your airplane is a highly trained veteran with plane maintenance done by other highly trained people, while even if you are a good driver you have to worry about drunk teenagers driving on Kojaks. > So, fearing flying more than driving is irrational. We’re are not talking whether or not one should compare fears and pick the ones that happen most- we are talking whether or not a fear of dying in a plane crash is irrational. It’s not. Now if if keep you from flying or you have to be heavily medicated or something, then sure. But being “somewhat” worried? Nope, that’s OK by me, and not irrational. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2016, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/142 "2016-01-22T22:16:50Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > In other words, you agree with the OP? (for historic reference) > [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > According to [Gallup](http://www.gallup.com/poll/4909/terrorism-united-states.aspx), 51% of US adults are very or somewhat worried that they or their family will become a victim of terrorism. It is clear that most of the respondents implicitly understood this to be foreign terrorism, since the principal solutions they supported were changes to immigration visas and bombing. It is wildly irrational to actively worry that you or your family will be a victim of terrorism. There are a thousand more likely ways for them to die, including by other sources of violence. The chances are similar to being struck by lightning. Or dying because of a piece of furniture falls on you. > > So the question is why does terrorism get such undue concern? One possible explanation is [availability](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Availability_heuristic) bias. But that’s probably not it. Far more people fear foreign terrorism than domestic mass shooting, for [example](http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/12/17/poll-watch-americans-fear-more-terrorist-attacks-but-have-mixed-views-on-gun-control/), and the only difference there is foreign-ness. > > I think the best explanation for the evidence is that humans, generally speaking, are hard-wired to fear foreigners. The more different and exotic they are, the more they are feared. We get much more upset when a foreigner kills someone from our tribe than when a snake does, or lightning does, or one of us does. In the modern world, there is no rational basis for that fear. > > This truth has lots of consequences for our politics and our policy, which might be interesting to debate, but I’ll leave the OP at this basic premise. Looking at the OP’s linked poll I notice that there are 5 choices. - Very worried 19% - Somewhat worried 32% - Not too worried 28% - Not worried at all 20% - Know a victim (vol.) – - No opinion 1% So who’s worried? 51% are very or somewhat worried but 79% are worried to some degree. It is not clear that most of the respondents implicitly understood this poll to be about foreign terrorism instead of terrorism in general. Besides changes to immigration visas, respondents were asked about banning gun sales to those on the no-fly list, passing new laws making it harder to buy assault weapons, and requiring U.S. Muslims to carry a special ID. “Terrorism” seems to mean terrorism in general. The OP asks why terrorism gets such “undue” concern. “Undue” according to who? 79% of the respondents are worried about terrorism to some extent. The majority of people are worried about terrorism. Is the vast majority “irrational”, or are those who are not worried at all being irrational? IMHO, both sides believe that their views are rational. It’s the Muslims who have the PR problem. I believe it’s up to Muslims to make the effort to calm the fears of others. Of course, you can assist them but they should shoulder most of the load. IMHO, of course. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2016, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/143 "2016-01-22T22:19:08Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > Then of course those hudnreds of Nazi chrisitians divisions must effect how people view the christians today… and too those fun loving Christian palestinian terrorists also must effect how we view the Christians. The crime of Groupe identity. Are you attempting to justify terrorism? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2016, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/144 "2016-01-22T22:36:51Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > Well the “ISIS, Al Qaeda, those fun-loving Palestinians” and the aryan nations, and almost all other domestic terrorists are almost exclusively Caucasian. Why is there no call to stop all Caucasian immigration or violent attacks against them…oh ya because the bigotry against people who happen to be muslim. > > The ONLY reason for this is because they happen to be one revision newer on a common thread of abrahamic religion. > > This xenophobia is not rational it is purely based in a bigoted categorization of individuals similar to the hate of other groups which will dilute the white european historical majority in this country. > > We do not see the same response to massive terrorist attacks from white christians despite the reality that those plots and attacks are just as common. You’re entitled to your opinion. As I understand it, xenophobia works both ways. Radical, fanatical Muslims are calling for the deaths of foreigners because they have different customs and different religions. :eek: _ **xenophobia** noun uk /ˌzen.əˈfəʊ.bi.ə/ us /-ˈfoʊ-/ -extreme ​dislike or ​fear of ​foreigners, ​their ​customs, ​their ​religions, etc._ Do you consider all zenophobia to be irrational or just the zenophobia of one side? \ ***rational** adjective uk us /ˈræʃ.ən.əl/ -​based on ​clear ​thought and ​reason: There must be some rational ​explanation for what ​happened. a rational ​act/​course of ​action a rational ​argument/​decision He was too ​upset to be rational.\* > **[rational](https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/rational)** > > 1. based on clear thought and reason: 2. based on clear thought and reason… \ ***irrational** adjective uk us /ɪˈræʃ.ən.əl/ -not using ​reason or ​clear ​thinking: It’s ​totally irrational, but I’m ​frightened of ​mice. His ​parents were ​worried by his ​increasingly irrational ​behaviour.\* > **[irrational](https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/irrational)** > > 1. not using reason or clear thinking: 2. not using reason or clear thinking… ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2016, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/145 "2016-01-22T23:27:21Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Radical, fanatical Muslims are calling for the deaths of foreigners because they have different customs and different religions. Most of us, however, recognize that radical fanaticism exists only among a tiny minority – on both sides – and we don’t wish to be defined by them, either as radical Muslims or as radical Islamophobes. You, apparently, have no problem with either characterization. Since the characterization is not supported by evidence, it’s not rational. Go check your dictionary again. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2016, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/146 "2016-01-22T23:57:34Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Most of us, however, recognize that radical fanaticism exists only among a tiny minority – on both sides – and we don’t wish to be defined by them, either as radical Muslims or as radical Islamophobes. You, apparently, have no problem with either characterization. Since the characterization is not supported by evidence, it’s not rational. Go check your dictionary again. It looks like it’s the xenophobic Muslims who are responsible for the anti-Muslim xenophobia in the West, in Europe, in the U.S.A., in the Middle East, and in Asia. Hopefully, the rest of the Muslims, the non-xenophobic Muslims, can do something to end the xenophobia on both sides. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2016, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/147 "2016-01-23T00:35:30Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > It looks like it’s the xenophobic Muslims who are responsible for the anti-Muslim xenophobia in the West, in Europe, in the U.S.A., in the Middle East, and in Asia. > > Hopefully, the rest of the Muslims, the non-xenophobic Muslims, can do something to end the xenophobia on both sides. White guys shoot up movie theaters. If you go to the movies, do you require that white guys get patted down? Should people fear white guys? And should the good white guys do something about these movie patron hating white guys? When I go to the Afghan grocery to buy Naan I don’t need for them to tell me that they aren’t going to kill me or that they don’t have anything to do with the Taliban. They are just nice businessmen who bake great bread. Or should they put a “We’re against terrorism” sign in their window to assure you? ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2016, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/148 "2016-01-23T00:45:29Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Are you attempting to justify terrorism? How this makes any sense as a reply I can not see. But you appear to be attempting badly to justify gross religious prejudice and a deep ignorance of the history. ---
**Author:** ![JXJohns](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jxjohns/32/469_2.png) [@JXJohns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JXJohns)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2016, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/149 "2016-01-24T15:20:18Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > Context. Important stuff. It seems to me he is talking about the Aurora type shootings as mentioned in my cite. 62 in the last 30 years. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/150 "2016-01-25T06:33:49Z")
> [@JXJohns](#): > > It seems to me he is talking about the Aurora type shootings as mentioned in my cite. 62 in the last 30 years. Your interpretation is not supported either by the OP’s first mention of the specific issue of mass shootings: > [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > Far more people fear foreign terrorism than domestic mass shooting, for [example](http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/12/17/poll-watch-americans-fear-more-terrorist-attacks-but-have-mixed-views-on-gun-control/), and the only difference there is foreign-ness. Or indeed by Hank’s own references to the topic > [@Hank\_Beecher](#): > > That number is a result of a new, politically motivated, definitions intended to portray gun violence as an ever increasing threat. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/151 "2016-01-25T11:38:58Z")
The problem in the U.K. is that the three main political parties are guilty of misleading the public and in some cases telling outright lies all in the name of political correctness and diversity. As with all liars the truth will out, all the warnings from the right that were rubbished by Parliament are now being proved true. This has caused a break down in trust. Ordinary people know that there is an enemy within, mainly Asian and Muslim by religion but they do not know who they should fear so they end up distrusting all Muslims. Muslims do not help themselves, there are to many willing to make excuses and are in denial, there are not enough Muslims willing to stand up publically and say enough not in my name. The political parties in the U.K. have a great deal to answer for because it is thay who have created the distrust in the U.K. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/152 "2016-01-25T14:43:43Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > It’s the Muslims who have the PR problem. I believe it’s up to Muslims to make the effort to calm the fears of others. Of course, you can assist them but they should shoulder most of the load. IMHO, of course. If it’s a PR problem, then you agree with the OP. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/153 "2016-01-25T15:35:34Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > If it’s a PR problem, then you agree with the OP. I think we could safely say that Islam has one of the worst PR images possible 1,229 out of the 5,885 prisoners in high-security jails follow the Islamic faith The figure equates to 20% compared with 5% Muslim population in Britain At Whitemoor prison, Cambridgeshire, 44% of the 447 inmates are Muslim Some experts warns jails are ‘ripe’ to become extremist recruiting grounds By Steph Cockroft for MailOnline Published: 10:38, 25 January 2016 | Updated: 13:40, 25 January 2016 Read more: [Revealed: How one in five inmates in maximum security prisons is Muslim | Daily Mail Online](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3415435/How-one-five-inmates-maximum-security-prisons-Muslim.html#ixzz3yGjyghFK) Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook ISIS is planning more attacks on Europe, warn EU police Europe’s elite police force warns ISIS has a new ‘combat style capability’ Report said ISIS was preparing more attacks to be executed within the EU Europol said there was threat of both lone actor attacks as well as group Islamic State claimed responsibility for Paris attacks which left 130 killed By Alex Matthews For Mailonline Published: 14:34, 25 January 2016 | Updated: 14:48, 25 January 2016 Read more: [ISIS fanatics have set up secret camps INSIDE Europe | Daily Mail Online](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3415722/ISIS-planning-attacks-Europe-warn-EU-police.html#ixzz3yGm9lnQL) Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook ‘Soon in Champs Elysees’: Chilling threat of Paris terrorist brandishing head of man he has just decapitated in martyrdom video – before ISIS claim Britain will be next target ISIS have released a video showing the Paris attackers preparing in Syria The fighters are each shown beheading a prisoner and giving a speech Paris mastermind Abdelhamid Abaaoud calls for further attacks In one sickening moment, a fighter smiles after beheading prisoner and says: ‘Soon in Champs-Elysees’ The video ends with footage of London and threat of an attack in the UK For more of the latest ISIS news updates visit [ISIS: Latest news, breaking stories and comment | Daily Mail Online](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/isis) WARNING: GRAPHIC CONTENT By Tom Wyke for MailOnline Published: 21:00, 24 January 2016 | Updated: 12:24, 25 January 2016 Read more: [ISIS video shows Paris attackers carrying out beheadings | Daily Mail Online](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3414721/Shocking-martyrdom-video-emerges-ISIS-Paris-attackers-carrying-beheadings-threaten-massacres-West-make-clear-UK-target.html#ixzz3yGnjJsF6) Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook This is daily reading for a lot of people in the U.K. and it is understandable that people are showing great concern. We will continue with our lives we will not allow the threats to stop us. but the threat is still there and we know that there will be a attack and people will die and their race, creed and colour will not protect them. It is not irrational xenophobia it has become a fact of life. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/154 "2016-01-25T15:45:40Z")
First, we’re not talking about the UK. Secondly, nobody with half a brain takes anything in the Mail seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/155 "2016-01-25T15:50:21Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > I think we could safely say that Islam has one of the worst PR images possible > > 1,229 out of the 5,885 prisoners in high-security jails follow the Islamic faith > The figure equates to 20% compared with 5% Muslim population in Britain “People from poorest segments of society more prone to being jailed for crime” is not exactly a surprising statistic. And the reason Islam has such a PR image is because unfortunately a large number of people are stupid enough that they read papers such as the Daily Mail without critical examination of the narrative that its owners want to maintain. - For example when Lord Rothermere, owner of the Daily Mail, wrote a nice article in praise of Hitler ( [efp.org.uk](http://efp.org.uk/daily-mail-owner-praises-hitler/) ) ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/156 "2016-01-25T15:53:28Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > First, we’re not talking about the UK. Secondly, nobody with half a brain takes anything in the Mail seriously. “I urge all British young men and women to study closely the progress of the Nazi regime in Germany. They must not be misled by the misrepresentations of its opponents." ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/157 "2016-01-25T16:24:32Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > First, we’re not talking about the UK. Secondly, nobody with half a brain takes anything in the Mail seriously. I am talking about the U.K. because that is where I live. I believe it to be relevant and could show how public opinion in America could become anti Islamic ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/158 "2016-01-25T16:27:30Z")
“Become”? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/159 "2016-01-25T16:33:35Z")
> [@T.M](#): > > I am talking about the U.K. because that is where I live. I believe it to be relevant and could show how public opinion in America could become anti Islamic You are a splendid cautionary example. ---
**Author:** ![T.M](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ad7895/32.png) [@T.M](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/T.M)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2016, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499/160 "2016-01-25T17:02:48Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > “People from poorest segments of society more prone to being jailed for crime” is not exactly a surprising statistic. > > And the reason Islam has such a PR image is because unfortunately a large number of people are stupid enough that they read papers such as the Daily Mail without critical examination of the narrative that its owners want to maintain. > > - For example when Lord Rothermere, owner of the Daily Mail, wrote a nice article in praise of Hitler ( [efp.org.uk](http://efp.org.uk/daily-mail-owner-praises-hitler/) ) You should have read the article properly we are talking of hardened criminals who are in high security prisons for crimes such as murder, armed robbery, and terrorism, they are certainly not stealing to put bread on the table and your comments about the poorest segments of society is an insult to hardworking people on low pay and suffering hard times, they manage to get through life without robbing and killing. I cut and past the Daily Mail because they do not charge a subscription. The subjects in the daily Mail are also normally reported the same day or next day in the other national news papers and are also reported on BBC TV, Sky, ITV etc. The article you dredged up by Lord Rothermere was from 1930 at a time when many found Hitler to be both a charming and charismatic host. Germany had never recovered from their defeat in ww1, it was hoped that Hitler would get Germany back on their feet, we all know how the storey ended [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/americas-fear-of-terrorism-is-mostly-irrational-xenophobia/743499.md?page=9)