# Amtrak Train Southwest Chief has derailed near Kansas City: 2022-06-27 **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** breaking-news\ **Created:** [June 27, 2022, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990 "2022-06-27T19:59:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/41 "2022-06-29T08:46:35Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > We were just discussing this at the VR Flagstaff camera. The Southwest Chief for both directions scheduled to depart tomorrow have been cancelled. Huh. Well, maybe that explains why, when I got off my Amtrak yesterday at Chicago’s Union Station there was a person standing there with a sign and a speech saying “Anyone making a connection to the Southwest Chief please come with me”. In which case I know of a troop of boy scouts on their way to a camping trip in the Southwest may be disappointed or taking alternate transportation (one of them was my seatmate for part of the ride on the Lakeshore Limited). I’m told there’s a large boy scout camp that groups often go to by train, which might explain why there were boy scouts on the de-railed train. > [@WildaBeast](#): > > One picture I saw showed an axle from the truck just sitting near the tracks completely separate from the rest of the truck. It must have been quite an impact. _Any_ time a train hits something it’s “quite an impact”. My sister and brother-in-law say the news shortly before I got on a train to go back home. We’re all rational people but sis did want a few more travel updates than usual. > [@nelliebly](#): > > It never occurred to me the train could have derailed. Is it the size of the vehicle on the tracks that determines whether the train will derail, or are there other factors? I’m guessing multiple factors. For example, derails are more likely on curved than straight rails, but it doesn’t look like being on a turn/curve was a factor here. If an obstacle on the rails has little mass the train more or less goes through it with minimal consequences to the train (unfortunately, I have been present for such an incident - there were definitely consequences to the person on the track), so mass of the object hit is definitely a factor. So is speed, at that that point on the trip the Amtrak would have been going as fast as legally permitted so… 80 mph (so far as I know, that’s the max for most Amtrak routes, the exceptions being on the East Coast). That much mass going that speed is NOT going to stop on a dime, it’s a good example of “unstoppable force”. Even if the train cars can’t go forward they’re going to go _somewhere_ - that is, off the rails. > [@nearwildheaven](#): > > There are also small hospitals in nearby Macon and Moberly where they may be taking less severely injured people. I’m going to add that if anyone looks at news photos and thinks they may see Amish people, they are; there are sizable Amish and Mennonite communities in northern Missouri, and they use Amtrak extensively. I don’t think I’ve ever been on an Amtrak (and I’ve been riding them since the 1980’s) that didn’t have at least a few Amish passengers. > [@Munch](#): > > A good friend of mine was on the Southwest Chief westbound just a few days ago. Would this have been the exact same train? It’s the same route. It is unlikely that it would be all the exact same physical train _cars_. The Southwest Chief runs every day (well, except for circumstances like this - I expect that in addition to running an accident investigation they’ll also need to inspect the rails for damage and make any needed repairs - which from pictures looks like “re-lay the track along this stretch”, including re-grading the ballast and replacing damaged/torn up/twisted rails) but trains will be longer/shorter depending on how many passengers are on it for a given run, plus they need multiple “train sets” as @kenobi_65 put it to send out trains on that route with such regularity. > [@eschereal](#): > > The overhead image shows no discernable damage to the lead locomotive, but I cannot see anything of the dump truck. The only part of the dump truck I’ve seen in pictures is one of the axles, minus the rest of the truck. I expect there is damage to the lead engine even if it’s not obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 8:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/42 "2022-06-29T08:46:50Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > One of my sisters was on that train, and is now in the hospital with a collapsed lung, and a broken collarbone, ribs and hip. I’m glad she’s alive, but sorry she is hurt. I hope she makes a complete recovery as quickly as possible. Please keep us updated. I know sometimes in these threads we seem to dwell on the engineering and physics but it’s important to remember the people involved. Even minor train incidents/accidents can knock people off their feet, send luggage flying, etc. I can only imagine how violent and frightening this sort of accident is for the people on the train. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/43 "2022-06-29T15:29:10Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > In which case I know of a troop of boy scouts on their way to a camping trip in the Southwest may be disappointed or taking alternate transportation (one of them was my seatmate for part of the ride on the Lakeshore Limited). I’m told there’s a large boy scout camp that groups often go to by train, which might explain why there were boy scouts on the de-railed train. Yes, it’s the [Philmont Scout Ranch](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philmont_Scout_Ranch) in New Mexico. Last year when my brother rode on the SWC eastbound (among other Amtrak rides) there were a couple dozen scouts out of Los Angeles who got off at Raton to go there and likewise, a couple dozen got on to get dispersed to points east. Since according to Wiki the annual attendance is some 22,000 I doubt it’s even a majority of scouts going there, but it would be a cool way to get there. Amtrak is using a bus shuttle between Kansas City and La Plata to get around the gap. There are two trains shuttling from LAX to KCY but only one going back and forth from CHI and LAP. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/44 "2022-06-29T16:03:47Z")
Hoping KaylasAunt recovers fully & easily. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/45 "2022-06-29T17:16:06Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > Amtrak is using a bus shuttle between Kansas City and La Plata to get around the gap. There are two trains shuttling from LAX to KCY but only one going back and forth from CHI and LAP. Kansas City has some pretty big railyards. There must be a loop or a routing that allows them to turn the train around (I cannot spot it on the map). That makes it possible to do two runs along there. The other, single run must be set up double-ended because there is nowhere where a turn around could happen out in BF Missouri. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/46 "2022-06-29T18:57:16Z")
The other factor likely is that the distance from LAX to KCY is easily three times that between CHI and LAP. You’d need a couple trains to maintain even reduced service. However there are currently no SWCs on the eastern half and none scheduled to leave CHI today. OTOH, the western #3 left KCY 5 hours off the regular schedule and looks unlikely to make any of it up. [https://asm.transitdocs.com/](https://asm.transitdocs.com/) ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/47 "2022-06-29T23:11:46Z")
The train speed limit at that crossing is 90 MPH and it was going slightly under. That’s FAST. If you hit something things are not going to turn out well. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/48 "2022-06-30T15:14:33Z")
Latest news: > Service has been restored under mandatory slow order through the derailment area. #3 leaving CHI on July 2 is cancelled. #4 leaving LAX on July 4 is cancelled. I can only imagine the dispatchers’ hair in clumps on the floor as they try to break up a tremendous logjam that has resulted. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/49 "2022-06-30T20:36:01Z")
Yeah, it wouldn’t be just Amtrak - it would also be any freight that would normally use those rails, too. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/50 "2022-06-30T21:15:54Z")
Yeah, that would be 50 - 70 trains a day vs. 2 for Amtrak. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/51 "2022-06-30T21:37:48Z")
> [@dougrb](#): > > The train speed limit at that crossing is 90 MPH and it was going slightly under. That’s FAST. If you hit something things are not going to turn out well. They showed part of the NTSB press conference on the local (KC) evening news last night. The spokeswoman said the train sounded it’s horn a quarter mile from the crossing. I did some quick math and figured that was about 10 seconds. Not a whole lot of lead time for a fully loaded dump truck to get out of the way. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/52 "2022-06-30T22:00:27Z")
You have to wonder why the truck was _stopped_ on the tracks - because if it was moving it should have cleared the tracks in 10 seconds. But I await the report from actual experts using actual facts and evidence. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/53 "2022-06-30T22:20:29Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > You have to wonder why the truck was _stopped_ on the tracks - because if it was moving it should have cleared the tracks in 10 seconds. It’s also possible that the truck was indeed moving, but had started across the tracks after the engineer sounded the horn. The driver may not have heard the horn (and may not have looked for a train), or may have believed that he could beat the train across the tracks. ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/54 "2022-06-30T22:48:22Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > I did some quick math and figured that was about 10 seconds. Not a whole lot of lead time for a fully loaded dump truck to get out of the way. It was also mentioned that the crossing has a steep hill leading to it. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/55 "2022-06-30T23:02:39Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > > [@Broomstick](#): > > > > You have to wonder why the truck was _stopped_ on the tracks - because if it was moving it should have cleared the tracks in 10 seconds. > > It’s also possible that the truck was indeed moving, but had started across the tracks after the engineer sounded the horn. The driver may not have heard the horn (and may not have looked for a train), or may have believed that he could beat the train across the tracks. From what I’ve seen from the aerial photos, the road and tracks intersect at an angle. Depending on which direction the truck was traveling, the driver may have had to look over his shoulder to see the train approaching. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/56 "2022-06-30T23:30:19Z")
@kaylasdad99 Are there any updates on your sister? ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/57 "2022-06-30T23:57:16Z")
Now that you mention it, yes. From a family wide Facebook messenger post: Her pain is better today. They’re maintaining it around a 3 out of 10 which is good. Gets up to a 7 when she’s moving from the bed to the chair and back. She has now been transferred back and forth yesterday and today. They are doing a little bit of exercise with her left arm and her lower legs. So, no spinal cord injuries are apparent at this time, which is nice. We have been told she has a total of 15 fractures from the neck to the pelvis. The doctor will be bringing us a list outlining exactly where each fraction is. Eight of them are in her ribs. Her neck brace was removed for comfort and she does not have to wear it except while sleeping unless it makes her more comfortable. There is no intention to move her until she’s ready to go to rehab because there’s nothing that her home health care providers can do for her that isn’t being done in Missouri. Arrangements have already been made with rehab in Grand Rapids and they are prepared to take her in as soon as she is off IV pain medication. Her transportation will probably be via helicopter and Amtrak will fly our cousin and another sister to Grand Rapids to help with any transitions necessary. We’ve had visits from multiple Amtrak agents to check on her and assess her needs. They brought her new glasses and tablet and are seeing to all of my cousin’s and younger sister’s expenses. At this point the plan is to move Sis to GR when she’s ready for rehab. My cousin will go with her to be her caregiver. My sister was chatting with a young woman when the crash occurred, and the girl lost her spleen as a result of breaking my sister’s fall. So send healing vibes in the direction of the young lady, too, please. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2022, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/58 "2022-07-01T00:18:37Z")
Good news for her, and healing vibes all around. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2022, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/59 "2022-07-01T01:15:50Z")
I’m glad to hear that Amtrak is being supportive and that the news on your sister is positive - no spinal cord injury is very good! I’ll keep her and the young lady in my thoughts. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2022, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990/60 "2022-07-01T04:45:27Z")
TYVM for the update. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/amtrak-train-southwest-chief-has-derailed-near-kansas-city-2022-06-27/966990.md?page=4)